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879177 Posts in 32966 Topics- by 24357 Members - Latest Member: Irene

May 23, 2013, 12:15:23 PM
TIGSource ForumsDeveloperCreativeDesignWhat DON'T you like about these popular series?
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Author Topic: What DON'T you like about these popular series?  (Read 2499 times)
Paul Eres
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« Reply #15 on: December 16, 2011, 06:03:22 AM »

it's kind of insane to me that there exist indie game developers who can't beat a mega man game. they aren't that hard, really, i could beat mega man 3 without dying probably, even though i haven't played it in about 20 years. mega man 9 and 10 were overly hard compared to the originals, so perhaps people are judging the difficulty of the earlier games by the modern 9 & 10 games? the only hard ones are 1, 2, 9, and 10; the rest are a piece of cake
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« Reply #16 on: December 16, 2011, 07:14:40 AM »

it's kind of insane to me that there exist indie game developers who can't beat a mega man game. they aren't that hard, really, i could beat mega man 3 without dying probably, even though i haven't played it in about 20 years. mega man 9 and 10 were overly hard compared to the originals, so perhaps people are judging the difficulty of the earlier games by the modern 9 & 10 games? the only hard ones are 1, 2, 9, and 10; the rest are a piece of cake

Only played the nes ones and I was 8 at the time  Smiley Dont know why I just personally found other games, like balloon fight, far more fun  Shrug
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Paul Eres
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« Reply #17 on: December 16, 2011, 07:36:44 AM »

not finding it fun i can understand, that's a matter of taste. it's finding it too hard that i took objection to, i don't think they're too hard at all; there are plenty of hard NES games -- the entire ninja gaiden series, batman by sunsoft, tmnt, ghosts & goblins, battletoads, tengen's gauntlet, blaster master, fester's quest, bionic commando, double dragon 3, castlevania 1 -- the mega man games are not really difficult compared to those, particularly mm 3 through 6
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« Reply #18 on: December 16, 2011, 08:10:31 AM »

Sonic -- Varied between two different games: 1) Fast running 2) awkward platforming.  One of those was fun, one wasn't.  On the whole, the Sonic games are below average, with only the best being slightly above average. 

Donkey Kong -- Best Donkey Kong game is Donkey Kong Jungle Beat (GC version with bongos). It is the only game that has come out since I started working that I have 100%ed, because it is so damn awesome and the feel of the game is magnificent.
DKC is ok, but nothing to write home about.

Kirby -- My favorite has always been the one for the N64, what with the ability to have two powers at once.  Very Gunstar Heroes.

Megaman -- The classic Megamans were never my favorites.  The jumping never clicked for me.  The X series is fantastic.

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« Reply #19 on: December 16, 2011, 08:34:39 AM »

Sonic - I think the designers focus too much on the speed element. Even if it's Sonic's most salient feature I never cared for it much myself. To me the best game mechanics in the original Sonics were: 1) Ring/Health, really loved how this worked. 2) Sonic hurting enemies by jumping into them rather than onto them. Might seem like a fine distinction but it's what made the boss battles so much fun. Number 2 is harder to translate into 3D then speed, in fact speed should work better in 3D since you can actually see where your going, it only becomes cumbersome when you try to simultaneously platform. Like I said, I could do without the speed but I suppose you can't have Sonic without it so I guess just follow Tommo's critique here.

Even if the platforming was slow and awkward, it always was the "meat" of the game, with "speed" being either eyecandy or a reward. Acrobatics and speed management should be part of the game and not eyecandy, eg - acquiring enough speed for a loop is the only way to not die in the lava.
   
Donkey Kong - No complaints.

