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[Reiss]

GOBLIN TREASURE

    


POST-COMPO VERSION, updated 1/12/2010.  Play this one for more fun and more feedback, play the compo version below to vote.  

Arrows to move, WASD to attack, Q to switch weapons, X to advance dialogue and grab blocks.  M to view the map.

UPDATES:

• Goblins have more health.
• Goblins can appear in swarms.  Since goblins can block you in, swarms can be dangerous -- if they close you in on all sides, they'll slaughter you, even with full health.
• Goblins don't regenerate -- once you've killed them, they stay dead.
• Your sword does less damage, and you can hold fewer arrows.
• Your sword speed is capped now, so mashing WASD won't make you a whirling ball of death.
• Groups of goblins can appear in boss rooms and in puzzle rooms.  Eyes won't shoot at them on their own, but if you lure the eyes into shooting at you and dodge the beam, it can kill goblins in one hit.
• Bosses can also accidentally hurt goblins, although they don't insta-kill them.  Goblins can be lured into hurting each other.
• Bosses attack a lot more slowly.

FLASH COMPO VERSION, 1/10/2010.  Arrows to move, WASD to attack, Q to switch weapons, X to advance dialogue and grab blocks.  M to view the map.

The game's a Flixel-based dungeon crawler that tries to feel like a roguelike/zelda mashup.  You can win, but the game's still pretty unfinished -- I plan on finishing it after the compo.  I'd definitely appreciate any feedback or comments...

ASSETS:

• oryx // spritesheets
• Oddball // cursor
• oneup // font
• Aaron P. // music
• Saros // music
• cheapshot // music
• feeblethemighty // sfx

[ORIGINAL POST]

I've been working on this for a little over a week...  I decided not to start a thread until I actually had something to show, in case I gave up or ran out of ideas.  Right now it's really only an ultra pared down dungeon generator, with movement, collision detection + a few bugs, but I'm aiming hopefully by the middle of next week to have it more finished.

THE PLAN:  a dungeon crawler in Flash that feels like roguelike/zelda mashup -- by which I mean, a procedurally-generated dungeon crawler with some basic puzzles, and a basic money and shop system in which you'll be able to buy arrows/swords/arrowswordupgrades.  I'm using Oryx's sprites and tiles, Oddball's mouse cursor, oneup's "Elegante Pixel" font, and (eventually) music from cheapshot, Aaron P, and Saros.

By the way, if you guys don't mind, if you run across any bugs like this:

(note the inaccessible corridor, graphical oddities), mind posting about them here?  Still trying to track down what caused that particular one.  And if you get to the end of a corridor and the message "A DARK ABYSS STRETCHES FOR AN ETERNITY..." pops up, that would definitely be bad -- it means something went wrong and the corridor connects to nowhere.

Suggestions/thoughts about the game as it is?  I could use a good name suggestion, if anyone has any ideas.

DEADLINES/MILESTONES:

• movement/collision/basic room generation -- done?  Still a few bugs now and then.
• map -- done for now, although I'll have to update it when the game is capable of generating multiple floors.
• more interesting dungeons, with puzzles -- semi-done.  Block-pushing puzzles are in, more puzzles on their way.
• basic combat + rudimentary enemy ai -- Wednesday.
• money/shop system -- Thursday?  hoo boy.  Maybe.
• bare semblance of a story + polish + bugfixing -- JANUARY TENTH.

[oryx]

Very cool, simple so far obviously but the presentation feels really nice - the sliding dialog at the bottom, the clean interface - keep going! 

[SirNiko]

Looks good to start. Runs nicely, and I didn't see any glitches I could identify.

Having to hammer the arrows constantly to move was a little tiring, it'd be nice if I could hold a direction to keep moving.

I like the method of bumping into the monsters to kill them. Reminds me of Ys and DRoD and a bit.

