Just play skyrim seriously, you can't understand without playing it
This is hilarious.
i've already partly explained why i think it's less linear: the character progression isn't tied to questing nearly as much. also the non-"main quest" content doesn't feel like filler like in so many other "open world" games and there's very little content that's barred from you if you don't quest.
I see. By "character progression", you mean leveling? I concede that it's much easier to level by completing quests, but I wouldn't spend so much of my time actively avoiding them. I can't think of that as taking a different "path" in the game; my idea of progression isn't tied with my character's increase in strength. You can jump around in the sandbox and have fun, but I don't think of that as progressing.
just doing random shit in gta isn't fun in the long term because there's no reward
I think the problem is in how you one thinks of reward. To use that as an example, there's plenty to explore in GTA, with jumps, weapons, secrets hanging around, and some random mini-quests/games. There is reward in the action itself (there should be), exploration and collectibles (like most action games these days). The other reward found in rpgs is leveling, and to that I say whoopidy-do. I find it shallow, starting off as annoyingly restrictive and leading to your being overpowered. It's fine for the completionist gotta-catch-'em-all types who need 100% of everything because any incremental increase over time seems like a thrill to them.
Not that I'm much of a GTA fan.
yeah but it's not fun in every game
I don't find it terribly fun in any game, in the long-run. But you can be creative, to be sure.. play LoZ with no sword.
not everyone plays games for "narrative" i know i don't most of the time. you're arguing from a false premise.
This was brought up as a separate discussion, dealing specifically with expectations of randomized narrative that I've noticed over time. Otherwise there's nothing to discuss. And yet, something tells me the Minecraft and DF fans have hopes about the games going beyond what they currently offer, and I don't mean better visuals. Cramming more stuff and abilities is okay but that's not what they are fantasizing about either. They want the game to surprise them, to do more of the work, which is like the anti-thesis of a pure sandbox game. But that's just the impression I get.
