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1034773 Posts in 41744 Topics- by 33338 Members - Latest Member: VanDiest

August 21, 2014, 07:55:17 PM
TIGSource ForumsDeveloperCreativeDesignLet's discuss traps!!
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Author Topic: Let's discuss traps!!  (Read 3562 times)
baconman
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« Reply #15 on: February 14, 2012, 12:22:28 AM »

the treasure chest monster in dark souls - one of the freakiest, funniest, and most surprising trap i've encountered in a long time...

Those are Mimics, and they're in quite a few games, although mostly RPG's. And while it's not totally unexpected, the way their contorted bodies look is quite an original take on them (most don't use arms/legs), and there is something delightful about watching them throw jumping karate kicks at you.

The first one I encountered in Dark Souls... the Lightning Spear one in Sen's Fortress... I defeated by luring it into the boulder trap. It was winding up for one of those powerful sobat kicks when *WHAM!!*, it gets bowled over. Couple friends watching me play almost wet themselves laughing at that.

Good times! :D
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inkBot
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« Reply #16 on: February 14, 2012, 03:14:13 AM »

who is your avatar?
George Carlin. Religion went out the window a long time ago.
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J-Snake
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« Reply #17 on: February 14, 2012, 07:31:44 AM »

Thanks, that doesn't really matter;) Every extremist is amusing, regardles on which side of the fence he is sitting. But this man is not dumb.
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senorbarborito
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« Reply #18 on: February 14, 2012, 04:29:56 PM »

one of the best traps that comes to memory is in one of those "asshole mario" games.

so there's a hole, and you go and walk towards it and press jump.

but instead of jumping over the hole you bang your head against one of those invisible coin blocks, and fall directly into the hole.

that shit made me laugh the first time, it was completely unexpected and totally unfair.

it strikes me that it might just be the perfect trap because it doesn't need any items other than the level's most basic building blocks.
« Last Edit: February 14, 2012, 05:30:02 PM by Seņor Barborito » Logged
Falmil
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« Reply #19 on: February 14, 2012, 05:24:26 PM »

Trap doors in MGS. Even after you know they are there, there is a good chance of you walking, hearing a click, stopping to figure out what it is, and having the door open under you to kill your big idiot self.
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Andy Wolff
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« Reply #20 on: February 14, 2012, 06:26:32 PM »

It would be interesting to make a game containing various different types and arrangements of traps. Such a game could be played under some kind of observation, and one could analyze the traps, to come up with the ideal trap

It is perhaps silly to try to break it down into such a list, but the game could explore a number of different issues and how they affect the player alone and in diverse combinations:
  -Sparsity/density of traps
  -Visibility of traps (and other 'fairness'-related ideas)
  -Simplicity/Complexity of trap mechanisms
  -How well the theme of the trap fits that of its surroundings (and other aesthetic issues)
  -Amount of time trap gives players to react once it is activated / appears
  -Severity of trap consequences (both good and bad?)

That's too many variables to deal with mathematically, and probably still too many to deal with academically, but such an experiment could nonetheless be very interesting and valuable experience

Someone with more time than I have should do it. Multiple people should do it, actually, and with different core game mechanics and trap sets.

</pseudoscholarlybullshit>

oh yeah i like traps, but not the kind that tells you he's a woman
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J-Snake
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« Reply #21 on: February 14, 2012, 08:37:51 PM »

The best traps are those you make yourself. Note that a trap is an abstract thing in general, you shall not limit your creativity in defining traps.
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baconman
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« Reply #22 on: February 15, 2012, 11:53:12 AM »

Andy Wolff needs to play I Wanna Be The Guy. Wink
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Andy Wolff
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« Reply #23 on: February 15, 2012, 12:52:12 PM »

@j-snake: yeah, defining traps isn't really a good idea, I guess. You could call any type of danger in a game a trap. I guess I'm just thinking more about general game design with a traps flavor than I am about any specific trap (except maybe the booby trap)

I have played it and watched playthroughs of what I didn't have time to do. I only got through like two or three bosses, and I want to play more of it sometime. It has a lot of interesting traps and it does a good job of subverting normal ideas of how traps ought to be, but it's very specifically geared toward extreme traps which are passed by a combination of memorization and tough execution. That's fine and great, but it'd be interesting to explore other areas of traps as well, like a few of the ones I mentioned
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Herr Schnurrbart
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« Reply #24 on: February 16, 2012, 01:59:03 AM »

