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[rek]

That said, I completely disregarding game making applications ( like GameMaker ) and scripted ?platforms? like Flash and Silverlight, not because they aren't viable choices, but because I have little exposures and the article was already damned long!  Just letting you know that the guide was by no means comprehensive.

I checked it out, thanks. I think I will be starting with something like Game Maker or Flashpunk though, as they seem the most accessible for someone with nearly (but not quite) zero coding background. What background I do have is Flash Action Script circa 2001 and BASIC circa 1997 – I'm a graphic designer, not a computerologist or mathatronomer.

[infernalice69]

• There's no quick way of making games.
• There is no quick way of making games.

Hey,    You...No, No, Bad stop with the fight club references...

[gimymblert]

• There's no quick way of making games.
• There is no quick way of making games.

Ludum dare

[rek]

Ludum dare

Ludum dare sit amet, consectetur adipiscing elit. Vivamus pharetra tempus nisi. Nullam tempor tincidunt felis tristique eleifend. Cum sociis natoque penatibus et magnis dis parturient montes, nascetur ridiculus mus. Morbi a purus euismod nunc consequat sollicitudin id nec eros. Maecenas aliquet elementum nibh, in volutpat lacus consectetur rhoncus. Proin vel libero nec tellus volutpat fringilla. Fusce mauris orci, fermentum in accumsan non, tempor at nibh.

Maybe it should be changed to "there's no quick way to make your first game" or such.

[Zealot644]

PROGRAMMING LANGUAGES[/size]

Python
http://python.org
Benefits: Easy to pick up, several libraries available.
Caveats: Isn't as strict with type definitions(which might be a problem when transitioning to other languages), indentation may be confusing.
Guides: Official tutorial

C/C++
Several IDEs; Code::Blocks, Visual Studio Express, and XCode for the Mac.
Benefits: Tried and tested. Compatible with a wide range of libraries. Once you've learned this, learning other languages is easier.
Caveats: Harder to learn, definitely not the best language for people starting out, complicated in areas.
Guides: CProgramming's introduction to C++

ActionScript
http://flashgamedojo.com
Benefits: Produces Flash games, which many portals (like Newgrounds and Kongregate) accept. One of the easier languages to learn.
Caveats: May be somewhat slower than other languages, might be limited in some ways by the Flash plugin.
Guides: Flash Game Dojo's guide (with resources for Flixel and Flashpunk)

What about Java for a programming language? I'm in the process of trying to learn it through some web tutorials...but you didnt mention it here? Is it not good or something o.o because I dont want to waste my time learning something seen as inferior.

[ink.inc]

Java's really wordy imo, but if you wanna learn it, go for it.

Minecraft was made in Java, if I recall correctly, so it can be done.

[Zealot644]

Java's really wordy imo, but if you wanna learn it, go for it.

Minecraft was made in Java, if I recall correctly, so it can be done.

Can you explain what you mean by wordy?

And yes, the reason I decided on Java was based on Minecraft and Project Zomboid. I saw the potential in it and people said it was easier than C++ to learn. Not to mention I havent seen many games coded with anything except for C++ and Java or Unity but that uses the other languages like Python, Ruby, etc on top of Java and C++. I have literally 0 knowledge right now so I'll end up having to start with the whole "Hello World" examples lol.

Edit: That Vergessen game looks -epiiiiiic- ... But you're not working on it anymore ? Boo.

[ink.inc]

haha thanks; i might resume work on it later, but for now it's on the backburner

what i mean by wordy is that (for me, anyway) it takes a lot longer to do stuff in java than it does in c++

for example

to print something in java you have to do

System.out.println("Hello World!");

whereas in c++ its just

cout << "Hello World!";

more things to memorize, imo

but as for difficulty, most object oriented languages are fairly similar. once you learn one, its pretty easy to learn another one. i learned c++ back when i was 16, and when i learned java, it only took me a few minutes to get used to the new syntax.

PS: a tool i'd recommend for beginners is a program called game maker. it uses a language called GML, and its very easy to transfer that knowledge to a 'real' language like C++ or java. while using game maker, you can refine your ability to find solutions (which is the most essential ability of a programmer) while minimizing the amount of 'behind the scenes' stuff you have to deal with.

[Zealot644]

haha thanks; i might resume work on it later, but for now it's on the backburner

what i mean by wordy is that (for me, anyway) it takes a lot longer to do stuff in java than it does in c++

for example

to print something in java you have to do

System.out.println("Hello World!");

whereas in c++ its just

cout << "Hello World!";

more things to memorize, imo

but as for difficulty, most object oriented languages are fairly similar. once you learn one, its pretty easy to learn another one. i learned c++ back when i was 16, and when i learned java, it only took me a few minutes to get used to the new syntax.

PS: a tool i'd recommend for beginners is a program called game maker. it uses a language called GML, and its very easy to transfer that knowledge to a 'real' language like C++ or java. while using game maker, you can refine your ability to find solutions (which is the most essential ability of a programmer) while minimizing the amount of 'behind the scenes' stuff you have to deal with.

Ah. Thanks.

