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[JasonPickering]

had another idea to tweak the game. there are now 3 types of doors. blue, green, and the current red. each one will have specific switches. so you might need to open a blue door and a green door to get to a specific area.

I really like the run cycle in this. I might need to try and get some vertical movement in.

[rek]

Just some random thoughts:

1) The rate of energy loss was just too rapid. This made dead ends (walking even a few seconds in one direction only to hit a wall and need to turn back), and having to retrace your steps after recovering a disk, a bit cheap. Consider a much slower depletion rate, and let the machine-activation be the cause of significant drains. This would allow for more choice (where there is none now): Should I turn this thing on, potentially being wrong, or see if there's another way that won't cost me so much power?

2) A background would add to the claustrophobia. As it is now, it's less "hallway" and more "giant cave with a low ceiling in places". Odd shapes in the background would also give the player reason to be wary – is that something that can hurt me? am I about to come across something?

2b) Show less of the ceiling/floor/walls, and don't show the rooms above/below. When you don't know there's are open spaces around you, the more closed in everything feels.

2c) Consider shining more light ahead of the player, less behind, like a flashlight.

3) If you keep to your original monsters-in-the-dark idea, which I think you should, I want to hear them in the darkness, and catch glimpses of them retreating from the light. The smaller your sphere of light, the noisier and more frequent they should get. Impending doom. I demand it!

3b) Combine 3 with 2c: periodically you have to turn around to push the encroaching monsters back with your light. They may grab you from behind when your light is dimming.

4) The only risk at the moment seems to be going the wrong way or in the wrong order, while the rewards feel incidental to the risk you take to get them. That is to say, activating a bridge puts you at risk of running out of juice, but there may be a battery just beyond it, but you aren't activating the bridge to get the battery because you don't know what's over there.

[JasonPickering]

1. the only thing that is tough is "Should I turn this thing on, potentially being wrong, or see if there's another way that won't cost me so much power?" when there is no other way. the player is given a bridge and must activate. There are not multiple pathways. I think the risk reward idea is good, but I think it needs to be implemented another way, not by main path obstacles.

2. I agree and thats why I plan on adding more environmental animation, and any "monsters" that are in the scene will be the same two colors as the background.

2c. I thought about that and did some mockups, but then if feels odd still centering the player in the screen. I was also thinking more lantern then flashlight.

3. Yeah I want to have noises, in fact I am thinking about doing no music, and just ambient sounds.

4.I do agree that there isn't much conflict for the player. and I had a few ideas.
A. I thought about putting batteries around and the player can use them to operate doors and bridges or recharge their energy. this of course means I cant have puzzles with different types of doors, because it would suck to need to use switches multiple times.

B. I also thought about making generators with limited amounts of energy and the player can recharge at them, but needs to decide how much to recharge, does he drain this or only grab a little bit.

[rek]

1. the only thing that is tough is "Should I turn this thing on, potentially being wrong, or see if there's another way that won't cost me so much power?" when there is no other way.

That's what I'm saying – give the player choices and time to make them.

In Microgue you have multiple directions/distances you can move, and have to think a few steps ahead to make sure you don't put yourself in danger. That's choice; when you die you know its your fault for not factoring in the Eye's teleport, or losing track of the spike timer, or underestimating three Rats. In this game as it is, when you die it's because the level is designed to drain your battery until you are dead.

2c. I thought about that and did some mockups, but then if feels odd still centering the player in the screen. I was also thinking more lantern then flashlight.

So don't centre the player, centre the player+light.

I hope you keep this going, even beyond the seven days you set aside for it.

[JasonPickering]

Well most likely the seven days will be to nail down the game, then a month to polish, but one problem Microgue had was not having a strong gameplay focus, so my goal is to nail that down in the 7 days then polish and tweak afterwards.

so your suggestion is multiple routes to the goals, and then peppering those routes with doors, to complicate ones travels.

Bridges will remain, but they will be relegated to unlocking the new areas, when discs are collected and there will be one disc per area. they will not require energy to activate.

[rek]

so your suggestion is multiple routes to the goals, and then peppering those routes with doors, to complicate ones travels.

Bridges will remain, but they will be relegated to unlocking the new areas, when discs are collected and there will be one disc per area. they will not require energy to activate.

More or less. Bridges are a form of locked door though, I wouldn't make them an exception to the drain-battery-to-activate mechanic.

Let the player explore (which will give you space/time to hint the back story*) and experience the place (the atmosphere, ambient noises, start to feel lost, that sort of thing) without constantly worrying about their battery. The dwindling battery and tense scramble to recharge is equivalent to the double-digit countdown in Mario Bros – a sign that you're in trouble and will lose if you don't do something about it – but not constantly pushing the player; it's something they will be aware of after experiencing it just once, and aim to avoid.

*Which sparked another idea: pepper the place with computer terminals. Some terminals will offer clues about what happened, others may include further clues about the place – "Storage Room B" sounds like a place you might find a battery, doesn't it?, while others may show the player a rough map of part of the level, or something else useful. This is another choice: power up this terminal and potentially gain something practical, or conserve energy and press on into the unknown.

