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October 01, 2014, 04:20:39 PM
TIGSource ForumsFeedbackDevLogsRogue's Souls (UPDATED APRIL 14)
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Author Topic: Rogue's Souls (UPDATED APRIL 14)  (Read 77758 times)
C.A. Silbereisen
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« Reply #160 on: December 12, 2012, 04:06:57 PM »

I haven't had a lot of time to work on this in the weeks since the last release. Nevertheless I've added 2 new enemies, a new boss and a couple new items. The morgue function is going into the next version but probably in a simpler form than what I had originally in mind. Might expand on it later.

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C.A. Silbereisen
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« Reply #161 on: January 13, 2013, 07:45:02 AM »

Because the uni work just keeps piling up and I keep lacking time to work on this game, I decided to do another intermediate release. This one is called 0.86 and has SOME of the new content planned for 0.9, as well as a few small tweaks and bugfixes.

Unfortunately, 0.84 save files are incompatible with this version.

Download and changelog in the OP.

Beer!
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C.A. Silbereisen
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« Reply #162 on: March 15, 2013, 02:09:54 PM »

Just stopping by to say I'm still working on this. I didn't do too much over the last 2 months but since the beginning of March things have been progressing steadily again.



Not sure when I'm going to release the next build, but I don't really want to do another intermediate release before 0.9 comes out.
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C.A. Silbereisen
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« Reply #163 on: March 18, 2013, 06:59:38 AM »

I figured I should post a bit about what I'm working on at the moment so yeah,

DEV UPDATE
Over the past few weeks I've been implemting the tomb file where your dead characters are stored, and in tandem with that, the new phantom mechanic. This is basically a cross between the ghosts from Nethack, Crawl etc. and the invasion mechanic from the Souls games.

Phantoms are generated from your dead chars and always appear at the dungeon level they died at. They are not spawned during levelgen like normal monsters but appear during gameplay. The probability for a phantom to spawn depends on the dungeon level, your soul level and the amount of souls you're carrying. The idea is to use this as a kind of "rank" mechanic to hit you with a tough enemy when you're doing well.

Other than that I've been adding some new content (mainly items) and fixing some bugs as I go along.

Because my focus isn't on tweaking and balancing at the moment, the 0.9 (just like the last couple builds) will probably be rather unbalanced, especially late game. After that though it's going to be a slow crawl towards polishing the game and making it fun to play.

 Coffee
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« Reply #164 on: March 18, 2013, 09:12:46 AM »

This is a pretty neat roguelike, the difficulty is at a good place.

The phantom idea from DCSS could be good, it was always my largest source of rage early game. but it did make things a little more fun from time to time.

I've always leaned towards more content vs polish, so I'm all for your plans!
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C.A. Silbereisen
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« Reply #165 on: March 18, 2013, 11:23:40 AM »

This is a pretty neat roguelike, the difficulty is at a good place.

The phantom idea from DCSS could be good, it was always my largest source of rage early game. but it did make things a little more fun from time to time.

I've always leaned towards more content vs polish, so I'm all for your plans!
Thanks!

It's always hard to judge the difficulty of your own game, so I'm glad to hear that.
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« Reply #166 on: March 20, 2013, 02:40:14 PM »

Boy that phantom idea sounds swell, though I just like the idea in general of stumbling upon the remains of previous incarnations. You could make it a more permanent thing rather than just targeting those doing well, so if you're doing badly taking on your zombie self could be nice if it means you picking up a random piece of your old good gear.  Hand Thumbs Up Right
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C.A. Silbereisen
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« Reply #167 on: March 21, 2013, 01:17:11 AM »

I'm already doing that actually. Phantoms have most of the stats and gear of the character they're generated from so of course there's a chance for them to drop the items they were carrying.

They also give you a decent amount of souls.
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C.A. Silbereisen
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« Reply #168 on: March 29, 2013, 02:03:32 PM »

For anyone interested, here's a rundown of the levelgen algorithm. (I'm posting this for Gabriel Verdon but it felt weird to litter up his devlog with a huge wall of text about my own game so I'm posting it here instead.)


