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880187 Posts in 33024 Topics- by 24392 Members - Latest Member: mfroeschl

May 25, 2013, 11:51:50 PM
TIGSource ForumsPlayerGeneralgirl game designers...
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14113
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« Reply #300 on: May 05, 2011, 11:00:40 AM »

I refuse to believe that any human being can be as thick as you are, 14113. You have to be kidding.
That's a really strong argument, thanks for your contribution to the debate!
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antymattar
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« Reply #301 on: May 05, 2011, 11:01:58 AM »

W.T.F!?
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Are you talking about!?
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thatshelby
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« Reply #302 on: May 05, 2011, 11:13:05 AM »

boobs
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Kramlack
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« Reply #303 on: May 05, 2011, 11:14:11 AM »

@14113: Modern meaning aka it's just used to offend someone without necessarily being made as a homophobic remark. By ignoring the fact that it's often used this way, you actually just proved Cow's point that you keep your eyes shut and avoid it.

With that said, I don't actually condone eva's constant use of it, and if anything, it just made her look more childish than she already did.

EDIT: Also boobs.
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Paul Eres
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« Reply #304 on: May 05, 2011, 11:15:33 AM »

There is no modern meaning, I have no idea what the hell you're talking about. I provided a shitload of dictionary references, can you not read?

i'm with dragonmaw -- i don't think he's being an honest actor here, since he claims to not know what we're talking about even though we've been pretty clear about what we mean (e.g. my analogy with f*ck having more of a modern meaning besides 'to have sex')

also, dictionary definitions don't preclude other dictionary definitions. you can't selectively quote some definitions and then claim that the huge number of such definitions proves that other alternative definitions don't exist. here's an example:

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=faggot

the #1 definition there, rated by popular vote, is this:

Quote
1.    faggot   9637 up, 2858 down
In these times not really used if somebody is really a homosexual mostly used insteap of calling somebody stupid or a loser.
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cynicalsandel
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« Reply #305 on: May 05, 2011, 11:16:07 AM »

I remember this episode of South Park, where they call all Harley Davidson riders "fags." The gay community is upset, but they realize that the kids weren't even using it as a reference to homosexuality. Then they tried to change the definition.
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Cow
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« Reply #306 on: May 05, 2011, 11:20:40 AM »

Incompetent argument power rankings:

1. ▲ 14113
2. ▼ Phubans
3. = JWK5
4. = _MadK

14113 came out with a strong effort to take the division lead, after an average early-topic performance. Phubans, having fallen back on his "look at me I'm quirky" tactics gains points for predictability but cannot quite match the onslaught of 14113. JWK5 remains as 3rd place, with his repetition and inability for form coherent thoughts putting him above the rest. _MadK has not shown much in recent pages but is remembered for his work in claiming that because something is not offensive to him, it's not offensive to anyone.
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Dragonmaw
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« Reply #307 on: May 05, 2011, 11:21:15 AM »

I refuse to believe that any human being can be as thick as you are, 14113. You have to be kidding.

That's a really strong argument, thanks for your contribution to the debate!

You simultaneously defend cunt, an "inherently misogynistic word," as just being "your culture." You then, in the same breath, decry eva for using faggot as an "inherently homophobic word," even though she doesn't mean it as an insult to homosexuals any more than you mean cunt as an insult to women. In other words, you have such a blatant double standard, and it's fucking ridiculous.

If you say that eva is using faggot as a smear against homosexuals, you have to accept that using cunt is a smear against women and that you are a misogynist. Or, alternatively (and more logically) you can simply say that both cunt and faggot have been devalued (even though cunt is still significantly worse than faggot) and that both uses are in a general pejorative sense.

But then again, you don't care about such petty things as "standards" and are simply trying to marginalize eva using bullshit hypocrisy. So debate is useless.
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My religion consists of a humble admiration of the illimitable superior spirit who reveals himself in the slight details we are able to perceive with our frail and feeble mind.

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DjangoDurango
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« Reply #308 on: May 05, 2011, 11:22:29 AM »

but i do think that sometimes one gender is better at a particular type of work than the other, and that we'll never get near 50-50 in every field. for a simple example, males are generally bigger, and hence better at construction work and other work which involves a lot of physical effort. similarly, women usually have more practice taking care of children than men do (because they raise children more), so it makes sense that day care workers are mostly female.

I disagree that one gender is necessarily better at a job than another. Or rather, without social constructs that dictate as much, it is not one's gender that makes one better suited for a job. For example, with childcare, I think women are nurtured into being more nurturing because that is expected of them. It's a created structure as opposed to a natural inclination so it's not an inherent trait in women as a gender. Likewise, I don't think men, if left to their own devices, would be any more or less able to care for children, but as a society, we discourage this in favor of them being "manly" and going out to obtain the resources.