A different aspect to traps: Rewarding the player if he manages to detect and not activate them.
It's incredibly fun to lure enemies into traps you have not triggered!
I do this whenever I can. In Oblivion and Skyrim, where traps are generally very weak, I would always take my time and lure enemies into them, knowing it would be much easier to just smash their head with my axe. It adds a certain aspect of slyness and Schadenfreude.
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RAMINATION
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« Reply #25 on: February 16, 2012, 03:36:02 PM »

one of the best traps that comes to memory is in one of those "asshole mario" games.

so there's a hole, and you go and walk towards it and press jump.

but instead of jumping over the hole you bang your head against one of those invisible coin blocks, and fall directly into the hole.

that shit made me laugh the first time, it was completely unexpected and totally unfair.

it strikes me that it might just be the perfect trap because it doesn't need any items other than the level's most basic building blocks.

I recall that happened already in the original Japanese Super Mario Bros. 2 (Lost Levels).
Great stuff!
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eigenbom
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« Reply #26 on: February 16, 2012, 05:36:26 PM »

A different aspect to traps: Rewarding the player if he manages to detect and not activate them.
It's incredibly fun to lure enemies into traps you have not triggered!
I do this whenever I can. In Oblivion and Skyrim, where traps are generally very weak, I would always take my time and lure enemies into them, knowing it would be much easier to just smash their head with my axe. It adds a certain aspect of slyness and Schadenfreude.

I didn't read that, but you have the best avatar ever ...
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senorbarborito
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« Reply #27 on: February 17, 2012, 11:16:53 AM »

I recall that happened already in the original Japanese Super Mario Bros. 2 (Lost Levels).
Great stuff!

really, shame I'd forgotten!
oh well I guess I'm better off by forgetting since I can be surprised twice  My Word!
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Strkl
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« Reply #28 on: February 17, 2012, 04:34:59 PM »

A different aspect to traps: Rewarding the player if he manages to detect and not activate them.
It's incredibly fun to lure enemies into traps you have not triggered!
I do this whenever I can. In Oblivion and Skyrim, where traps are generally very weak, I would always take my time and lure enemies into them, knowing it would be much easier to just smash their head with my axe. It adds a certain aspect of slyness and Schadenfreude.

I totally agree, those kind of traps feel really rewarding ^^

I think even if there is an infinite number of possible traps variations, it may possible to put them into some categories, like : (All of the following is personnal thoughts, they may be totally wrong  Embarrassed )

-Hidden traps : I think this is the first kind of trap that people think of when they hear the word 'trap', They're mostly not or partially visible, and will (for example)  kill the player, and the next time the player get next to it, he'll have learned the lesson and avoid it...But sometimes the trap could be designed in a way that the player can escape it once it have been triggered (Wich feel much more rewarding and make you feel like you're good :D)

-Exposed/visible traps :  When you cleary expose the trap to the player (it's more an "obstacle" than a "trap" at this point") and the player immediatly sees it on the screen, he begin to think how to avoid it, so the surprise part is gone (But you could change the trap at the last second wich is  a trap in trap !).
That could be handful for creating hard situations without them being frustating (Like in meatboy : Every single obstacle is clear, and never 'trick' you), otherwise, the player may find it unfair

The visual aspect does matter a lot, with bad art the trap can be totally mixed with the backgroud (Or that can be the purpose), or just look at Luigi's mansion fake doors for example (I don't know, just came trough my mind), they used the exactly same models, texture, as the real doors, and even their locations seems legit, no way you can tell if they're fake or not the first time...But it's alway funny  Big Laff )

But I don't like put things in categories, and in the end the right trap is always the one that does not feel unfair

And I realize that the point of the topic was to give example, sorry Tongue
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Shakhal
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« Reply #29 on: February 19, 2012, 06:38:59 PM »

I still remember 2 traps in DOOM 3:

One of them is where was a locker with the password written in a paper attached in the same locker. The only thing that i found inside was an Imp jumping to me.

And the other one was in a obscure corridor and i found a light switch in one generator. I said "Nice. A light switch!". I pushed the button...and a horde of monsters appeared behind me. Fuck!! - i shouted. I kill them of course, but until now my sister keeps laughing at me for that (she saw me playing it in that moment) Lips Sealed.
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