-SirNiko

[racter]

Lookin good!  So are the dungeons being generated procedurally now?  The rooms hooked together very well, it seems to be working

I kind of wish I could get the DARK ABYSS STRETCHES FOR AN ETERNITY...

[Reiss]

Thanks for the responses, guys!

UPDATES:
-map implemented -- press M to bring up the map.  It doesn't use anyone's graphics, but it's generated at runtime and it's pretty simple, so it should be fine by the compo rules...
-much better room generation, bugfixes.
-I'm using Oddball's mouse cursor for the title screen now.

Updated demo link here, and in the first post.

Lookin good!  So are the dungeons being generated procedurally now?  The rooms hooked together very well, it seems to be working

Haha, yup, the dungeons are already being generated procedurally.  Hopefully now with the map it should be more obvious!  Since the individual dungeon rooms still all look kind of same-y now (and they did earlier too), getting a feel for how the place was put together without it was pretty difficult.

Edit: that said, right now for testing purposes the first room isn't being procedurally generated.  The rest of the rooms in the dungeon are, though.  Eventually...

Looks good to start. Runs nicely, and I didn't see any glitches I could identify.

Having to hammer the arrows constantly to move was a little tiring, it'd be nice if I could hold a direction to keep moving.

I like the method of bumping into the monsters to kill them. Reminds me of Ys and DRoD and a bit.

-SirNiko

I was going back and forth on whether to keep that as a combat mechanic -- I guess now I will.  And yeah, I hear you about the arrow-hammering thing...  I tried a few different hold-direction-to-move solutions, but the ones I tried made the controls feel weirdly loose -- I think it was because the character moves in jumps, instead of smoothly, and I'm not used to designing around that kind of motion.  I have a few more ideas I haven't tried yet, so hopefully it'll make it into one of the next few builds.  If anyone has any suggestions for how to do it, feel free to post them here.

Very cool, simple so far obviously but the presentation feels really nice - the sliding dialog at the bottom, the clean interface - keep going!  

Thanks dude -- nice art!

[Mikademus]

Good foundation for a game. Looks crisp and charming. I think the minimalistic design and feature set might make for a very nice game. Respawning monsters too might actually be quite fun and tactical from an exploration perspective, especially if there's some kind of underlying mechanics that prevents you from exploiting it for XP grinding. I have to agree with that repeatedly hitting keys to move gets really annoying very fast, it must be addressed or, frankly put, at least I will never play this game again. Looking forward to seeing your progress on this game!

[Reiss]

I was going to wait for a dungeon-generation update to post, but it sounds like the movement issue was pretty bad.  Here's a link to a build with better movement.  Hammering the keys is out -- surprising how much code it took to get movement to feel good.

I'm not sure whether the movement speed right now is too fast or too slow: probably won't be able to really tell until more actual gameplay is implemented.

Good foundation for a game. Looks crisp and charming. I think the minimalistic design and feature set might make for a very nice game. Respawning monsters too might actually be quite fun and tactical from an exploration perspective, especially if there's some kind of underlying mechanics that prevents you from exploiting it for XP grinding.

Yeah, what I've been thinking of lately is having monsters respawn, but making trap and puzzle solving persistent.  I'm on the fence now as to whether bosses should respawn or not -- most games probably wouldn't have them respawn, but you do have a point that it could be fun and tactical.

[Mikademus]

I was going to wait for a dungeon-generation update to post, but it sounds like the movement issue was pretty bad.  Here's a link to a build with better movement.  Hammering the keys is out -- surprising how much code it took to get movement to feel good.

Better, but it is still much faster to bash keys than hold them. You probably need to up the repeat rate to at least two or three times the present value.

[SirNiko]

Movement in the new build is way better. I wouldn't fiddle with speed until there's some gameplay to base it on.

Respawning bosses are typically bad unless you get a reward for killing the boss each time, and then that just boils the game down to grinding, which tends to be pretty uninspired design.