1. Generate The basic layout
The levels use a branching path structure. The player always starts out at the "root" of the main path and the exit is always at the end of it. Paths are made up of "cells" of 10x10 tiles. The first thing the algorithm does is lay out the basic structure of the paths by doing random walks. Each path has a predetermined length and has a certain chance to either change direction or branch off into another path every step of the walk. The algorithm stores the layout (which cells belong to which path, which path is a branch of what other path etc.) in a huge list array containing a number of subarrays.

2. Basic level architecture
OK, now that the basic structure of the level is done, we gotta fill in the details. First, the algorithm loops through the layout array and places a random predesigned 10x10 level chunk on each cell. The chunks contain all the "architectural" elements of the level (floors, walls doors etc.) as well as possible enemy spawn points. Also they're all surrounded by walls.

3. Connect the chunks
The logical next step is of course to somehow connect these chunks to each other so the level becomes actually playable. Here the algorithm loops through all the cells again and checks adjacent cells for possible connections according to the layout. There are also varying random chances to connect completely unrelated cells to shake things up a little. Connection happens by either simply removing the walls between 2 cells or generating a door between them. Paths also have a certain chance to be locked (more on that later).

4. Place monsters and treasureT
Now that the level architecture is finalized, we'll have to fill the level with things to fight and loot to collect. I'm using a point based system to place enemies on the map. There's a point total for the level (partially determined by level size) and different enemies are worth different amounts of points. Possible spawn points are determined in step 2. There are different random chances for enemies to spawn in different locations of the map. For instance, tougher enemies are more likely to spawn near the exit or on side paths. The algorithm selects a spawn point using dice rolls first, then selects an enemy. Treasure chests and their contents are generated in a similar fashion.

5. Place keys
Locked doors always close off an entire path. Keys are generated in such a way that you'd never have to go through another locked path to get them. To do this, the game goes through the entire branching "genealogy" of a path, again using the layout arrays, and ensures it connects to the main path uninhibited. Keys can either just lie on the ground or be carried by monsters.

OK that's it. I hope it's clear enough Tongue
« Last Edit: March 29, 2013, 04:30:34 PM by C.A. Sinclair » Logged

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« Reply #169 on: March 29, 2013, 04:13:10 PM »

Good to hear Gabe is doing a tile set!
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« Reply #170 on: March 29, 2013, 08:09:27 PM »

Nice text about level generation!  Hand Thumbs Up Left Grin
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C.A. Silbereisen
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« Reply #171 on: April 01, 2013, 02:42:23 AM »

Nice text about level generation!  Hand Thumbs Up Left Grin
thanks! designwise, the goal was to get some sort of semi-linear progression into the level structures because i haven't seen that a lot in roguelikes (and to approximate demon's souls' linear path + side exploration format)

anyway,
DEV UPDATE
right now i'm mostly writing item descriptions. this is something i had planned from the start but have kinda postponed until now. as in the souls games, most descriptions also contain a bit of lore. other than that i'm coding some new AI for the phantoms that i'll probably be able to use for some other enemies as well.
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« Reply #172 on: April 01, 2013, 01:38:37 PM »

the game is extremely fun! tileset give it a tasty dark fantasy feel, I hope you can add more props and map details soon. could you explain how initiative/turn system is managed?

bug report: buying a single item from wanderers, remaining items shift up but their images don't.
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« Reply #173 on: April 01, 2013, 01:44:07 PM »

I know it's not normal for it to happen in Roguelikes, but I was thinking since this game is inspired by Demon's Souls and Dark Souls, why not have a gameplay mode where when you die you lose all of your souls and you are made undead with the chance of regaining your souls if you do not die before you reach them.

