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[PompiPompi]

Christian, a simple though "mechincal" example of how supporting Kickstarter is indirectly bad for other indies.
Kickstarter only supports projects from the US and UK. Hence, the popularity of kickstarter draw the most "high profile" developers into it making it even more popular.

Other developers do not have access to kickstarter, they can only use IndieGoGo but IndieGoGo is less popular and less beneficial to them.

Hence, by suporting projects on Kickstarter you make it more popular which in turn make the other crowd funding websites less relevant.

[gggfhfdh]

Kickstarter only supports projects from the US and UK. Hence, the popularity of kickstarter draw the most "high profile" developers into it making it even more popular.

ive been staring at this for a few minutes now and i'm almost 100% sure you dont actually know what you're talking about and that you're just placing words together until you have something vaguely resembling sentences

[s_l_m]

Canada is supported too
Sorry, I know that nobody gives a fuck about us, I just had to say it

[Superb Joe]

kickstarter supporters are people like you or i (mostly you though), people with dreams and aspirations for the future. so what if most of those revolve around a fictional games console with a funny name. are they not men? if you kick them, do they not start?

[Christian Knudsen]

Hence, by suporting projects on Kickstarter you make it more popular which in turn make the other crowd funding websites less relevant.

Except that the facts point to this not being true at all. 16 of the top 18 Indiegogo projects were funded after Kickstarter blew up with the Double Fine Adventure (I only checked the first 18, it could very well be more). All 6 of the top 6 video game projects on Indiegogo were also funded after Kickstarter blew up (again, I only checked the top 6 -- StarForge, Resurrect ADOM development, The Best Asthma Education App in the World, Sword of the Stars: The Pit, CraftStudio, Starship Corporation -- it could very well be more).

So if we actually look at the real world instead of making shit up in our heads, evidence points to Kickstarter's success rubbing off on other crowdfunding sites. Just like the success of the Humble Indie Bundle resulted in bundles in general suddenly becoming a big thing.

[PompiPompi]

Are we better with Kickstarter's new huge popularity than we were before Maybe, I am not sure.
Is it a good thing that the most popular crowdfunding website is also available to very few countries? I think not.

It was just an example of how the massive popularity of one thing can also have bad side effects and is not living inside a vacuum.
Perhaps it also did good, but it is possible it is also bad in other ways.

The humble bundle did bring attention to indie games, but it also made it so people don't buy full priced indie games that much anymore. The PC might also be dead for a lot of indie developers nowadays, more than it used to. Unless you go to steam or humble bundle(or kickstarter), not many other options really. (But I am not sure about the PC thing)

I think there are a lot more gatekeeper nowadays than before, and it is a lot less likely to be successful on your own without using the service of one of the gate keepers.

[gggfhfdh]

Are we better with Kickstarter's new huge popularity than we were before

yes
objectively yes

[Christian Knudsen]

It was just an example of how the massive popularity of one thing can also have bad side effects and is not living inside a vacuum.

No, it wasn't an example. It was a theory you pulled out of thin air that so far has proved to be absolutely false.

Perhaps it also did good, but it is possible it is also bad in other ways.

A lot of things are possible. It's possible you're a really smart guy, but so far nothing supports that.

[PompiPompi]

Just look at how IndieGoGo compares to Kickstarter.
And IndieGoGo seems to be in a stalement.

http://www.google.com/trends/explore#q=kickstarter%2C%20indiegogo&cmpt=q

[Christian Knudsen]

Of course Kickstarter is bigger then Indiegogo! It's where everything started and it's serving the largest country economy-wise in the world! Nobody was arguing that Indiegogo was as big as Kickstarter. You were claiming that the success of Kickstarter was having a negative effect on Indiegogo. That's false.

And are you saying Indiegogo is in a stalemate because the graph goes down in the end? So does the Kickstarter graph.

Also, a "kickstarter" has become a general term. People even often use it to describe projects on Indiegogo! So that google data is naturally skewed by that.