Probably, you should create some basic quest widgets (keys and locked doors), create some varied enemies (methods of attack, maybe some evade you and require catching) and create some tools to collect and use (arrows, proximity mines). Make the focus of the game be non-random puzzles that are scattered randomly around the dungeon during creation. Once the basic gameplay is down, you just spend the rest of the compo generating as many unique puzzle rooms as possible that get scattered around the dungeon, so that even after 100 plays, the player still gets to see new puzzle rooms they didn't see before. A pushblock puzzle, one where you catch an evasive foe, a boss fight room, a room with lava tiles, a riddle room, etc. Just lots of Zelda-style puzzles, but they're randomly arranged in true rogue-like fashion.

-SirNiko

[Reiss]

UPDATES:
-two new maps.  You start in THE STEEL FORTRESS, to the west are THE PITS, and to the north is GOBLINTOWN.  If I have time during the few days I marked down for polish/in case I missed deadlines (which I now have, since puzzles were supposed to be in by today), I'll make this procedurally generated -- for now, how they connect is procedural, but where they are in physical relation to each other is not.
-the goblins, unfortunately, are gone for now.  I took them out as I was working on puzzle and enemy placement algorithms.
-the game now keeps track of where you've explored.  Unexplored areas are displayed on the map in black, explored areas in light gray.
-trapdoors and switches are in.  Right now, there's an open trapdoor blocking each exit in every room, and a switch on either side of the trapdoor to close it.
-sped up the movement a bit, for exploring purposes -- I might bring it back down once there's more actual gameplay.

Link is here and at the top, although if you've played the earlier builds, you might want to wait until I'm done with the puzzle and enemy-placement algorithm.  There's not much more to do in this one, it's just slightly more interesting.

Better, but it is still much faster to bash keys than hold them.

Movement in the new build is way better. I wouldn't fiddle with speed until there's some gameplay to base it on.

Thanks guys.  I don't think bashing keys should actually be faster -- the first keypress starts a timer, and further keypresses won't register until the timer's up.  I got tired of waiting while exploring during bugtesting, though, so I sped it up a little.  I'll fiddle with it more once there's more to do.

[saluk]

The speed seems just about right to me. If you slow it down any, it will feel sluggish. The marking off of the map works well, and how you used the trapdoor to test it is clever.

[oryx]

Is the trapdoor that closes when you get near it supposed to be a door opening?

[Reiss]

MAJOR UPDATES:

Puzzles:

• The beginnings of combat and puzzle generation are in.
• Right now, only block-pushing puzzles are generated.  To grab a block, walk into it while holding X.  Keep holding X to push or pull the block.  You can only push and pull blocks -- you can't slide and drag them alongside you.
• In most rooms, there are two triggers in the center of the floor.  You have to push the block onto one and stand on the other for the trapdoors to close and to be able to exit the room.
• Once closed, trapdoors stay closed, even after you exit the room.  There are triggers to close individual trapdoors on the far side of each trapdoor, so that you can always enter a room, and always leave the way you came.

Combat:

• Enemy eyes now appear in rooms.  If you cross the dotted red line that represents their line of sight, they'll shoot lasers.  A laser takes off one heart of health, and importantly, destroys blocks if it touches them.
• The goblins are back, in rooms without puzzles.  They'll eventually appear in puzzle rooms, too.
• To kill either eyes or goblins, just walk into them.  For the goblins, who don't yet fight back, it basically doesn't matter how you do this, but obviously try to walk into the eyes from outside of their line of sight!
• The eyes are slower than the player.  You can (just barely) run across their line of sight without getting hurt.  Don't hang out there, though, because they'll shoot if you're too slow.
• The player character slows down while pushing and pulling blocks.  If you're pushing/pulling a block, you won't be able to make it across an eye's line of sight without getting shot, or without getting the block shot.
• If you fail a room (the block gets destroyed), don't worry -- blocks (and eyes) regenerate whenever you leave the room.
• If you die, the game ends, and takes you to a death screen.  This hopefully won't stay, but I guess permadeath is in the roguelike tradition...

