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[s0]

oh wow the witches of hemwick still aren't that hard on ng+ (got them first try) but the fight sure is intense, esp after clearing the entire area in one go. i was down to 3 blood vials by the end of it. did you know they have a respawn timer once the second one spawns and you don't kill both of them in time?

it feels like some bosses in this gam were balanced for ng+

[Rat Casket]

they do the same thing in ng

[s0]

ya but in ng it doesnt really matter. or least i didnt trigger it in any of my ng playthroughs.

[SousaVilla]

My hardest time was with the Defiled Pthumeru dungeon. Maybe my vit was too low, but all the bosses could one shot me pretty easily.

NG+ was not all that difficult, but I was probably too strong after doing all the main calice dungeons in a row.

[DJFloppyFish]

apparently gascoigne doesn't like it when you spam R1 with the threaded cane while he's mid axe transformation (you keep canceling the animation and he keeps trying to restart it). i was able to just power through his entire second phase

[s0]

btw i finally read the big lore document and i disagree with some parts of it (or i guess i have a different interpretation): i dont think the school of mensis is part of the healing church. they're actually their enemies/rivals. its correct that there was a schism at byrgenwerth and the people who left (including laurence) founded the church. but imo, the school of mensis (which includes micolash obv) was founded by the people who STAYED at byrgenwerth. the school of mensis and the church (or more accurately the choir) are both trying to attain the wisdom and power of the great ones, albeit by different means.

reason i think this: yahar'gul is an unseen village, as in hidden away in an abandoned part of old yharnam and outside of the church's sight. the lore note complaining about rom hiding the mensis ritual is found in the oedon tomb, which is part of cathedral ward. the reason the choir is interested in byrgenwerth is because theyre trying to gain access to (and kill) rom to expose and thwart the mensis ritual.

[s0]

that thing where your vials and bullets get refilled from your storage everytime you die? should apply to all consumables in your inventory imo. i don't see a reason why not. maybe they'll patch it in.

[SousaVilla]

btw i finally read the big lore document and i disagree with some parts of it (or i guess i have a different interpretation): i dont think the school of mensis is part of the healing church. they're actually their enemies/rivals. its correct that there was a schism at byrgenwerth and the people who left (including laurence) founded the church. but imo, the school of mensis (which includes micolash obv) was founded by the people who STAYED at byrgenwerth. the school of mensis and the church (or more accurately the choir) are both trying to attain the wisdom and power of the great ones, albeit by different means.

reason i think this: yahar'gul is an unseen village, as in hidden away in an abandoned part of old yharnam and outside of the church's sight. the lore note complaining about rom hiding the mensis ritual is found in the oedon tomb, which is part of cathedral ward. the reason the choir is interested in byrgenwerth is because theyre trying to gain access to (and kill) rom to expose and thwart the mensis ritual.

But the Upper Cathedral Key says that: "The upper echelons of the Healing Church are formed by the School of Mensis, based in the Unseen Village, and the Choir occupying the Upper Cathedral Ward." So both of them should have been part of the Healing Church at some point, although they probably started fighting later.

Also, spamming the axe charging R2 and shooting bosses with the cannon is playing this game on easy mode. So much damage with so little risk.

[s0]

oops 

ya axe and cannon are op

[s0]

[SousaVilla]

Seems legit.

I'm having trouble getting back to the chalice dungeons on my second playthrough. They just seem dull. And screw that Defiled Chalice.

Is anyone having fun playing those root chalices? I dont know, I think they could have used the resources and the time making the dungeons to add two new areas to the main game and I would have liked it better. 

I'll give them a last chance later, though.

[s0]

I'm having trouble getting back to the chalice dungeons on my second playthrough. They just seem dull.

that's because they kind of ARE

at least if you try to do them all in one go. theres just too many of them for how few room types there are. honestly once youre done with all the chalices in 1 area you've seen almost everything (as far as rooms go at least). its odd because everything else about the game is streamlined and tightened up.

i actually think some of the non-root chalices are pretty nice level design wise. for instance in the lower hintertomb (i think) chalice there's a poison swamp room with 2 cannon wielding giants and a few zombies. that's a nice combat setpiece in the classic souls tradition. if all of the best versions of these rooms were strung together into 1 or 2 normal levels itd be much better. but oh well.

otoh chalices are one of the things i could see the inevitable future dlc improve on so who knows.

[gimymblert]

Or they will drop it because procedural generation is not as good as human level design HURR DURR

[Rat Casket]

Or they will drop it because procedural generation is not as good as human level design HURR DURR

this is correct so if you are trying to be funny or something you are just making yourself look like a moron

[gimymblert]

I don't understand what point you are trying to make

[vinheim3]

One is not better than the other, they both suit different feels and playstyles. I always thought a souls x BoI would work, with things like rest rooms and weapon/item rooms. Human level design would suit the story mode part of a game, and procgen would suit optional/side/end-game bits for rewards ala Disgaea series.

[DJFloppyFish]

you know what would be nuts? a chalice dungeon level editor for players  

I am still excited to check out the dungeons. I've kinda turned the main game into a grind by replaying it so much anyhow, so seeing bosses/enemies in a new context sounds fun.

[gimymblert]

Procedural gen is the new CG btw, people use to say CG will never take off because it's soulless, game too, now here we are. I'm still mad people use progen as a "magic" bullet without really thinking (designing) about it really, I sometimes mad I'm locked on my project because there is so much I want to prove in this field argh ...

[Rat Casket]

proc gen will never be as good as manually designed levels because thats just the nature of the beast.

[gimymblert]

Yeah just like cg lighting will never be as good as painted light, that's the nature of the beast, but do you understand the nature of the beast? You could also say you will never be as good as Mickeal Jackson because it's the nature of the beast, but who is really? It's not a machine problem. game create emotional experience base on a set of fixed rules, cg lighting create emotion based on a set of fixed rules, progen is creating level design based on a set of fixed rules. Remember synth musique will never be as good as real musique with real instruments, instruments will never be as good as human singing. Until they are, and that's only one good designer away and one culture shift away, one day they will drop the toy story of progen aka progen use to filter chaos and not rely on superficial structural mimicry through chaos, almost no current progen implement actual level design rules and process ... like everything it will takes only one human to design the procedural singularity, one day, as always.