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[TeeGee]

Would you do that, Paul Eres? I know you would. You are a vicious, vicious man.

The tea he drinks is spiced with magical herbs which calm down the demons living inside him.

Yeah! Just look at that cruel, demonic smile:



He's just thinking about the childhoods he's going to destroy.
This, my friends, is a face of a childhood destroyer.

[Inanimate]

Paul, I'm talking about people who claim that they're being honest when they're just being dicks. Notice how I pretty much say "honesty is best, just don't say it all at once, and be kind about it".

[JWK5]

Don't fuck with Paul.

[Paul Eres]

Paul, I'm talking about people who claim that they're being honest when they're just being dicks. Notice how I pretty much say "honesty is best, just don't say it all at once, and be kind about it".

i'd classify those people as honest but not understanding/mature. for instance, often on the tigsource frontpage you have people say something like 'this game is crap, everyone who likes this game is dumb' instead of saying why specifically they didn't like it. to me they are still being honest, they just don't have a good understanding how how games work in general and how that game works in particular

the cure for those types of people is more honesty, not less. they need to be honest about exactly why they didn't like the game, and exactly why they resent others who like the game. so i'd say that if someone acts as you describe (or acts like the hypothetical tigsource commenter described above) the problem is not that they are being too honest, but that they are not being honest enough

[C.A. Sinner]

imagine some random stranger asks you for your credit card number (if you don't have a credit card, imagine you did). would you be honest and tell it to him?

the cure for those types of people is more honesty, not less. they need to be honest about exactly why they didn't like the game, and exactly why they resent others who like the game. so i'd say that if someone acts as you describe (or acts like the hypothetical tigsource commenter described above) the problem is not that they are being too honest, but that they are not being honest enough

It can be hard rationalizing your feelings.

[Inanimate]

the cure for those types of people is more honesty, not less. they need to be honest about exactly why they didn't like the game, and exactly why they resent others who like the game. so i'd say that if someone acts as you describe (or acts like the hypothetical tigsource commenter described above) the problem is not that they are being too honest, but that they are not being honest enough

Well, I wasn't saying that "proper tact = less honesty", I was saying that "proper tact = same amount of honesty, but be polite about it". For instance:

"This game is a rotting pile of shit" is certainly honest, but it can be expressed in the same amount of honesty by saying:

"I disliked this game".

Combining this with your point of "more honesty", we get:

"I disliked this game BECAUSE..."

Which is the ideal constructive criticism! Everybody wins.  

imagine some random stranger asks you for your credit card number (if you don't have a credit card, imagine you did). would you be honest and tell it to him?

There's a difference between "honesty" and "answering every single question people ask you".

[TeeGee]

imagine some random stranger asks you for your credit card number (if you don't have a credit card, imagine you did). would you be honest and tell it to him?

No, he would honestly tell the person to fuck off. It's radical honesty, not radical naivety. Paul also mentioned earlier that there are exceptional cases where being honest is not advised.

Wait. Why am I doing this?

[DavidCaruso]

Imagine if you were a bank robber or a conman and you loved your job. Would you tell people the truth?!?!?!

[C.A. Sinner]

a certain anthony zirbas does just that.

No, he would honestly tell the person to fuck off. It's radical honesty, not radical naivety. Paul also mentioned earlier that there are exceptional cases where being honest is not advised.

I just brought this up because Rinku included "leaving out details" in his definition of dishonesty. Or would "I don't want to talk about it" be an honest answer if that's what you honestly think?

[JWK5]

I've kind of backed away from this topic (other than to poke fun at it on occasion, as per usual) but I do have to ask, what if members on here were to dig up personal information about specific family members of yours? Would you be okay with other members here prodding the lives of your family members for discussion? Would you be okay with members picking apart their mental health, sexual orientation, daily routines, etc.? I mean how far does this "open discussion" policy really go?

Do you feel anyone here has a right to privacy or respect of personal boundary, or is the life of every member of this forum just cannon fodder for debate?

[Paul Eres]

yeah what they said -- there are exceptions made for force, fraud, games, etc. -- it'd be stupid to tell your opponent your position and your plans if you're competing with them in a game of league of legends or something

also politeness seems perpendicular to honesty; one can impolitely lie just as easily as one can impolitely tell the truth. i don't think honest people are any more impolite than dishonest people (if anything my experience is the opposite)

as for details, that's a different meaning of the word detail. by details i meant something like this: if there is a detail in a story that you feel someone would want to know, and you leave it out, that's the same as lying. for instance, let's say i told someone i work on my game every day without exception (which is true) but leave out that some days it's only a few minutes long. leaving that detail out changes the truth significantly

@jwk5 - i'd be fine with it. i wouldn't take part in such discussions, and i wouldn't volunteer information about it, and i probably wouldn't read it, but i'd have no problem with it otherwise. and this isn't just theoretical, it's happened on several occasions already that people on this forum have talked about personal info about me and my family

[JWK5]

@jwk5 - i'd be fine with it. i wouldn't take part in such discussions, and i wouldn't volunteer information about it, and i probably wouldn't read it, but i'd have no problem with it otherwise. and this isn't just theoretical, it's happened on several occasions already that people on this forum have talked about personal info about me and my family

Fine with it or not, that's a raw deal. I don't always agree with what you have to say but I still think you deserve more respect than that.

[Paul Eres]

i don't see it as a lack of respect, i just see it as people being people. a common occurrence for example is phubans stalking my sister and talking about how much he's attracted to her etc. -- it might be uncomfortable to me but i wouldn't take away his right to do it

or if you read some of my formspring questions, a lot of them are pretty personal / intrusive (i don't answer all of them, just some, as the mood strikes me). generally though it's my policy not to talk about information that others would consider private, so for instance on my formspring i don't answer personal questions about friends/family, just personal questions about myself (as long as revealing that information wouldn't allow someone to deduce some private information about someone else)

[Inanimate]

By the way, I didn't say that honesty was on the same axis as politeness; I just think that that proper behavior is to be honest, but also polite.

[JWK5]

You choose not to discuss it as a courtesy, a show of respect. It's not "people being people", it is some people being "disrespectful people". Which brings us back to my point earlier in the topic. You can choose not to discuss your family's personal business out of respect but you're open to discussing other members mental health, sexual orientation, etc., which may be equally personal and/or private? If you can see that there should be a level of consideration for your family why is it so hard to see there should be a similar consideration for members of this forum?