Quote
but i also agree that there are some fields (such as car mechanic) which are male-dominated but there's no clear reason why they should be that way, other than peripheral things, like more males having a fascination with cars than females. i think game programming is of that type, because if programming really were a particularly male skill, male programmers would tend to be better than female programmers (which isn't the case, among professionals rather than amateurs i mean).

I don't think gender necessarily has anything innately to do with this so much as that girls are usually discouraged from being interested in things like cars and computers and construction in favor of more feminine pursuits. Which is to say, without people telling others that this or that thing is not for your gender, you would see a more even distribution working in those fields.

Quote
also, another thing is that females tend to actively look down on videogames more than males do. so i don't think it's necessarily true that game programmer is seen as this difficult, prestigious job, at least among females. so i wouldn't entirely blame inexposure to videogames for the lack of female game developers, i think that in addition to that the attitudes of many females towards the activity of playing videogames plays a big part. if they didn't see it as a waste of time or look down on people who play videogames, they might have more opportunity to find games they like, and there might be more female game developers.

I did say it was a single influence on a larger scenario and not the sole reason. And I don't think anyone really thinks writing code all day is that prestigious a job unless that's what you want to do and you're livin' the dream.

As far as that goes, though, it probably changes things that I am a girl and perhaps girls are less likely to scorn male-oriented hobbies to a girl who likes them, but I've never met another girl who actively looked down on gaming so much as just didn't have an interest in it. If I did, though, I might wonder if it isn't a Fox and the Grapes kinda thing. That is, at some point, she was given the opportunity to play and for some reason was alienated by it or else was given some other influence to lead her to that opinion and decided that games just weren't good at all.

Which, to be fair, there's a lot about gaming that a girl might night relate to and there's plenty of people who, if she cares to listen, will tell her games are nothing but male power fantasies of violence and sexism that aren't worth her time. But I can't see anyone really taking a harsh opinion without that sort of influence 'cause even as a little girl in the early 90's with all the biases that involves, the other girls didn't want to talk about Super Mario World but they didn't think any less of me for liking it.
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Kramlack
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« Reply #309 on: May 05, 2011, 11:26:32 AM »

Holy hell, could this be Paul's female nemesis?
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DjangoDurango
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« Reply #310 on: May 05, 2011, 11:30:00 AM »

lol, hardly.
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Dragonmaw
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« Reply #311 on: May 05, 2011, 11:31:22 AM »

I think what Paul was trying to reference is that men, by product of sexual dimorphism, are better suited to certain physical tasks than women are. Likewise, women are better at certain physical tasks than men are. It's just physiology in that regard. His examples might not be great, but the message is clear.

Likewise, his addendum is that psychological tasks don't have anything to do with actual gender and everything to do with societal gender norms. Much like how most nurses are female, even though it's not a task that men struggle doing. Or how most programmers are men, even though the first real programmer (Ada) and a large chunk of early programmers were female. Or how gaming is extremely male-centric.
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My religion consists of a humble admiration of the illimitable superior spirit who reveals himself in the slight details we are able to perceive with our frail and feeble mind.

-Snoop Dogg
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« Reply #312 on: May 05, 2011, 11:31:33 AM »

Incompetent argument power rankings:

1. ▲ 14113
2. ▼ Phubans
3. = JWK5
4. = _MadK

14113 came out with a strong effort to take the division lead, after an average early-topic performance. Phubans, having fallen back on his "look at me I'm quirky" tactics gains points for predictability but cannot quite match the onslaught of 14113. JWK5 remains as 3rd place, with his repetition and inability for form coherent thoughts putting him above the rest. _MadK has not shown much in recent pages but is remembered for his work in claiming that because something is not offensive to him, it's not offensive to anyone.
delete every post after this one and lock the thread
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DjangoDurango
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« Reply #313 on: May 05, 2011, 11:40:23 AM »

I think what Paul was trying to reference is that men, by product of sexual dimorphism, are better suited to certain physical tasks than women are.

Ah, I see. I would still argue that there are not so many of these task as would make that much of a difference on the whole of jobs involving manual labor. The only one that really comes to mind is archery, where one's breasts get in the way if you're not careful.

Quote
Likewise, his addendum is that psychological tasks don't have anything to do with actual gender and everything to do with societal gender norms. Much like how most nurses are female, even though it's not a task that men struggle doing. Or how most programmers are men, even though the first real programmer (Ada) and a large chunk of early programmers were female. Or how gaming is extremely male-centric.

If that is what he said, then I agree with that.
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14113
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« Reply #314 on: May 05, 2011, 11:44:16 AM »

Well, at least I'm number one, my rightfull place  Shrug

And to be honest, I'm sick of this argument. I've provided all the evidence I need to, and stated every argument I need to. It fucking cunts like dragonmaw who fail to ACTUALLY FUCKING READ MY FUCKING POSTS which make pursuing this argument worthless.
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