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May 21, 2013, 05:00:44 AM
TIGSource ForumsPlayerGamesGames that could be masterpieces if they expand on their concept
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Author Topic: Games that could be masterpieces if they expand on their concept  (Read 1643 times)
vinheim3
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« on: December 21, 2011, 04:18:22 AM »

I've played 3 games lately that have illustrated a unique and fun concept, but only last about an hour max usually because it was made quickly for a competition or it had to be released in time for the holiday it's based on. As someone who gets visions of ways an idea can be expanded, I feel like these games could be masterpieces if the person who made them decided to expand on them after the competition/holiday. These are:

Christmas Island - Chris S

This game is a platformer that is strictly tile-based, whether you're moving or jumping. When you jump, you move up 3 tiles, move forward 1 tile and fall all the way down to the ground. If you hold the jump button, you'll move forward 2 tiles instead. The game has platforms, spikes to avoid, springs that act as a forced jump and presents which you can collect and give to kids to get past them.

Special objects in this game include spikes that appear, then disappear, so you have to time your way past them; blocks that materialize after you press a switch; one room has 4 gems, a gem door that opens when you get those gems and a moving wall of spikes that move when you pick up the first gem.

Right now, after replaying it a couple times, it feels like this concept would not get old quickly. Not only that, but many other items could be introduced. You could have a hookshot usable anytime even while jumping that latches forwards to the nearest wall and drops you when you hit the wall. You could have teleports, pushable blocks, water where you need flippers to wade through and iron boots to sink down.


Craequ - Jonathan Whiting

I'd rather not describe the game as some of the fun is figuring out what each object does, so I'll just say how I feel it can be expanded.

Again, I'm getting a kind of LoZ vibe from this game. I feel like there could be an overworld and story and dungeons that contain multiple of these maps. Because of block-pushing, sokoban-type puzzles could also be mixed in with items shown in each dungeon. Ice could be in one dungeon to make block pushing trickier. Some blocks could be used as platforms across water or lava, meaning that sacrifices must be made. Items could include a hookshot again to pull in blocks, a blowing item to push items across pits. There could be massive bosses requiring movement across multiple rooms, etc.


Traal - Jonathan Whiting

Similar to Craequ and by the same creator, Traal is a game set in a dark dungeon and your field of vision is lit up. When monsters appear in your field of vision, you get scared and run away. This can be a good thing as certain blocks can only be destroyed when you touch it while running away, but it can also be a bad thing as there are spikes around. There are 11 scrolls to collect around the whole dungeon and 1 item.

This game doesn't feel like it would suit an overworld, it would be weird traversing one with its concept. Instead a much bigger dungeon with more items and puzzles could be made. The current item does a great job in expanding what you can do/access, and more items that can link well with the concept would be great.


Grow games - On

In each of the Grow games, you are given a number of "items" that you can place on a world one by one. After you place an item, previously-placed ones will level up. Sometimes an item will only level up when another item of a certain level is present, then they interact. Solving these puzzles involves max levelling each item, meaning that you have to get the right order. This is done via experimentation, seeing how each item levels up, what other items influence an item's level up, etc.

I used to fill a notebook with designs for an RPG game that used this as its main concept. You would collect items around the world through quests, and sometimes as an enemy drop. Then you could use them in unique ways. Sometimes, some quests require you to have certain items and use them in a certain order. Other times, enemy battles could be made easier by building big weapons/machinery by using the items in a certain order. Some machines would be enemy-specific, like a magnetic gun that steals the metal armor of a crab greatly reducing its defence.

To get item orders, you'd have a notebook keeping track of combinations as well as hints scattered around the world in bookshelves, talking to people "I heard that if a level 3 ladder is next to a level 2 wheel, it levels up to become a minecart", etc.


Anyone feel like they know a game that could be a masterpiece if expanded?
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ortoslon
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« Reply #1 on: December 21, 2011, 04:50:19 AM »

Koules, an arena sumo'em up, would be great with more different enemies, some actual level design or SYNSO-like enemy wave scheduling

Fail-Deadly, an RTS where you balance two sides, could do with faction asymmetry

Men on the Flying Trapeze, a cooperative acrobatics game. more arenas, more apparati (think trampolines), fairer scoring, less buggy physics

Invisible Vision, a shooting game where you notice enemies by disturbance caused by their movement. different ripple patterns, heatmap-like coloring of wireframe graphics

Excellent Bifurcation, a brainsplitting shmup, ends shortly after you get used to it
« Last Edit: December 21, 2011, 08:26:38 AM by ortoslon » Logged
J. R. Hill
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« Reply #2 on: December 21, 2011, 07:08:41 AM »

Grow is a collection of masterpieces already, in my opinion.

My contribution:
Minicraft - A game made by Notch for the latest Ludum Dare.  It's pretty fun, it'd be cool to see this expanded on, maybe make it multiplayer and give it a bigger world.  Maybe even in 3d...
« Last Edit: December 21, 2011, 08:52:09 AM by J. R. Hill » Logged

vinheim3
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« Reply #3 on: December 21, 2011, 10:24:27 AM »

Yeah, but you'd have to change the name so it isn't "mini" anymore, maybe change it to "mine" to reflect the mining aspect of the game..