Link as usual is here and at the top.  There might be a few new bugs.  Post if you find any!

Is the trapdoor that closes when you get near it supposed to be a door opening?

Yup, serves the same function.  In the old build, you could always close the trapdoors and exit the room, because there were triggers placed on either side -- in the new build, in most rooms there's a block puzzle you have to solve to close the trapdoors.

The speed seems just about right to me. If you slow it down any, it will feel sluggish. The marking off of the map works well, and how you used the trapdoor to test it is clever.

Thanks.  I actually ended up slowing the movement down a tiny bit (not nearly as slow as it was originally), but I think it feels better now because of the combat.  It felt just slightly too fast once the eyes were in, and I'd sometimes accidentally run into their lines of sight without meaning to.


What do you guys think of the updates?  I feel alright about how pushing works, but it feels a little on the counterintuitive side to walk into the block, and then pull in the opposite direction.  I'm also not planning on having so many rooms involve block puzzles -- definitely more combat, once more of it's implemented.  Any suggestions?

EDIT:  Almost forgot to mention this, but I cheated a little.  The line of sight and the laser weren't made by anyone, and unlike the map, aren't generated by code.  They're so close to Oryx's stuff, and they're simple enough so that it's not impossible to believe that they're generated by code, so I don't feel too terrible about it.  If I have time during the polish stage though, I'll take the PNG's out and replace them with code-generated bitmaps.  I guess for now I'm adhering to a Pencerkoff-esque "if you're generally keeping with the intent of the art, it's okay" interpretation of the compo rules.

[Reiss]

Well, I missed a few deadlines, but the game's been coming along.  Link is here and at the top.

UPDATES

• There should be fewer block puzzle rooms per map now.
• Block pushing itself has been changed -- just press X when you're near a block, and you automatically grab it.  Moving towards it pushes, moving away from it pulls.  Much easier.  Also, blocks become highlighted while you're grabbing onto them.
• The goblins now have pathfinding, and will follow you around levels.  They still won't attack, but that shouldn't be hard to put in at this point...
• Bosses are in, sort of.  Special boss rooms are distributed around maps, and boss characters appear in them.  They have pathfinding as well -- however, for the moment, they're unkillable.  Tomorrow I'm going to implement a health system for enemies (and also an attack system), and then bosses will be killable.  There's a weird bug with bosses right now -- when you exit and reeneter a room, the boss changes.  Should be fixed by the next build.
• Eyes now squeeze shut before shooting, and their line of sight disappears.  Goblins aren't appearing in puzzle rooms yet, but technically the lasers from the eyes will kill them.  Eyes don't shoot at goblins by themselves, though -- you'll have to run across their line of sight, and lure the goblins into the resulting beam.  Since the eyes are closed while shooting, and "can't see," they'll "accidentally" fry the goblins.

BUGFIXES

• Triggers in the puzzle rooms essentially acted differently in the previous build than they had in earlier builds -- they all changed colors at the same time when you solved the block puzzle, instead of only changing color when you exited through a specific door.  The code itself didn't change, but earlier not all of the triggers in the rooms had been linked: only triggers by the same exit were linked, and so they only changed color when you walked out of the specific door they were near.  That meant that the color was a visual indicator of which areas had been explored, one that didn't require you to open the map: after the puzzle-generation build, they no longer performed that function.  Now though, they only change color once you've already walked over them, so they (once again) act as visual markers of where you've been in the level.
• The lines-of-sight from the eyes didn't at first glance appear to have gaps: however, the algorithm generating them would only place one line-of-sight piece down per tile, meaning that if two lines of sight crossed, only one eye could see you.  Worse, if you killed the eye that could see you, there was an obvious gap in the line of sight of the other eye, since the algorithm hadn't bothered to place any line-of-sight pieces down for it where it had previously crossed the dead eye's line of sight.  This is fixed, and all eyes can see you where they logically should be able to.