[JasonPickering]

i am still unsure about the forced door cost, but i must say the terminal idea is pretty good. i think adding stuff like that, power terminals to get information is great. i also thought about maybe using two different screen sizes. one zoomed out more then the other, making the game easier to navigate, but drains your battery faster.

I think that stuff gives a better conflict then the door idea, because you might not know if there is another path, and that other path might take longer then it does to open the door.

[JasonPickering]

Well I have been busy. Added a bunch of stuff including nailing down the story to tell. I started working with computers to give the player access to the story they would tell you what happened plus also give you hints about where stuff is located. there would also be other computers that showed maps.

Sadly I was not thinking and with the tiny screen of 60 x 40. I cant really fit any text on the screen. I really like the super zoomed in camera, so now I don't know what to do. I can cut out the main story or go for a zoomed out camera, but I am not sure how far out I will need to zoom the camera.

Edit: Also I updated the build. there is one computer to the left of the player , but not much else, there are not even batteries in the level so death is inevitable.

[rek]

Sadly I was not thinking and with the tiny screen of 60 x 40. I cant really fit any text on the screen. I really like the super zoomed in camera, so now I don't know what to do.

Why not make the screen bigger but keep the visible area the same size? That will give you more space for terminal screens and general GUI stuff, and make things feel even more cramped. Or use a much smaller pixel font than the blocky one you have in the GUI.

Nice additions to the background.

[JasonPickering]

yeah I decided to just use very small sentence fragments. there are two types of computers for the collectors some have small snippets and others have a star map showing where the colonists fled to.

My main concern at the moment is building the entire world. The main problem is though I think the game can be beaten in about 20 minutes. I dont know if that's because I know where everything is. Its mostly just moving back and forth at the moment, so I might have to go back to the drawing board and do some envriomental dangers like VVVVVV has to liven up the game a bit. Still on the fence.

The reason I worry so much is I was going to put it out on the appstore as the control scheme feels really good on the iphone. I want some sense of value there, but then again how long should a dollar last you.

The other main thing is I kind of let the game steer itself, and it feels like it might be better if I added monsters and moved away from the horror aspect. You wont be able to kill the monsters or anything, they will strictly be simple obstacles you need to dodge. This could drastically change the whole design though, but if it feels better going in that direction I might have to take it. The original Horror idea I had doesnt work and I have begun to think of this more as a puzzle platformer. of course I need to do a build and see how easy it is to actually manuever. if the controls suck then this idea gets tossed out.

[rek]

yeah I decided to just use very small sentence fragments. there are two types of computers for the collectors some have small snippets and others have a star map showing where the colonists fled to.

What's the objective now? I got the impression you've moved away from the original "find out what happened to the people", but now if you casually reveal they escaped, why are you exploring this place?

My main concern at the moment is building the entire world. The main problem is though I think the game can be beaten in about 20 minutes. I dont know if that's because I know where everything is. Its mostly just moving back and forth at the moment, so I might have to go back to the drawing board and do some envriomental dangers like VVVVVV has to liven up the game a bit. Still on the fence.

Environmental dangers would add some immediate dangers, which is good, but keep it balanced.

It likely is because you know where everything is that the game feels easy and quick. Have you considered using PG to build the levels, or at least to fill in the spaces between pre-built sections?

The other main thing is I kind of let the game steer itself, and it feels like it might be better if I added monsters and moved away from the horror aspect. You wont be able to kill the monsters or anything, they will strictly be simple obstacles you need to dodge. This could drastically change the whole design though, but if it feels better going in that direction I might have to take it. The original Horror idea I had doesnt work and I have begun to think of this more as a puzzle platformer. of course I need to do a build and see how easy it is to actually manuever. if the controls suck then this idea gets tossed out.

I thought the atmospheric horror aspect was the best part of your original description! There are already hundreds of metroidvania monster-combat/puzzler platformers. Hell, there are at least two on the go in the Devlog forums.

[JasonPickering]

I originally liked the Horror idea, but there was no real game to it. it didnt challenge a player skill wise. I thought about perhaps doing puzzles? but that even becomes complicated, because with the player only moving left and right the only puzzle was Open up this pathway.

The main problem with a metroidvania is usually players add abilities and then thats let you go further. but there are no abilities in this. the only thing the player can get are keycards, which the levels always seemed to have a lot of run to point A, now run to point B, now back to A, uh oh back to B. and it felt like just padding out the game. I do like the horror idea, I just don't know how to make an actual game out of it right now its not a game, just a hiking simulator. The main thing in a metroidvania is the wandering around and trying to find where to go, but the player had the slow energy drain so that caused a huge problem because the main part of a metroidvania has now effectively been made moot.

The real main problem was it was a lot of mechanics jammed together with no player conflict.  I just couldnt find a way to make the energy interesting. I have been trying to find ideas of games that used a similar mechanic but I cant really find anything. I think maybe going back to the drawing board and thinking about the energy and only the energy might be a good idea. I need to add that conflict in and removing doors, and bridges, and monsters and only adding them in if they fuel the conflict.

perhaps I will move over to talking in the design forum. seeing what I can come up with.

Edit: posted in the design forum here