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[Chris Z]

On the topic of comments, YouTube is a fucking cesspool so I'm not surprised at all.  Compare them to the comments on Vimeo, it's like night and day.

[im9today]

On the topic of comments, YouTube is a fucking cesspool so I'm not surprised at all.  Compare them to the comments on Vimeo, it's like night and day.

when i retreat to the realm of people just like me i usually find the conditions much more hospitable also

[thatshelby]

Speaking of YT comments, are there any FF add-ons that block them?

[DavidCaruso]

I'm not personally offended by it or anything, but yeah I think it's really really dumb to compare making videogames under probably less stress than real designers (since no publishers breathing down neck, less hard-set deadlines, etc.) to being in a concentration camp undergoing physical torture. Kind of an insult to Holocaust victims in fact. (Not to mention any other victims of concentration camps, e.g. in Rwanda, Darfur, etc.)

But I don't think the people criticizing the trailer are doing so solely because of that one quote. It's because the trailer makes all these guys seem like a bunch of self-absorbed hippies. You've got Blow talking about how he "took all his weaknesses" and put them in Braid, and McMillen saying how he wants to communicate Very Deep Emotional Feelings through games because he doesn't want to interact with people. You've got the overly dramatic and indulgent presentation (I still can't get over that footage of Phil Fish jumping in a pool, glasses still on). This doesn't exactly help shake the public perception that these "indie" developers are pretentious hipsters who only care about A.R.T. Cultural Legitimacy Points and circlejerking; in fact, this propagates it. And it's probably also because, while these indie designers are getting high-quality professional-looking documentaries made about them, interviews with some of the best game designers of the past are being relegated to webcam-quality Youtube shows. (Also because they aren't interviewing Konjak the best indie dev, why would they do this.)

[im9today]

Speaking of YT comments, are there any FF add-ons that block them?

i think there's an add-on called 'thin skin', google it and it should come right up

[dEnamed]

You've got to realize that in America the holocaust is ancient history. We don't have living connections to it like you do.

Fair point. The backlash is probably really a result of cultural differences. Like C.A. Sinclair said, I'm from Germany and the WW2 is still a pretty hot topic around here. Germany for example recently (about 3-4 years ago) had a "National Stolz" debate, discussing whether it's okay to be "german", given the history of the nation. Thus, my reaction might indeed be a cultural one.

After gaining a bit of distance and letting it rest for a couple of minutes, I also believe that he meant no ill by that comment. But that's because I've seen some of his stuff already and know that's just how he rolls.
In fact, I don't think it should be removed from the movie, yet it shouldn't have been in the Trailer either. You really do need prior experience (wrong word perhaps, sorry) about Edmund to know how he meant that. Yes, it's honest they didn't cut it out.
And I guess the movie will provide that background, simply by showing how Edmund acts, talks and behaves. However from the Trailer alone, people don't know that and while it is true that people shouldn't judge things based on a small snippet, this was in the trailer. The trailer however is meant to represent the product. And as such this small comment without bad intent, has twisted the otherwise interesting trailer into what it is now.

/edited some wordings

[peanutbuttershoes]

"OH MY GOD EDMUND SAID SOMETHIN HOLOCAUSTS! HE MUS HATE JEWS! OR NOT UNDERSTAND THEIR PAIN!
OR HE"S A NAZI AND HE THINKS ITS FUNNY!"

No. please don't. go away. I'm fairly sure no one on these forums was actually in a concentration camp and therefore, should not take offense.
It's not your job to be offended for your family either.

The world has to frickin heal sometime.

The movie looks like it'll be interesting at least. I enjoy listening to Edmund's childhood stuff, and Fish is a character (like him or not).

I probably won't be buying it though because my money has other, more important uses.

[im9today]

"OH MY GOD EDMUND SAID SOMETHIN HOLOCAUSTS! HE MUS HATE JEWS! OR NOT UNDERSTAND THEIR PAIN!
OR HE"S A NAZI AND HE THINKS ITS FUNNY!"

