next »

[baconman]

I guess this leaves two other things to really ponder on - the bonus minigames (of many varieties, including ones from fighters, ones from Zelda games, ones from DKC and Yoshi's Island, and typical (atypical) takes on things like Slot Machines... and the epic finale.

I kinda like what newer NeoGeo games did with it's multiple/variable boss approaches, and I'd like a "final destiny" kind of element to end the playable character phase, along with a few different ending chapters that go with it, but that's all still a bit up in the air. Maybe a really epic, difficult kind of encounter, followed (if successful) with a ultimately-fun "reward" kind of stage (but on explicit do-or-die terms... like the Extra/One More Extra Stages on DDR, sorta).

Then, you'll get one of three "types" of endings, based on the success rates of these stages. So your build-up determines which "last day" you get, and the ending you get (pretty much the whole "plot summary" for your character) then varies with your results. This also determines the epicness of their role as NPC's - for instance, if you're good enough to beat the overpowered fighter champ, then clearly your reflexes and habits will then make your character a formidable future-champ, right?

[baconman]

Making some headway on recoloring sprites, but I'm still unsure about aspect ratios involved in creating the critters, and the general pacing.

Most of the humanistic character-sprites and tiles are 48x48 (and most of the action should be smooth, but still ultimately half-tile based). A screen resolution of 720x480 px would give me screens of 15x10 tiles... definitively more horizontal, to allow for more anticipation, particularly in the Race'n'Chase scenes... but I still don't think 15 tiles is enough!? (To put it in perspective, most NES games run 16x15 tiles per screen.) Too much resolution (like 200%ing that?) could result in unnecessary choppiness, or it bleeding out of some monitors/pages, or result in teeny-tiny sprites (which I don't worry about, so much as all the wide open space that sort of thing would result in).

Currently, rather than simply going with screen-pasting, I think I'm going to construct screens by mashing two designed ones together, the spritey-elements overriding other ones, and then a seed-driven set of modifiers to adjust the result. Different levels will result in different screening layouts, usually about 20 or 30 screens apiece (debating). I'm also coinsidering making "these screens" actually twice as big as the game window (30x20 tile designs).

20-screen layouts:

10 wide, 2 high
7 wide, 3 high
5 wide, 4 high
4 wide, 5 high
3 wide, 7 high
2 wide, 10 high
(debatable: 1x20s or 20x1s)

30-screen layouts:

15 wide, 2 high
10 wide, 3 high
8 wide, 4 high
6 wide, 5 high
5 wide, 6 high
4 wide, 8 high
3 wide, 10 high
2 wide, 15 high
(1x30 or 30x1, possibly)

So...  

1. Considering the roles of the critters (page 1), about how big do you think they should be in comparison with the player characters?

2. Do you think a 15-tile-wide perspective is too narrow for a very action-oriented game, going for "about a MegaMan X level of pacing" to it? How many tiles of visual anticipation do you think a game like that should have?

3. Taking into consideration that gameplay is generally in threefold spurts, about how much time do you think you would enjoy playing solid, and how many screens do you think should work with that? (For reference, MegaMan levels/endless mode spurts are usually about 30, and IIRC, Spelunky is about 16, hence the range I'm considering.

4. Are there any problems you dev's might anticipate with the "combine two half-screens" approach that could not be overcome with the player's various capabilities? (Bear in mind, they will never "have none of them," and there's a few possible workarounds in the mix, too.)

[baconman]

More specifics on musical design scheme:

So most of the melodies in the game will be comprised by assigning a note to each value of a string, trimming the excess notes, and factoring in signature sounds (fun things to play)... given the variables-upon-variables approach, I figure this part doesn't need to be all too fancy... so for now, I have a few of the melodic sequences (that you're free to test on Blergo Beats, for now; they can combine and start anywhere on the scale, btw.