Kirby - No complaints

Mega Man - This is a pretty weak critique but here it is anyways. A lot of the robot powers you gain are useless. So you end up with a sub menu filled with weapons that you won't have any use for outside of boss battles, and even then it's often easier to just use your buster (and more fun IMO). Not a very significant complaint but that's all I've got. I do have a real problem with how Capcom exploits the series with redundant sequels, again and again, until the players can't take it any more, then reboots it into a new series (Mega Man X, Mega Man Zero, Mega Man Battle Network, etc.) and then exploits that series until the players can't take it anymore. With this business practice you have to wonder how Mega Man Legends 3 got canned.
« Last Edit: December 16, 2011, 08:43:19 AM by King Hadas » Logged
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« Reply #20 on: December 16, 2011, 09:49:38 AM »

all four of those are good series, i wouldn't change anything, except, that in mega man, i'd remove those stupid puzzles with the invisible blocks that appear and reappear; those are memorization based and not too fun

if you're talking about Megaman 2, you can skip that part entirely by using that power that creates an horizontal moving platform, I found those platforms a fun part anyway, you had to carefully time your jumps. I'd say Megaman has other flaws, sometimes for example there's really no way to evade an enemy\bullet
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« Reply #21 on: December 16, 2011, 10:13:33 AM »

Sonic: Needs to cut back on the platforming. The sense of speed is what Sonic was always best at, and the game is like playing a rollercoaster when you get that speed going. As soon as you stop-- because you hit spikes, or a wall, or you have to play the "platforming" parts of the game-- it becomes awkward and dumb. If the game is about speed, don't make me wait for a moving platform that is slowly sine-waving back and forth. Or at least let me jump over the whole damn thing if I'm going fast enough.

Megaman: Just recently got done with playing through the original series, 1-10. I actually don't mind the block puzzles. Yes, they're in EVERY. SINGLE. GAME but they're almost always done well. You'll get a room or a section where you can play a block puzzle without fear of spikes or holes. After you've done it a few times THEN they introduce the room with the danger element. My only feedback on block puzzles would be to lose the sequence that has a block appear 3 tiles directly above you. Or at least realize that this jump is much harder to make than all the other appearing-block-puzzle-jumps.

What I don't like about Megaman are the useless weapons (every game has 2-3 duds) and the tendency of boss weaknesses to be completely random and solved by trial and error. Got a boss? Try out every weapon to see which one deals 4 damage instead of 1. And Dr Wily final form? That's easy. He's weak to your stupidest, lamest weapon. Always.
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DavidCaruso
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« Reply #22 on: December 16, 2011, 10:57:30 AM »

Sonic: Make the collectathon God Mode system (rings) less effective and possibly replace the spindash with something else, maybe some sort of fast air dash move (not a homing attack), so that you can't just blast through most levels on your first try. To complement this, make enemies be an actual threat instead of stupid things waiting to be jumped on, whether just in pure numbers or by making them extremely agile and intelligent. Even more specific event setpieces per level would be awesome too. Also, more platforming, because I honestly can't understand the people saying that the platforming segments of 1/3K sucked. Maybe lessen the inertia a bit if you want to make more tense platforming in a new game, but the originals control perfectly. If you keep slamming into spikes every time you try to go fast then it's called being good at the game and knowing level layouts.

Donkey Kong: If we're talking DKC series, better and more responsive controls instead of animation-based inertia. Other than that, Retro Studios seems to have this down.

Kirby: If you're going to make a cutesy low-difficulty game tailored towards people who suck at games then you should keep it as short and quirky as possible. I can't think of much here, just tighten up the length and add a lot more unique level gimmicks/toys. Alternatively, make an awesome platformer named Gimmick! 2 and slap Kirby sprites on it lol. Actually screw it, that alternative is probably the best idea.

Mega Man: Add a shitload more moves which all need to be used effectively in order to clear level obstacles, in addition to awesome Robot Master weapons. Basically, turn the game into either X4 or Hard Corps: Uprising, except on (even more) crack. And like everyone else I'm not such a huge fan of the blocks either. There are a million better level gimmicks you could implement. Also fix the random item spawns somehow, otherwise you get an MM2 where the game's difficulty and pacing is broken by 50% health refills twice per level. Maybe this could be done by adding set enemy coin drops and preplaced health/weapon refill stations, like in Shatterhand.
« Last Edit: December 16, 2011, 11:03:21 AM by DavidCaruso » Logged
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« Reply #23 on: December 16, 2011, 11:27:25 AM »