No. please don't. go away. I'm fairly sure no one on these forums was actually in a concentration camp and therefore, should not take offense.
It's not your job to be offended for your family either.

The world has to frickin heal sometime.

The movie looks like it'll be interesting at least. I enjoy listening to Edmund's childhood stuff, and Fish is a character (like him or not).

I probably won't be buying it though because my money has other, more important uses.

I'm not personally offended by it or anything, but yeah I think it's really really dumb to compare making videogames under probably less stress than real designers (since no publishers breathing down neck, less hard-set deadlines, etc.) to being in a concentration camp undergoing physical torture. Kind of an insult to Holocaust victims in fact. (Not to mention any other victims of concentration camps, e.g. in Rwanda, Darfur, etc.)

But I don't think the people criticizing the trailer are doing so solely because of that one quote. It's because the trailer makes all these guys seem like a bunch of self-absorbed hippies. You've got Blow talking about how he "took all his weaknesses" and put them in Braid, and McMillen saying how he wants to communicate Very Deep Emotional Feelings through games because he doesn't want to interact with people. You've got the overly dramatic and indulgent presentation (I still can't get over that footage of Phil Fish jumping in a pool, glasses still on). This doesn't exactly help shake the public perception that these "indie" developers are pretentious hipsters who only care about A.R.T. Cultural Legitimacy Points and circlejerking; in fact, this propagates it. And it's probably also because, while these indie designers are getting high-quality professional-looking documentaries made about them, interviews with some of the best game designers of the past are being relegated to webcam-quality Youtube shows. (Also because they aren't interviewing Konjak the best indie dev, why would they do this.)

[peanutbuttershoes]

I'm an A-hole. 

[Hangedman]

Let's set Hitler and stupid comments aside for a moment...

Say you have a tradesman, say, an architect, who is incredibly dedicated to his work.
He has gained a bit of renown for his creations outside of his field and modest respect within his field.
He says to you:
"Sometimes my work is hell but to me it's very important and affects and guides my entire life and perspective on the world."
"These projects have been my life for a long time and I can only hope they come to fruition and that others can enjoy my creation to the fullest, and see how much of myself I put into them."

And you would mock this architect for this?

So is it because they're games?

[dEnamed]

Uh?
I thought the general opinion here was something along the lines of "Youtube comments are youtube comments, nothing new here" and "that holocaust remark is somewhat debatable". I don't see anyone mocking them or their work however.
Perhaps you're projecting your distaste for those Youtube Comments onto People here, that have nothing to do with those very comments?

Also about your analogy with he architect:
If I heard the architect say "I poured all my weaknesses into the structural composition of this building" I'd run like hell.  

[Hangedman]

Perhaps you're projecting your distaste for those Youtube Comments onto People here, that have nothing to do with those very comments?

Not just the comments, but the general perception that these developers' attitudes and dedication to their work is frivolous and dramatized, which I have seen here recently and in the past and elsewhere recently and in the past

Also about your analogy with he architect:
If I heard the architect say "I poured all my weaknesses into the structural composition of this building" I'd run like hell.  

Goodjokes

[peanutbuttershoes]

games = buildings? + movie about this thread - this post =  (*) / Cactus

[Gabriel Verdon]

They aren't interviewing Konjak BECAUSE THEY ARE ONLY INTERVIEWING NORTH AMERICAN INDIE DEVELOPERS THIS HAS BEEN SAID MANY TIMES AND SHOULD BE QUITE OBVIOUS TO YOU GIVEN THAT THEY ARE NOT INTERVIEWING NOTCH, CACTUS, TERRY CAVANAGH, PETRI PURHO, FARBS, OR MANY OTHER OF THE GREAT INDIES OUTSIDE OF THE NORTH AMERICA

[boxedlunch]

games = buildings? + movie about this thread - this post =  (*) / Cactus

wat