All and all, it's a pretty fun roguelike which I will probably play quite a bit considering how much it reminds me of Demon's Souls. My PS3 is broken right now so it's the closest thing I have to it. Tongue
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C.A. Silbereisen
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« Reply #174 on: April 08, 2013, 04:34:22 AM »

thanks for the kind words guys!

Quote
could you explain how initiative/turn system is managed?
sure! it's very simple actually. every character in the game (including the player) has an internal "clock" that fills up a certain amount (depending on the the character's initiative stat) each turn. when the clock reaches 100 or more, the character gets to take an action and 100 is subtracted from the clock variable. rinse and repeat.

when you do anything that isn't a "free action" (such as lowering your shield, switching your readied weapons etc), the game automatically takes enough turns for the player character's clock to reach 100, that's why 1 action can be worth 2 or 3 turns sometimes.

Quote
I know it's not normal for it to happen in Roguelikes, but I was thinking since this game is inspired by Demon's Souls and Dark Souls, why not have a gameplay mode where when you die you lose all of your souls and you are made undead with the chance of regaining your souls if you do not die before you reach them.
yeah i had something like that planned. what i had in mind was a variation on what demon's souls does. instead of traditional roguelike permadeath, dying would reset you a couple dungeon levels, take all your souls and halve your max HP. you would need to find your bloodstain on the level you died at to regain your souls and your HP. levels would be re-generated and the bloodstain would be randomly placed. if you die before reaching your bloodstain, it'd be permanent.

i've kinda decided against it for now though, because:
1. it'd probably make dying more annoying than straight-up permadeath and often just killing yourself would be the better option when you "turn undead."
2. it could be abused for soul and gear scumming. one of my design principles is to keep the game grind free (as much as possible while still keeping gear and leveling mechanics that is)
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C.A. Silbereisen
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« Reply #175 on: April 16, 2013, 03:24:01 AM »

DEV UPDATE

Still writing item descriptions, designing some new content and fixing bugs as I go along. I'm planning on adding more enemies with shields to the game (as well as giving more existing enemies shields) so heavy weapons become more useful.

I'm also beginning to design the end game. What I had in mind was a randomly generated final boss with stats based on your own to a certain extent (for instance if you have a mage build, the boss would have high magic resistance etc), along the lines of the original idea Fromsoft had for Lord Gwynn in Dark Souls. There'd still be a relatively high random factor though because I don't want a situation where the rest of the game is just a preamble to a fixed boss fight.

Also there's a simple tomb screen now, where you can see your top 30 past characters sorted by dungeon level. Right now it just displays the characters' names and the level they died at but i'll probably add cause of death and possibly stats later.

And lastly, I wrote a little script that sorts your inventory according to item types and whether you have them equipped/readied. You can either enable autosortting whenever you pick up/equip/etc. an item or do it manually by pressing a button in the inventory screen.

OK that's all for now, no idea when the build will come out but I just thought I'd let you know that this is still going.
Smiley
« Last Edit: April 16, 2013, 04:39:56 AM by il grande silenzio » Logged

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« Reply #176 on: April 17, 2013, 09:40:54 AM »

o.o b
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« Reply #177 on: April 17, 2013, 12:00:48 PM »

playing character is bad centered, isn't it? I mean, too close to the hud.
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C.A. Silbereisen
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« Reply #178 on: April 17, 2013, 12:08:50 PM »

yeah, i actually fixed that just a few days ago. will be in the new build when it's released.
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« Reply #179 on: April 17, 2013, 07:00:24 PM »

Really interested to see where you go with it.

We've been working on a game with some roguelike attributes and it's been really tough. While roguelikes are pretty much my game/genre of choice, it's so weird thinking about 'endgame'. Because in most cases all the roguelikes, but your primary, are for all intents and purposes, infinite games, you will never see the end.

I guess the challenge is making the gameplay so interesting that it's enjoyable for those who won't beat it, and still creating an end that was worth the time spent for the people who do beat it. It seems like such a weird balance.

Oh and the generation ideas you wrote out earlier were great! Gave us a lot of inspiration for how to handle ours, much appreciation.
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