1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.
1.2.2.2.1.2.2.2.
1.1.1.1.2.2.3.3.
2.2.2.2.3.3.3.3.
1.1.2.2.3.3.4.4.
1.2.3.4.1.2.3.4.
4.3.2.3.2.1.2.3.
4.3.4.3.4.3.4.3.
2.3.4.3.2.3.4.3.
2.1.3.1.4.1.3.1.
4.4.2.2.3.3.2.2.
1.1.2.3.2.2.3.4.
2.1.2.3.4.2.3.4.
4.2.3.1.4.2.3.1.
(KB/Vox only, for now)
1.2.3.5.2.3.4.6.
2.2.3.3.4.4.5.6.
1.1.2.4.2.2.3.5.
1.2.3.4.3.4.5.6.
1.3.2.4.3.5.4.6.
1.6.5.4.3.4.5.6.
2.3.4.5.6.1.2.3.

Then the filtering process... basically roll a 6-sider, and remove that many notes in some consistent pattern throughout the first 3 measures; and roll it again for the fourth ones. Actually, I think each tune should do this twice, once for Lead/Vocals (same trimming pattern AND complimentary notes, for the most part), once for Rhythm/Bass/Drums (same trimming pattern, but different notes), with KB/DJ falling with one or the other... probably the lead, but it could go either way. Or having each "roll twice" and then alternate between the two trimming patterns, in more complex or faster-paced songs.

(Some examples of "3-trimming"):
xxxx x...
xx.x .xx.
x.x. xxx.
xxxx .x..
xxx. x.x.
xxxx ..x.
xx.x .x.x
x.xx .xx.

Now, for the fun moves; which will usually round out the bridges and the fourth measures/fillers somewhat, but occasionally may wind an entire verse together... (let me know if I'm missing any you like!)

GUITAR TRICKS:
The Boston Hammer (2321) in 1/24ths where appropriate, probably once per phrase or so...
Electric Slide 2-wide (2121212121212...)
Electric Slide 3-wide (3212321232123...)
Quick Slide (1234) or (4321)
Rhythmic Chords (plays a single chord per phrase, in trimmed musical timing)
Progressive Hammer Chords ([123].123.[123]... think Sultans of Swing, here)
Heavy Riffing (1/24 riffs, ala Painkiller's climax or much of Misirlou)
Tap-Note Insanity (plays 2x-compressed sets of tap-only notes)

(so far, Bass does NOT utilize open strums, fyi)

DRUM TRICKS:
Polyrhythm (111122334...)
Lead Food (more solid quarters w/ kicks)
Snare/Hi-Hat rolls (self-explanatory)
More Cowbell!! (more 3s factored in, basically)
Rhythmic Kicks (like Rhythmic Chords, but with the kick drum)
Drumwalking (12132434...)

KEYBOARD/DJ TRICKS:
Keywalking (21324354...)
Flutters (212121212121...)
Slides (4321)/(1234)
Progressive Chords (just like Guitar's)
Rhythmic Chords (just like Guitar's)
Rhythmic Scratching
Scratching Rolls
Chaotic Melody (akin to Tap-Note Insanity, but with KB, it's obvious what's up)

VOCALIST TRICKS:
Hold that note! (longer/more dramatic sustains)
Rap Speak (quick/broken speech)
Low Tide (do.re.do.re...)
High Tide (do.re.mi.re...)
Cheering (More vitrual tambourine/clapping action)
More Harmonies
*Higher Pitch (+2)
*Lower Pitch (-2)

*if you know of any better singer tricks, please suggest...

STEP DANCE TRICKS:
Jump Sequences (beats/notes)
Crossovers and Twists
Pivot-steps
Spins
Hold + Tapping sequences (beats/notes)
ZigZag runs
7-step spurt patterns
Double-runs (1212 3434 2323...)

MOTION DANCE TRICKS:
Opposite Pairs
Synchronized 180s
Waves
360 wheels
Slow Rolls
Fast Rolls


Feedback/Suggestions? (Including the posts above?)