Also, I agree with Grow games already being masterpieces. People have even created great fan Grow-themed games, but it's still pretty limited. A full blown RPG that is flexible with combinations and caters to a wider audience would be one hell of another masterpiece.


@ortoslon - I see what you mean with the first 2 games and with the last one, it seemed like it would make an awesome bullet hell-type game especially considering how you have to manage 2 screens. Strategizing could involve deciding which one would take a hit during times when bullet hell becomes difficult to avoid. Also, that acrobatics game is hilarious.
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J-Snake
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« Reply #4 on: December 21, 2011, 11:19:43 AM »

Expanding Super Metroid would not only be a masterpiece, it can be revolution in game-design.

So far it seems only I can do it.
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J-Snake
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« Reply #5 on: December 21, 2011, 11:56:15 AM »

I tried out Christmas Island and I have to say that it ultimately reminds me of what I am currently doing! Normally a platformer has a continuous feel to it, but here it is discretized and turned into a puzzle. So it is a bit unusual but stuff like that can be blast to play. Btw. I very much enjoed the lovely music, too, it's great.
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Faust06
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« Reply #6 on: December 21, 2011, 02:11:06 PM »

I think this is important to think about. With strong fundamentals, the no-brainer additions and framework can propel a game to new heights. A few games that come to mind right now:

RobotzDX - this is a remake (the one thing everyone seems to know). It's a challenging over-head room-by-room action game. I like the idea of overheads as opposed to more platformers. It's not terribly puzzle-y, but laid out in a fashion that reminds me of a few that way. If this were combined with some of the more frantic shooters from the NES era like Commando and SuperC (overhead areas), I wouldn't stop playing it.

NeonPlat - I think there is huge room for improvement and implementation of procedural generation in platformers. Spelunky is amazing, but it's not a scrolling platformer... this game is. With better feel and action, and more interesting enemies and patterns, something like NeonPlat would kill.

ALso, I want an overhead Metroidvania. Never going to happen, will keep getting LoZ clones, but w/e.
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J-Snake
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« Reply #7 on: December 21, 2011, 02:14:51 PM »

ALso, I want an overhead Metroidvania. Never going to happen, will keep getting LoZ clones, but w/e.
You would be right if I would not have been born.

Keep this thread in mind and contribute if you can.
http://forums.tigsource.com/index.php?topic=23278.0

Ah wait. You mentioned "Overhead". It is a waste of potential in certain wanted game-mechanics, so it is not what I want for this project. But I remember there is an overhead m-fan-game in development. Let me a sec to search:
Here you go:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bBSj46OVplI

I would like to know why you want a top-down metroid.
« Last Edit: December 21, 2011, 02:41:02 PM by J-Snake » Logged
vinheim3
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« Reply #8 on: December 21, 2011, 02:29:59 PM »

S/he said top-down Metroidvania not Metroid, as in 2D LoZ games and Hero Core.

The thing is, unfortunately, people have stopped making Metroidvanias. Metroidvanias are like 10% programming and 90% creativity. You can tell the games use very simple mechanics, made it long and fun with the Metroidvania formula, but also spill with creativity when it comes to overworlds, power-ups, how to block off areas requiring power-ups without making it look like key-lock mechanism (some allow flexibility meaning that though it looks like you need to climb a wall to get to this area, you could also get there using 4 jump power-ups). And people who were spilling with creativity have already made a Metroidvania.
« Last Edit: December 21, 2011, 02:39:58 PM by vinheim3 » Logged
J-Snake
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« Reply #9 on: December 21, 2011, 02:44:24 PM »

Oh mate, if you would only know whom you are telling all this. I have a big vision but you can just visit my thread and add your ideas, everyone is welcome.
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Paul Eres
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« Reply #10 on: December 22, 2011, 06:31:20 AM »

j-snake is the next mattg
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1982
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« Reply #11 on: December 22, 2011, 09:41:08 AM »

Almost any simulator game.

They could bring in playable characters, NPC's, goals, maybe some RPG elements.

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MattG
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« Reply #12 on: December 22, 2011, 06:24:28 PM »

j-snake is the next mattg

I am the next MattG, and the previous ones too  Wizard
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moi
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« Reply #13 on: December 22, 2011, 06:32:14 PM »

j-snake is the next mattg

I am the next MattG, and the previous ones too  Wizard
MattG is more like a Jack harkness than a Doctor then
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lelebęcülo
vinheim3
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« Reply #14 on: December 23, 2011, 04:28:33 AM »

Almost any simulator game.

They could bring in playable characters, NPC's, goals, maybe some RPG elements.



I definitely see potential with flight simulators especially. The problem I've had with most is that they focus mostly on the "flight simulation training" part which, for a game, isn't the most exciting part to focus on. For example, flying through checkpoints, and as Superman 64 has shown, is not the way to go Tongue

I can imagine a flight simulator game mixed with a Skyward Sword world as an MMORPG. Regions would be more 3-dimensional instead of based on a flat world.
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