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1075737 Posts in 44138 Topics- by 36108 Members - Latest Member: DebrisHauler

December 28, 2014, 09:33:46 PM
TIGSource ForumsPlayerGamesSystem Shock 2
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Droqen
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« on: September 14, 2011, 08:36:45 AM »

SHOULD I MAKE A THREAD ABOUT THIS?

YES!!! (also you should play it)

I started playing System Shock 2 again the other day and god I love that game. I played it when I was little and it destroyed me and then I played it again a handful of years ago and I kicked its ass!

Something amazing happened (I had an amazing experience!) and it made me like five times more excited just to talk about the game and I don't know why. Quickly I will organize my thoughts into a few points.

1. Story Things; Scary Things; Environmental Things

System Shock 2 has an optional story told in voice overlaid on top of you doing stuff, and text you can read if you like to go along with it. The story unfolds as you explore, and the stories that people tell often link back to previous disconnected storybits, or in many cases are actually relevant to what's happening in the game! (more in next point)

It has ghosts that pop up to add to the story and the spooky factor. I've never been terrified playing this game, but I have been sufficiently creeped out at a few points. It's also the first game I'm aware of in which your character-story expectations are really subverted.

But the story is on the sidelines, even if a little less so than in other games.

2. Freedom; a 'Real World'

First I'll start with how the 'story' links to the game in a way I've not seen in many games. As you progress, you grab audio logs from tables, dropped on floors: These are messages people make to themselves or to each other. Voice messages, of course, because it's the future. It doesn't make that much sense that they're lying around but they're awesome.

Many games try to tell stories only through their settings, and I think this is the best way it's ever been done: everyone is already dead (well, just about everyone -- either that or turned into weird shit) and you're sifting through the near-past, which relates very closely to the future.

Audio logs sometimes tell you vital information: "We've been researching stuff to kill that alien stuff infecting the ship" explains what those flasks are for (so does SHODAN, of course, as it's a vital goal). Other times they tell you things such as non-vital door codes: if you're not paying attention, you might just never find where that door code goes. Yet other times they warn you of things to come, or simply foreshadow, or provide interesting background. You start fighting psychic monkeys (holy hell there's no way to talk about things in this game without them sounding ridiculous: ALIEN ZOMBIES!) and audio logs talk about (not in a cutscene or anything, mind you) the monkeys' rise to protest, then psi powers.



Right. Then, there's the world that has tons of stuff to interact with. There are so many doors that you never need to hack; so many paths that lead to dead ends. There are rooms filled with radiation and useful items that are completely optional. The game generally has you meandering about the decks of the ship -- there's backtracking, but the spaces are small and only sparsely populated enough with enemies: as opposed to, say, a metroidvania where enemies spawn in the same places every time, you might have no idea where you'll run into an enemy on your way back. You might be tempted to enter that radiation-flooded room this time, having found a bunch of rad hypos.

3. Bioshock

Let's not talk about Bioshock. Having called itself a 'spiritual successor' to SS2, I was incredibly disappointed by it. DONE

4. CHOICE & CHALLENGE

What you do can fuck you right over, and it's awesome.

In general, there are also a lot of choice paths you can make and they're all pretty viable.

Doors that can be hacked simply can't be hacked if you don't have enough hacking skill.

Weapons can't be used if you don't have the appropriate skill, but it soon becomes abundantly clear that you wouldn't be able to do everything and that's great: with the points you're given, there's more than enough room for experimentation. At the same time, though, you're given hard choices here and there (as well as a reason to try the game again -- even if just playing the game wouldn't be enough).

Okay, last thing. I've been rambling too much about this game. I wrote a story here about something amazing that happened thanks to the way resources work in System Shock 2: I've never played a game with more interesting limited-resource management.

1. Limited inventory forces you to pick and choose what you keep with you -- and while it's not tiny, it's not huge, either. You'll definitely have to drop that hazard suit, maybe, or perhaps one or both of those pistols.

2. Ammo is limited and weapons break down. Using weapons, even with tons of ammo, is a tough choice. They degrade over time and while maintenance tools aren't rare enough that it becomes frustrating (at least, not for me!) it makes guns valuable enough that using them feels like a satisfying decision.

There are also multiple kinds of ammunition; 'standard' is most common, and the other kinds are way better against their devoted targets. (i.e. armour-piercing vs robots)

3. Healing (health, radiation, toxins) isn't too expensive, and revival is really inexpensive too. However, it's still limited: your health doesn't regenerate over time, and I'm glad it doesn't.



Every resource (except for melee attacks) is limited -- regardless of what you do, you're going to whittle down your resources here and there. There's a constant cycle, though; you'll find a brand new pistol in perfect condition just as you're losing hope because your shotgun broke (or something. this never actually happened to me. but it would if you didn't put points into, for example, maintenance!)