[Zaratustra]

does this help you
http://zarat.us/olc

[baconman]

does this help you
http://zarat.us/olc

OmniLudiCron?!

OMFG, I REMEMBER THAT! I messed with it awhile about a year and a half ago... good times! I could build a couple of one-screeners, mostly by drag-and-drop, but is there a way to make room-to-room action or scrolling with it? (I have NO IDEA how I'd pull off the fighter aspect, without importing sprites and adjusting controls, however.) Or competing racers?

Heck, I might play around with it, just for kicks/inspiration. It's been a long time! As if I don't have enough excuse for procrastinating. I think what I'm going for here is similar in concept, but with some more PGC influence and variable critter influence (helpers/enemies). Even the musical aspect of the project could be concievable, with proper pacing/spawning and maybe some unique use of the paddle+sword, maybe. 8x8 tiles (not counting screencaps) is pretty limiting, though.

[baconman]

  I notice a lot of people here don't bother posting DevLogs until things are in an already-playable state... dunno if that's the norm, but I'm logging as much of the development process as possible, if nothing else, to give a point-to-point way of getting from idea to complete project. Or at least, that's what I'm hoping this amounts to!

Well, anyways... today I simply used my LiveJournal to make a list of the various actions, reactions, and AI that I *expect* to have to script for the humanistic characters. Also, there's a rule once you've been dev'ing and tinkering for awhile, that you take what you expect, multiply it by 250%, and that's about what it ends up amounting to.

So... that's where I'm at today. I'll probably take a break for a couple days, now - it's a good idea to do that every so often, things will "come to you" that you might not have thought about while you're grinding. Sometimes easy touch-ups, ways to fix things, or a method of simplifying code to make your project kick off quicker!

[mokesmoe]

I notice a lot of people here don't bother posting DevLogs until things are in an already-playable state... dunno if that's the norm, but I'm logging as much of the development process as possible, if nothing else, to give a point-to-point way of getting from idea to complete project. Or at least, that's what I'm hoping this amounts to!

There's really two types of Devlogs: People talking about the making of their game (You are this one) and people posting demos and explaining updates.

People like playing demos, but if your game is in a mostly prototype stage, the first one works just as well. To contrast, the standard platformer with a neat gimmick type games wouldn't work very well with the second.
A mix of both would probably be the best, but not all games are suited for both.

[baconman]

More designer-reminders, regarding the "Adventure" aspect of the game:

I think I WILL go with the vertically-offset columns of rooms idea, as the rooms approach will clearly differenciate it from the platformer/race'n'chase aspects. Wrapping the dungeon around the sides/top and bottom will allow it to assume just about any shape imaginable, so long as barriers are constructed through the center of "the design map." So the lower passage to the side of one room will enter you in the top-passage of the neighboring one, in almost a beehive-like pattern; and vertically neighboring rooms can be adjoined by staircases.

Each of the side-passages will also be open by default, then modified to be shut with locked doors, shutters, solid walls, or blastable walls. Also bear in mind, *most* of these openings WILL be bombable, but not necessarily lead to you anywhere you couldn't get normally, and the bombs themselves will be more uncommon - so they can be used, in conjunction with the compass, for instance, to open shortcuts (think right branch of LoZ's Level 3); or to discover otherwise-concealed treasure rooms (which simply is a horde of power-ups). So far, only the "outer perimiter" of the dungeon, and perhaps the walls surrounding bosses/exits/key items are planned to be "permanent," and even the key items/boss rooms are still "maybes."

Variables that will factor into the rooms' contents include sets of enemies (Zelda-inspired crowds of them) and perhaps Spelunky-inspired traps (like the Arrow/Idol traps) as well (maybe some switch-induced-damage-spikes, or a laser-like door-shutter and/or enemy-spawner effect, too). This may also include trap doors that will drop you down a room, some of which may be concealed intentionally with push-blocks.