[PompiPompi]

Well, what we see is that the kickstarter success doesn't trickle down to other crowd funding websites like you suggested. It might have a negative effect if as the result of Kickstarter's success IndieGoGo is in a stalement.
One simple thing to see is that usually a team would submit their project to either kickstarter or IndieGoGo but not both. Which means high profile teams will submit their project to Kickstarter and it will cause a self feeding loop.

It's a hard question to ask if we would be better without kickstarter, Maybe without kickstarter there would never be any interest in crowd funding, I am not sure. But what we can see is that Kickstarter's success does not trickle down.

[Schoq]

Well, what we see is that the kickstarter success doesn't trickle down to other crowd funding websites like you suggested.

How does that follow from that data?
I'm sorry to have to tell you but you're terrible at thinking with your brain.

[PompiPompi]

It follows in the sense that there is no correlation between Kickstarter's "popularity" and IndieGoGo's popularity.
If it did trickle down, we should have seen it correlate.

Maybe you are the one who don't know how to use your brain?

[s_l_m]

It follows in the sense that there is no correlation between Kickstarter's "popularity" and IndieGoGo's popularity.
If it did trickle down, we should have seen it correlate.

Maybe you are the one who don't know how to use your brain?

sorry, I am trying to see both sides here, but there is a correlation that has been proven by people in posts before this. Even your own graph shows a jump in indiegogo's popularity once kickstarter blew up.

[hanako]

There is some frustration in seeing people throw more money at the idea of a game than an actual game. Some of the same thing happens on Greenlight, where you see mass waves of interest at titles which are good at marketing and promising the world, while the game itself may not exist or may be drastically not what people expected.

Can be annoying for people who prefer to actually make a game and then try to sell it rather than sell Hopes And Dreams.

[PompiPompi]

s_l_m, on a global scale, kickstarter has rising by several orders of magnitudes more than IndieGoGo.

So there is either no correlation or very little correlation.

[ஒழுக்கின்மை (Paul Eres)]

There is some frustration in seeing people throw more money at the idea of a game than an actual game. Some of the same thing happens on Greenlight, where you see mass waves of interest at titles which are good at marketing and promising the world, while the game itself may not exist or may be drastically not what people expected.

Can be annoying for people who prefer to actually make a game and then try to sell it rather than sell Hopes And Dreams.

i second this. but this is even wider than kickstarter. most gamers care more about games that are upcoming, being hyped, and not out yet than they care about the games that are actually finished and ready for them to play. kickstarter just allows that difference in sentiment to actually be seen in the marketplace, with the indie games that don't exist now "outselling" the indie games that that do exist

[Udderdude]

There is some frustration in seeing people throw more money at the idea of a game than an actual game. Some of the same thing happens on Greenlight, where you see mass waves of interest at titles which are good at marketing and promising the world, while the game itself may not exist or may be drastically not what people expected.

Can be annoying for people who prefer to actually make a game and then try to sell it rather than sell Hopes And Dreams.

i second this. but this is even wider than kickstarter. most gamers care more about games that are upcoming, being hyped, and not out yet than they care about the games that are actually finished and ready for them to play. kickstarter just allows that difference in sentiment to actually be seen in the marketplace, with the indie games that don't exist now "outselling" the indie games that that do exist

In other words, they're addicted to hype. While there's no reason not to get potential gamers hyped up about a game before it's released, it's a bit different when the game may still not even have a line of code written for it.

[s0]

There is some frustration in seeing people throw more money at the idea of a game than an actual game. Some of the same thing happens on Greenlight, where you see mass waves of interest at titles which are good at marketing and promising the world, while the game itself may not exist or may be drastically not what people expected.

i think in a way it'd actually be a "good" thing if there's a huge wave of KS projects failing or turning out to be scams. it could serve a wake up call for backers.

would probably also mean that fewer legit projects get funded though.

[PompiPompi]

Yea, I also agree with the notion, just it was phrased a lot better than my jaw breaking arguments.
This is why I said that instead of donating to a kickstarter project, supporters can buy existing games instead.