TIGSource Forums

He accidentally left the .mfa file in the KS 1.2 Beta download, and seems to be taking his mistake in his stride pretty well (probably better than I would had I made a comparable mistake).

It, along with the beta (that now supports custom animated objects), can be downloaded here:
http://nifflas.ni2.se/forum/index.php?topic=7399.0

Niff also created this thread on his forums for any mod related activity, as he's worried about level compatibility getting messed up (eg. levels that work with different modded versions ending up on the same list, leading to confusion):
http://nifflas.ni2.se/forum/index.php?topic=7401.0

Come to think of it, this could be really good for the Knytt Online project and KSDS.  I know in KSDS's case there were some issues with getting the run speed right, and the source should solve any mysteries about it.

The source, EH?  I would really like to see how Nifflas makes games in Multimedia Fusion without them getting corrupted  :biglaff:

Ouch, that's got to be annoying.

The compatibility thing shouldn't have been an issue if he'd designed his level format with a bit of care. He must have known he'd update it or people would extend it eventually.

Hmm?  If people are making serious modifications to the source, added in lots of extra shit, there's not really much one can do beyond *maybe* having a versioning system, and even then *that* relies on other people respecting that system.  Or...am I missing something?  (I've spent some time this morning changin the level format for something I'm working on (boost::serialize made it a delight...), so I'm quite interested).

Yes, well it would rely on other people respecting the system, but yes, versioning is the sort of thing I had in mind. It's not like people are maliciously modding the game, I'm sure they'd respect knytt if he asked them to prepare their mods in a certain way.
Just a list of strings for features required would be enough, the modded game could check that against it's own list. I don't know knytt's file format, but I'm guessing it is not possible to add an extra line to do that without breaking the old levels, or else he would have just declared that so.
You should always consider forward compatibility when designing levels, as it takes so little effort to leave space for extras later. This is why I'm fond of XML for my level files, it's namespace system is designed for people to add their own arbitrary bits onto your own scheme.

It's not that I think people would maliciously mod the game, it's just that either people would be:

A. Too lazy to respect a version control system.

B. Too stupid to understand a version control system.

C. So arrogant they think everyone should be using their hacked together, game-breaking features anyway.

D. Some dangerous combination of all three.

Seriously, have you seen developers?

Well, I dunno. It really comes down to the developers opinion to me. Toribash and Dwarf Fortress have both benefited from modding, although both cases are admittedly only specific sections of code that you can mod. Releasing the entire source could be dangerous.

If he wants to avoid it, he could just release the next version with a specific piece that won't run the game if any core variables have been changed.

I remember when only specific people had access to the betas. :'(

Did you see what happened with Gang Garrison 2 during the demakes competition? Utter madness.

It's only a matter of time before someone adds guns to Knytt. :(

1.1 IS THE TRUE VERSION OF KS, FOLKS.
YOU HEARD IT HERE FIRST.

KS attracted a lot of morons to the Nifforums. I don't post there anymore because it was just getting too stupid.

What's the difference between 1.2 and earlier versions? Is it worth replaying for the changes?

Oh man, this is kind of awesome.

Is somebody going to tell us, or are we going to keep quoting this? :durr:

I don't know.

I'm pretty sure that it changes nothing about the levels already made, but, rather, incorporates new features to the level editor.

Nifflas accidentally the whole thing.

Yes.

If you all went to the Niff forums you'd all know, but I'll just fill you in:

It adds custom animated objects, however in this build they are fixed in place and non-interactive, so like the waterfalls in KS.  Further builds will add more functionality to these objects making them into more fully featured entities.

I'm actually quite exited about this, as I think animated objects add a lot to atmosphere; the grass swaying in the breeze in Knytt Nano for instance.

And I still haven't made a Knytt Stories level. Man.

Same here...I really need to get around to that, especially since I have a cool concept for one.

 :D

It's times like this you, as an MMF user, should be freakishly happy xerus.  Being a GM user this means almost nothing to me, yet I'm really curious about how he did a lot of that game, and were I an MMF user I think I'd be incredibly happy right about now.

I guess the equivalent for me would be Cactus accidentally letting us download the GM sources for most of his games; I'd be so bloody happy if that happened, as there are lots of cool things he's done with GM that I'd like to know the details on.