Enemy groups include:
-3 of a kind
-7 of a kind
-10 of a kind
-2/type + 1/type + 1/type + (1/any of types)
-3/type + 2/type + 1/type + (1/any of types)
-4/type + 2/type + (1/either type)
-Boss/Senior
-2 of differing Boss/Seniors
-3 of same Boss/Senior

Doors include:
-Key locked
-Pushblock locked
-Battle/clear screen locked
-Whistle-locked
-Secret passage (foreground effect only)
-Concealed with bombable/destructable blocks

Some of these conditions, like pushblocks, will also result in items appearing.

The key system will likely be similar to FPS keycards, where there's one key that opens each of the color-corresponding doors; however the colors will randomize, so there's no obvious order to consistely go in. Clearly, there will be *some* minor pushblock puzzle-rooms to navigate through; but that will take a bit to produce correctly, yet keep interesting.

I'm also brainstorming for other interesting whistle effects, too; that may not have necessarily originated in the Zelda games, but not necessarily like, "turn this into PGC Aquaria," either.

Yes, I could tie in the musical-gaming and variable "signature sound" influence here, which I may in sound effects; but I don't think I'm gonna do that to the gameplay this time. "Full-circle" as that may be. Maybe in the anticipated follow-up to fine-tune and perfect the formula.


EDIT: This may also include the occasional, convoluted "pipeline room," a pipe-maze like feature that interconnects the different openings of the room in crazy directions, making dungeon-navigation more interesting and exciting. So you go in one way, it gives you a slight glimpse of it's twisty pipelines, and then spits you right out another side.

[baconman]

Basic tilework today, posted in the Creative - "What I Made Today" thread.

And I'm working on a name for the game, now. I was kind of leaning towards "T.I.G.E.R." and fitting it to something (The Infinite Game Endlessly Replayable; The Indie Gaming Enjoyment Resource), but not quite sold on it, yet. Suggestions?

[mokesmoe]

I think I.N.D.I.E. would be better, but it really depends on the best acronym you can come up with.

[Zaratustra]

G.A.M.E.

[baconman]

Well, it doesn't have to be an acronym... but those can potentially work. "Game About Multiple Evolutions" or "...Experiences" could work, for instance. Maybe "Gaming Around Many Evenings" or... something will click, I just gotta stop hammering it. I.N.D.I.E. is cool sounding indeed, but it's hard to wrap anything around... "Independent Non-Descriptive Infinite Exploration?" (Squeezing "Unlimited" in the title would make something like that "U.N.D.I.E." ...and "System" at the end would make it "U.N.D.I.E.S." Naah.)



A couple more trap and obstacle ideas sprung to mind... and the more I think about switches and springs being the same sprite, the more delightfully fun (and sometimes malicious) ideas I get...

[baconman]

Still tossing around name ideas. "i.G.A.M.E." is kinda there as well, but way too cliche right now. Close, but not quite "it." (EDIT: "i.M.A.G.E." maybe? As in, Indie/Infinite Multiple Adventure/Aspect Gaming Experience/Engine? That's really, really *painfully* close to what I'm thinking about...)

I've been thinking more about the "whistle implementation" of the adventure games, and I think I'm gonna ditch the keys idea, in favor of having a 3-tone "tune" screen, so you can take something like an enchanted guitar, and use it to enter "keysongs" that correspond with different symbols, which will then serve the basic purpose of the whistle AND the keys. One symbol = an entire songcode, not like "play these notes;" though there will also be a room in which you hit a switch and it will play the song/sequence for you, and illustrate the notes visually with them. (The three tones correspond with your J/K/L powers, wherever they're mapped to.)