I wanna make something better than Megaman  Durr...?
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Xion
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« Reply #24 on: December 16, 2011, 02:23:28 PM »

and knowing level layouts.
I think that, yes, you should be better at a game because you know its layout, but I don't think not knowing should make you suck. If I'm running into things every ten seconds it doesn't much motivate me to replay the level until I know the location of every obstacle just to be able to play without sucking. I guess some people like that but to me it's just frustrating and makes me not want to play even more.
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« Reply #25 on: December 16, 2011, 03:41:25 PM »

1) Sonic The Hedgehog
2) Donkey Kong
3) Kirby (traditional suck-shit-up Kirby)
4) Megaman

Well none of these are my favorites, but I have to give credit to some Megaman musics.

1. I never played single Sonic game, because I was Nintendo-dude.
2. Too old and simple. Was boring already in 80's when I played it in those mini-arcade machines.
3. WAAAY too childish looking. I was into DD2 and Contra and etc style games.
4. Good musics, nice graphics. Way too frustrating.


I think that, yes, you should be better at a game because you know its layout, but I don't think not knowing should make you suck. If I'm running into things every ten seconds it doesn't much motivate me to replay the level until I know the location of every obstacle just to be able to play without sucking. I guess some people like that but to me it's just frustrating and makes me not want to play even more.

20 years back you really didn't have a choice. If you wanted to see the ending screen you had to suffer for it. Also when we were kids, there were a lot more time and stupid persistence in use.
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« Reply #26 on: December 16, 2011, 10:15:47 PM »

1)Sonic The HedgeHog: It didn't feel that I'm playing the game, I just hold the right arrow button and things just went from right to left until I hit something and said "WTFIGO?"
2)If you mean the original DK, then nothing I don't like from the game.
3)Kirby is a game? Never heard of... let alone playing it  Durr...?
4)Nothing... Really...
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« Reply #27 on: December 16, 2011, 11:03:07 PM »

Even though this sounds oxymoronic, I really wish that Kirby's music retained the edginess it had in the original games. Like, listen to the break at 0:20 here. I mean that is what is going on, right there! It just sounds so cool, and is truly amazing when you break it down channel-by-channel! And you just don't get that with the modern Kirby soundtracks!

Kirby's Adventure was all about the breakbeats.
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« Reply #28 on: December 17, 2011, 12:40:58 AM »

replace spindash r u cereal?

For me my favorite thing about Sonic was the level design and variety (talking about 1 thru knuckles), I'd spend so much time in the levels exploring and finding routes. So good.
Honestly I'd just make the levels even more huge and sprawling and with more levels within levels... maybe a bit like Sonic CD with the past and future variations.  Get a sense of the depth, traveling into the inner-workings of the machinery seen in the backgrounds of a lot of the levels.

DK..C?  didn't like that game... seemed generic at the time.

Kirby, not enough time spent with those games.

Megaman, I'd like to play one that takes advantage of analog controls, something really fluid, fast and abusive of the precision.
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« Reply #29 on: December 17, 2011, 01:00:23 AM »

Sonic: I'd agree with the guy that said Sonic was Canabalt first. Make it more about the fun of speed and pinballing around a level and less about struggling to keep that speed going in face of hazards and enemies.

I'm also gonna stick my neck out and say that the later 3D stuff was more fun (Sonic Adventure Battle 2 to be exact). It was pretty fun to play, and if you ignored the story it was a pretty decent 3D platformer that pulled off the 3D aspect well enough.

DKC: I actually rather liked it, and while I didn't play much of DKCR what I saw looked even better. Maybe the difficulty was too high though?

Never played any Kirby before Epic Adventure, which was fun but extreeeemmmmeellllyyyy slllooooooooowwwwwwwww... Assuming you can accept it's a game for people who don't game, it does quite well other than that.

Megaman: If you're talking about the original platformer types, IMO really too hard (you're really fragile and clunky to control? seriously? And you can't aim your weapon at all? Concerned).

Again, I think I'll have to say that the newer RPG-likes are better (Megaman Battle Network series). It's just got a better return-on-investment for learning it for me. I do like the gamecube spin-off's semi-return to a platformer style a bit more
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