I HAVE TO STOP TYPING >_< Does anyone else love this game a lot? I imagine someone will bring up Deus Ex, which I'll probably try again at some point.

what is with me today and writing huge, messy posts ._.
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Hangedman
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« Reply #1 on: September 14, 2011, 08:40:46 AM »

It's an excellent game, one of the only games that has truly unnerved me.

I also quite enjoyed the fact that at no point were you just super-kill-everything-man, but felt like you could deal with a situation with your skills etc. And then the game would hit you over the head with something tricky and you'd scramble anyway
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« Reply #2 on: September 14, 2011, 10:52:33 AM »

System Shock 2 is a masterpiece. Still scary as fuck too, despite its dated graphics.
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Droqen
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« Reply #3 on: September 14, 2011, 11:03:13 AM »

I SHOULDA SPENT MORE TIME MAKING THAT POST BETTER

and shorter, too.
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« Reply #4 on: September 14, 2011, 11:08:24 AM »

System Shock 2 is fantastic, but I actually preferred System Shock 1.  There's less choice per se in that you don't pick specific skills in the first game (guns versus hacking, etc.) but I felt the atmosphere and story were much more gripping.  And it's scarier... it is perhaps the most immersive game I've ever played, despite its old, ugly graphics.  I only played it for the first time a few years ago (right before I played System Shock 2 for the first time) and it still had that strong of an effect on me.  Plus, it gives a great background to the story in System Shock 2.

While the mechanics in System Shock 2 were excellent (although I did miss getting to actually enter cyberspace like you can in the first game) I think I was a little disappointed in the story.  It just seemed a little too... contrived.  MINOR SPOILERS:  For example, the fact that one of the characters in the second game is the son of a major character in the first game, and he just happens to end up involved in these events with SHODAN, just seemed a little heavy-handed.  For me it was too obvious that this plot had been written, rather than something that could have believably occurred.

Those are very minor complaints though.  I guess I just want to encourage people to check out the first game too, since it's great.  Runs well in DOSBOX, plus I think there's a fan-made port that lets it run natively in Windows.  I will concede that the controls in the first game were not so good, but there's also a mouselook mod available that will help a lot.
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Eclipse
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« Reply #5 on: September 14, 2011, 12:15:36 PM »

If someone wants to play System Shock 1 on modern systems this is the way to go: http://www.systemshock.org/index.php?topic=211.0

Also, System Shock 2 is awesome. Look at you hacker.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XsgRNahEZnw

 Beer!
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Droqen
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« Reply #6 on: September 14, 2011, 02:34:35 PM »

Yesss

I am going to play System Shock right now

It's been a while since I tried -- last time I tried it didn't go too well, but I don't remember why. Good luck, Droqen! (I'm looking forward to this!)
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Superb Joe
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« Reply #7 on: September 14, 2011, 03:29:45 PM »

its a good game. but not all of it is good.
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Droqen
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« Reply #8 on: September 14, 2011, 03:40:57 PM »

That's okay. Nothing's perfect.
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Ben_Hurr
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« Reply #9 on: September 14, 2011, 05:32:14 PM »

The Polito-form is dead, insect.

-room dissolves-  Waaagh!
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Core Xii
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« Reply #10 on: September 15, 2011, 04:07:57 AM »

I liked this article about SHODAN.

Quote
Double Hell – actually look at the relationship between Shodan and yourself. While in reality you’re in a consensual relationship where both needs the other, in terms of the actual second by second practice it’s a straight Domme/Sub arrangement. She tells you what to do. You do it. She insults you. You’re just lucky she doesn’t make you lick her boots clean or something.
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Dragonmaw
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« Reply #11 on: September 15, 2011, 09:00:19 AM »

It would be interesting to see a System Shock 3 that approaches SHODAN with the same careful introspection that System Shock 2 showed. Make each iteration of her reflect a new and different aspect of her personality.

Then again I don't trust anyone other than Ken Levine to write it that well, and he's busy doing his own thing. Also, Terri Brosius is at Harmonix now, which might put a little difficulty into getting her to voice SHODAN. And she has to be the one to do it.
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« Reply #12 on: September 15, 2011, 09:19:01 AM »

Such a great game. One point in that game was one of the most memorable moments in gaming for me. I thought my computer was messing up or I was going crazy.
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Mikademus
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« Reply #13 on: September 15, 2011, 11:00:27 AM »

System Shock 2, a story of perfection through evolution, the right atmosphere and excellent people:

Richard Garriot --> Ultima
Ultima + Warren Spector --> Ultima Underworld
Ultima Underworld + Dog Church --> System Shock
System Shock + Ken Levine --> System Shock 2

This IN SPITE of Electronic Arts having acquired the rights to System Shock by purchasing Origin Systems. God, I miss the old Origin Systems and Looking Glass Studios... Cry
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