The other cool kicker is that many of these tunes are ones that should be recognizable, and many others may be a homage to Bemani games. And that playing different (IE: wrong) tunes can result in other devious things, like setting off various traps; or occasionally a beneficial effect as well (but very rarely!). Later levels will introduce more/longer songcodes, but each game will only use 4 of them (maybe a 5th for a secret power or recover/once-per-day kind of code - but implicitly hidden). Some of the symbols (associated with hidden items/passages) will be considerably better-hidden than obvious ones needed to progress.

Here's a few samples of the tune-codes I have in mind, see if you can recognize a couple of them (1=low note, 3=high note):

1-1--2-3--2
1-2-3-1-1-1
1-3-2-1-3-21
3-2-1-23-32-1
21-1-21-2-3
33-233-13323
3-32-32-32-12---3
3232132123123
123--3-123--2-123--1
2323212-23212

(exact timing isn't essential btw, it's all about hitting the songcodes in the correct order)

[baconman]

There's a bit more progress on the song-adjustment code - the part that takes the 8-note strings and makes them more tunelike, but alas, I haven't enough time to elaborate on that now. The Waltz modifier may actually be an okay (or even better?) basis for the Blues mod, just changed around a bit in execution (more looping/quicker tempo), too. In fact, it's quite a busy week at work, so I'm probably down to about 4 hrs/day in off-time, with which to do other things like bathe and eat; and maybe play a little of something here and there. I'll probably post more about it later.
__________

In other notes, I'm also brainstorming and designing a few widgets for each region, and thinking of some obstacle arrangements to correspond with different powers. Earlier levels will usually use one of each, where later ones complexify them by sticking two or more elements together. I'm also looking into measuring characters' abilities (based on their powers), and having parts of them positioned strategically, so that later regions will have a less forgiving margin of error than earlier ones. So, in concrete, computable terms:

Zone 1 = 6 (= Margin of error, in half-tiles)
Zone 2 = 5
Zone 3 = 4
Zone 4 = 3
Zone 5 = 2

DeadZone = 1

This will mostly reflect in tricky jumps, for now, but I'm also looking into ways to incorporate other powers into that kind of thing, too. Like with moving platforms, for instance: a moving plat in zone 4 will stop/reverse an entire tile further away than in zone 2.

I'd love to go into further detail about that too, but again - kinda pressed for time right now. So I'll leave it at that.


Suggestions?

[baconman]

Alrighty, been awhile since last posting. Hard week of working a lot ate up a good bit of time (and d/l'ing and playing some of the cool new titles here ate some more! But it was so worth it).

Got about 10 (5M/5F) of the NeoSprites semi-colorized for now, at least as far as flesh tones go. And then I noticed one... no, two... no, actually FOUR... more are already there, practically. So now, the odds are tipped in the guys direction a bit (they were Rick, Krauser, Zangief, and Yamazaki). I suppose it'll work for an alpha build, and I can always fill in a few more chickadees as I go.

CURRENT SPRITE-LIKENESS LINEUP: Akuma - M.Bison - Guile - Krauser - Kyo - Rick - Evil Ryu - Yamazaki - Zangief - Athena - Chun-Li - Felicia - Leona - Mai ...hopefully balanced better soon! Billy Kane and Whip being possibly considered too, but that's a maybe for now.__________

And so, the hard part begins. Deciding on a finalized engine, and BEGINNING THE CODE. (Or the initial engine-tweaking.)

  ... ... ...


SNAP OUT OF IT. It's just typing.

-Gameplay/Room logic is in place.
-Design of widgets and gameplay tricks is done, too. Even math involved in placing most of them!
-Plenty of resources to work with... maybe minus sound.
^ ^{Can't be that hard to fix that, and that's all part of the music-game-related coding now, anyways. And I think I know how I'm doing that, too!}

After poking around a few of the IDEs (in some cases, "WTFs"), I'm thinking maybe I'm gonna stick with GameMaker, just to start with. At least I KINDA know what I'm doing with that... but it's gonna suck trying to recreate GML events in other languages if I do that, however. GRR.