I'll checkout game maker in the next few days. You do have me following, if any, progress on your game. You had me at the description.

[Geeze]

I learned some c++, never used it in any actual project, but after that most other languages are cakewalk. And C# and java are so similar it's easy to learn one after another.
 

Also read my sig

[gimymblert]

Ludum dare

Ludum dare sit amet, consectetur adipiscing elit. Vivamus pharetra tempus nisi. Nullam tempor tincidunt felis tristique eleifend. Cum sociis natoque penatibus et magnis dis parturient montes, nascetur ridiculus mus. Morbi a purus euismod nunc consequat sollicitudin id nec eros. Maecenas aliquet elementum nibh, in volutpat lacus consectetur rhoncus. Proin vel libero nec tellus volutpat fringilla. Fusce mauris orci, fermentum in accumsan non, tempor at nibh.

Maybe it should be changed to "there's no quick way to make your first game" or such.

http://www.ludumdare.com/compo/category/ld-21/?author_name=pierrec
Ludum dare 

[ஒழுக்கின்மை (Paul Eres)]

to print something in java you have to do

System.out.println("Hello World!");

whereas in c++ its just

cout << "Hello World!";

in game maker it's just

show_message("Hello World!");

but i think a better measure of wordiness isn't how long individual print statements are, but how many lines it takes to do the same thing for larger algorithms. supposedly python is the least wordy language (e.g. a tetris clone written in python will take fewer lines than that same program in pretty much any other language)

but that's largely because { and } aren't needed in python to code blocks of code, instead it's indicated just by indentation. and a big part of the linecount of the code in c++, GM, etc., are those { and } lines

[Serapth]

This is one of those things I really don't understand.  Generally speaking, more verbose code is "a good thing(tm)".  I mean seriously, if typing speed is your limiting factor, you picked the wrong profession.  Verbose well structured code generally leads less commenting, is easier for others to digest and is more maintainable.  The only thing it isn't for some reason is "l33t" and frankly if you are using that as a determining factor, you are nuts.

[rek]

http://www.ludumdare.com/compo/category/ld-21/?author_name=pierrec
Ludum dare 

I know what Ludum Dare is, but what am I missing on that page?

[ink.inc]

More verbose code is "a good thing(tm)".

To pull an example from the internet, how is this:

Code:

//java

import java.io.Serializable;

public class Contact implements Serializable
{
   private String firstName;
   private String lastName;
   private String email;
   private String phone;

   public Contact()
   {
       this( "", "", "", "" ); // call four-argument constructor
   } // end no-argument Contact constructor

   // initialize a record
   public Contact( String first, String last, String eml, String phn )
   {
       setFirstName( first );
       setLastName( last );
       setEmail( eml );
       setPhone( phn );
   } // end four-argument Contact constructor

   // set first name
   public void setFirstName( String first )
   {
      firstName = first;
   } // end method setFirstName

   // get first name
   public String getFirstName()
   {
      return firstName;
   } // end method getFirstName

   // set last name
   public void setLastName( String last )
   {
      lastName = last;
   } // end method setLastName

   // get last name
   public String getLastName()
   {
      return lastName;
   } // end method getLastName

   // set email address
   public void setEmail( String eml )
   {
      email = eml;
   } // end method setEmail

   // get email address
   public String getEmail()
   {
      return email;
   } // end method getEmail

   // set phone number
   public void setPhone( String phn )
   {
      phone = phn;
   } // end method setPhone

   // get phone
   public String getPhone()
   {
      return phone;
   } // end method getPhone
} // end class Contacts

any better than this:

Code:

//ruby

Contact = Struct.new(:first_name, :last_name, :email, :phone)

(they both do the same thing)

Fewer words on the screen doesn't necessarily mean that it's less well structured. You can have a perfectly indented program regardless of the language.

The more you can prune something down, the better and cleaner it is, I feel.

[Serapth]

Of course there are exceptions on every level, and I agree Java is excessively wordy and could use a hell of a lot of pruning. I am of the opinion C# is a superior language in every measurable metric except perhaps contract billable hours, so I don't really like defending Java.

But to cite your first example:

System.out.println("Hello World!");

whereas in c++ its just

cout << "Hello World!";


The first is actually superior to the second in almost every way but terseness.

First, << can be overridden and therefore it's meaning is mutable.  The first line means exactly what it means, and it means it every single time.  This is easy to support and easy for new devs to grok.

The second however, the operator can be modified and cout, first off is a shit undescriptive name ( c means what? Console? Class? Character?  ( and yes, I know its console )  out to where? ) can be redirected.  This is a source of potential confusion and future bugs.

[ink.inc]

Alright, I see what you mean.

[gimymblert]

http://www.ludumdare.com/compo/category/ld-21/?author_name=pierrec
Ludum dare 

I know what Ludum Dare is, but what am I missing on that page?

It's a first game

[naron1034]

Nice... Makin' my own. 

[Austiyn]

I kinda want to try out Game Maker now. But last time I did I felt like I didn't have much control over it like you do with programming languages such as Java or C++. It is most likely just me.