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[st33d]

I'm amazed at how many comments are like: "don't like the graphics - downvote from me".

Fuck the graphics.

Said the Nitrome developer.

[VDZ]

http://i.imgur.com/AcaOG.png

Apparently entering fake Greenlight entries only gets you a one-day community ban (not even a full ban). Not surprised Greenlight is full of bullshit entries when there's practically no punishment.

[zalzane]

I'm amazed at how many comments are like: "don't like the graphics - downvote from me".

Fuck the graphics.

Said the Nitrome developer.

Well yeah, the only thing each steamlight entry shows is screenshots and some long winded description, it's only natural for people to judge the entries based on them. It's not like they have any way to judge the gameplay since theres no demo download button or anything of that sort.

[Falmil]

I've caught myself a few times being overly judgmental. A lot of the games have incredibly thin and repetitive game mechanics or graphics that are amateurish or simply too raw and unpolished. Every now and then I will see a game that looks good and professional, but I don't really care for personally for one reason or another. If I can't see anything terrible, I usually upvote it.

I'm not sure how I feel about some people downvoting everything that looks like a "flash game" while others upvote basically every single game possible.

[Paul Eres]

Well yeah, the only thing each steamlight entry shows is screenshots and some long winded description, it's only natural for people to judge the entries based on them. It's not like they have any way to judge the gameplay since theres no demo download button or anything of that sort.

that's not true, fully 1/6 of all games on greenlight have demos available. there's no demo *button* but if you read the description the ones that have demos do link to them (although often you have to copy and paste a url cause valve doesn't allow direct linking to developer sites).

[Paul Eres]

What? Aquaria was not made by people who worked in the big industry companies, nor was MineCraft or World of Goo...

world of goo was made by two ex-EA employees. the others you are right about though.

[zalzane]

that's not true, fully 1/6 of all games on greenlight have demos available. there's no demo *button* but if you read the description the ones that have demos do link to them (although often you have to copy and paste a url cause valve doesn't allow direct linking to developer sites).

Yeah, they got demos available, but unless there's a big green button on the sidebar that says "DOWNLOAD DEMO", nobody will give enough of a crap to sift through the description to find the demo link.

[Paul Eres]

if they don't want care to read the description enough to find the demo link, maybe they shouldn't be voting on games. do you really think it's *helping* anyone (the developers or steam) for someone to rush through the games and vote them up or down based on screenshots, without reading the description or playing the demo (if there is one)? if you don't want to spend enough time on a game to fairly judge it, just don't vote at all, it seems pointless to rush through games and quickly judge them based on very little, that just muddles things up for those of us who do take the time to evaluate each game we vote on

[zalzane]

if they don't want care to read the description enough to find the demo link, maybe they shouldn't be voting on games. do you really think it's *helping* anyone (the developers or steam) for someone to rush through the games and vote them up or down based on screenshots, without reading the description or playing the demo (if there is one)? if you don't want to spend enough time on a game to fairly judge it, just don't vote at all, it seems pointless to rush through games and quickly judge them based on very little, that just muddles things up for those of us who do take the time to evaluate each game we vote on

That's just how the average voter is right now. If your game doesn't impress them based on those videos, screenshots, and a quick glance over the description (I would think we'd be lucky to even get that much), then they are going to vote it down. This is an issue with the average greenlight voter not necessarily being a good judge, and is a variable that the content publisher has to account for when designing their screenshots and descriptions.

The average greenlight voter is probably going down the list of games looking for something to impress them, they may not give your page more than 10-20 seconds of examining before making their decision, which only exemplifies how important it is to have a brief description and to get down to the meat of what your game is about.

The ultimate goal of the greenlight page is to impress the voter as fast as you can, whether it be with screenshots, videos, or a good description. Anything that is too long or drawn out will not hold the voter's attention and will be disregarded.

[Paul Eres]

if that's what it turns into then i don't think greenlight would be fulfilling its purpose, since instead of getting good games on steam it'd be getting impressive-looking games on steam, and instead of rewarding talented developers it'd be rewarding talented marketers

but i don't actually think most people voting on games work like that. i've been reading through the forums and most of the time people put some thought into their choices, and feel bad if they feel like they aren't giving a game enough of a chance (the way falmil was above). i think that over time the people particularly dedicated to fairly judging games will become more numerous on greenlight, and the people just casually rating games after a few seconds will get bored and no longer bother looking at greenlight

[Falmil]

if that's what it turns into then i don't think greenlight would be fulfilling its purpose, since instead of getting good games on steam it'd be getting impressive-looking games on steam, and instead of rewarding talented developers it'd be rewarding talented marketers

Welcome to the game industry

[Paul Eres]

the users of greenlight isn't the game industry though. it's how the industry makes decision but isn't necessarily how the user base makes decisions. so i still have a lot of hope that greenlight will lead to games getting recognized that wouldn't otherwise have been recognized

[Masakari]

Before GL launched, I was actually under the impression most games would have demos, and work in the usual Steam way.

It was only after the service launched that I both noticed that most games didn't have demos, and that the ones that did were in the description, and didn't work like Steam. In hindsight, it would have been crazy to expect Valve to host and support all that data, but it would have been very useful, I feel people would be more open to trying them out.

[hanako]

The average greenlight voter is probably going down the list of games looking for something to impress them, they may not give your page more than 10-20 seconds of examining before making their decision,

Now, see, compared to that, doesn't the IGF judging seem a lot more generous?

(ducks and runs)

[Paul Eres]

yeah i actually do wish demos were required for greenlight submissions. it'd have made the whole thing a lot more healthy

also, igf judges are supposedly selected for their expertise, instead of just being a random steam user