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876988 Posts in 32842 Topics- by 24283 Members - Latest Member: gildabq52

May 18, 2013, 09:09:38 AM
TIGSource ForumsDeveloperCreativeDangerous or not?
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saimo
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« on: February 20, 2010, 04:31:47 AM »

An idea occurred to me and I can't decide whether it's good or not Huh?
I'd be glad to hear your opinion about it.

Have a look at this picture:



The area occupied by those entangled rays represents a field where only the enemies can walk. It isn't dangerous to the player (in fact, if you look at the map in the lower-right corner, you can see that the area is marked in gray, whereas the lava pool - which *is* dangerous - is marked in red).
Now, the idea is: what if I made also that kind of areas dangerous (the practical effect would be that the player's shield would suffer a 1% hit)? I guess that would enrich the gameplay slightly but, on the other hand, it would also increase the difficulty a little.
I'm hesitating because generally people find the game difficult. What would you say?
« Last Edit: February 20, 2010, 05:54:02 AM by saimo » Logged
increpare
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« Reply #1 on: February 20, 2010, 04:38:19 AM »

Ah, I'm looking at this out of context. So making this hurt you won't necessarily result in an increase in difficulty, and if it does you can decrease the difficulty of other things.  How awkward is it to navigate around the edge these rooms?  Will enemies try to pull you in to the centres?
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saimo
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« Reply #2 on: February 20, 2010, 05:10:03 AM »

Ah, I'm looking at this out of context. So making this hurt you won't necessarily result in an increase in difficulty,  and if it does you can decrease the difficulty of other things.

Difficulty increases because the player has to pay attention not to step on those areas, whereas before he could just rely on the fact that the character would automatically slide along the edges, as if against a wall.
As for making some other aspect easier, that's something I wouldn't touch both because I like the current balancement and because the missions have been designed keeping such balancement into account.

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How awkward is it to navigate around the edge these rooms?

The controls themselves are very simple (left/right to rotate, up to run forwards, down to walk backwards) and responsive, so controlling the character is easy in general (if you want, you can try yourself with the demo).
What has most importance is the layout of those areas... mmm, now that I think of it, the current missions aren't particularly problematic in that sense and the tiling engine is such that there's always a good deal of room for movement - f.ex., consider this other picture:



the acid pools are dangerous, but there are always at least 16 pixels of safe room (look at the sides close to the pipes).
Mmm... maybe I'm just being overly cautious Roll Eyes

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Will enemies try to pull you in to the centres?

Good question. Simple answer: no Wink
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AndrewFM
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« Reply #3 on: February 20, 2010, 05:58:54 AM »

Well, if an enemy was walking on there, I think the player's natural inclination would be to get as close to the edge of the region as possible, and wait for the enemy to come into range of an attack. So making it hurt you might be a little sadistic Tongue

On the other hand, 1% damage doesn't sound that bad, so perhaps it's not a big deal.
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saimo
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« Reply #4 on: February 20, 2010, 06:12:01 AM »

Well, if an enemy was walking on there, I think the player's natural inclination would be to get as close to the edge of the region as possible, and wait for the enemy to come into range of an attack. So making it hurt you might be a little sadistic Tongue

Ah, yes, in that case the change wouldn't be good. But, luckily, the player has a long-range weapon, whereas enemies can only physicaly charge him Wink

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On the other hand, 1% damage doesn't sound that bad, so perhaps it's not a big deal.

Yeah... maybe I'm really being just overly cautious...
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SirNiko
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« Reply #5 on: February 20, 2010, 10:26:13 AM »

From a static screen shot, the 'rays' area doesn't seem dangerous. If the rays are jumping around like electricity, I would think otherwise.

Is this a regular obstacle in your game? If so, the easiest way is to make a 'tutorial' area that teaches you simply how the rays work: have the player enter the room, and they see the monsters crossing the rays, but notice they cannot cross back. Once that room establishes how the rays work, the player will understand them in later levels.

The lava and the acid seem self-explanatory, especially if the bubbles are appropriately animated.

-SirNiko
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saimo
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« Reply #6 on: February 20, 2010, 10:35:02 AM »

From a static screen shot, the 'rays' area doesn't seem dangerous. If the rays are jumping around like electricity, I would think otherwise.

Yes, they're animated just like you say.

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Is this a regular obstacle in your game? If so, the easiest way is to make a 'tutorial' area that teaches you simply how the rays work: have the player enter the room, and they see the monsters crossing the rays, but notice they cannot cross back. Once that room establishes how the rays work, the player will understand them in later levels.

The screenshot is precisely from a tutorial-like mission (included also in the demo): the map structure is completely linear, so that the player can fully concentrate on the elements he meets along the way Smiley

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The lava and the acid seem self-explanatory, especially if the bubbles are appropriately animated.

Yes, they're animated as well.
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WreckSector
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« Reply #7 on: February 20, 2010, 02:45:14 PM »

Is it possible it might be confusing if enemies can walk in that area without consequence, but the player suffers damage? 
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saimo
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« Reply #8 on: February 20, 2010, 02:55:48 PM »

Is it possible it might be confusing if enemies can walk in that area without consequence, but the player suffers damage?  

Well, even if one doesn't want to read the documentation, the first time he/she tries to tread those areas will learn that not only it isn't possible, but also that it hurts. Since the graphics are very distinctive, it isn't a problem.
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saimo
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« Reply #9 on: February 22, 2010, 04:25:33 AM »

Discussing the issue convinced me that there was no real reason to worry... so the modification is done now!
Thanks everybody for sharing your thoughts Smiley
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Rob Lach
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« Reply #10 on: February 22, 2010, 04:25:40 PM »

This is clearly a problem that could be solved by playtesting.
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saimo
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« Reply #11 on: February 23, 2010, 03:03:42 AM »

This is clearly a problem that could be solved by playtesting.

Well, I tested the thing of course. I could also ask some of the users, but now I'm convinced that the change is so minimal that they wouldn't have any problem with it. I have also updated the demos (except for the MacOS one, because I don't have a Mac at hand Tongue), so anybody can try.
« Last Edit: February 23, 2010, 05:04:56 AM by saimo » Logged
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