At this point, the money/shop system is probably going to get cut from the compo build.  Depends how fast the rest of enemy combat gets done...

[Reiss]

COMPO VERSION FINISHED!

My laptop died and deleted a fairrrly important Actionscript file, and I spent a bunch of today recreating it.  That said:

• Combat's in.  WASD to attack.  Q to switch weapons -- WASD shoots arrows, too.
• Bosses are in.
• Enemies + bosses pathfind and attack.
• You can win.
• Music + sound is in.

That said, this version is really, really incomplete.  I'm gonna keep working on it post-compo, although at a slightly less frenzied rate...  Any feedback or suggestions would be really appreciated!  A lot of this stuff wasn't in any of the previous builds, so there's some seriously untested mechanics going on.

EDIT:  whoa, huge bug because I forgot a line of that file.  Fixed, lucky I caught that before midnight...

EDIT TWO:  guh forgot a credits screen.  Comes after the win screen now.

[Loren Schmidt]

I'm just sitting down to play a few of the competition games. Yours seems really neat, I think there's some good material here. But (like mine) it could have used more time! If you invent a time machine, please let me know.

[Reiss]

Oh god, tell me about it.  Thanks though, I played a couple of the versions of Tiny Crawl earlier in development, and they were really good.  I feel like we had some similar ideas, and I liked what you did with them -- I think you got farther than I did, although the deadline seems like it slapped both of our games pretty hard.  I'll write more in your thread, but keep going!

[Reiss]

Extreme tuning update, particularly focusing on the goblins.  Link to the post-compo build is here and in the first post.  The swarming goblins should actually be hard now...  And the bossfights shouldn't be just shooting fish in a barrel, with some lone slow-moving boss pathetically and inevitably succumbing to arrow shots.

UPDATES:

• Goblins have more health.
• Goblins can appear in swarms.  Since goblins can block you in, swarms can be dangerous -- if they close you in on all sides, they'll slaughter you, even with full health.
• Goblins don't regenerate -- once you've killed them, they stay dead.
• Your sword does less damage, and you can hold fewer arrows.
• Your sword speed is capped now, so mashing WASD won't make you a whirling ball of death.
• Groups of goblins can appear in boss rooms and in puzzle rooms.  Eyes won't shoot at them on their own, but if you lure the eyes into shooting at you and dodge the beam, it can kill goblins in one hit.
• Bosses can also accidentally hurt goblins, although they don't insta-kill them.  Goblins can be lured into hurting each other.
• Bosses attack a lot more slowly.

I also moved the four basic areas (THE STEEL FORTRESS, GOBLINTOWN, THE PITS, THE CRYSTAL PALACE) around a little, because due to some uh... inadequacies in the map-connection algorithm, you generally only had two go through 2-3 rooms per map to reach the final, one-room, ending map.

Basically I've been trying to make the combat focus more on swordplay -- in the compo version, any boss can be defeated by a combination of a) running away, and b) firing arrows behind you.  Which wasn't a really great combat mechanic, especially because the number of arrows you started with was ludicrously high.  

No ranged enemies in the game yet...  I'm not sure if I'm going to ever put them in normal rooms, because the rooms are starting to feel a little cramped as it is.  Some bosses might have ranged attacks, later.

For the next update -- maybe this weekend -- I'm gonna focus on improving the map.  It adds a nice element to the game if you know where the heart-refill/arrow-refill rooms are, and acts as an incentive for pushing through the tougher rooms.  I've been using the fact that I know how the dungeons are put together to seek out heart refill rooms when I'm low on health, but without that meta-information, it's pretty unclear just from looking at the map which rooms are which.

[Oddball]

Liked: Easy to get straight into the action. Simple gameplay which also allowed for some tactical play.

Disliked: A little too easy. Needs a bit more variety in the enemies, and the rock dragging mechanic could have been explored a lot more.

Conclusion: A steady entry, but could have done with a bit of expanding.