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1059495 Posts in 43084 Topics- by 35042 Members - Latest Member: Xshining

November 01, 2014, 02:25:18 AM
TIGSource ForumsPlayerGeneralKickstarter supporters are suckers.
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Author Topic: Kickstarter supporters are suckers.  (Read 7804 times)
randomshade
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« Reply #40 on: November 17, 2012, 08:15:46 PM »

from what I understand, the "appbackr" backers aren't really sure of getting their money back, apprently they pledge money, which is delivered to the dev when the game is released (it's like an advance) , then the game revenus is distributed to the backers until they get their money+ a profit percentage.
So apprently, for the dev it's a cash advance and for the backer it's like a lottery, where if you don't back a succesful app, you won't get the money back.

Unless I didn't understand the system, in which case someone explain to me.

That is my understanding of the system (which doesn't make very much sense to me, but whatever.) I think technically instead of recoup investment + percentages, the backers buy a shit ton of copies at a discount (like pay $0.70 for a $0.99 app) and then sales of the app are attributed to the backers (in what order I have no idea) until all of their wholesale copies are sold. Basically the same thing as a raw recoup + percentage, but with a limited life span and IMO needlessly complex system.

OMFG: Finally reached Level 1 after 5 years! (largely of inactivity  Embarrassed)
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Capntastic
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« Reply #41 on: November 17, 2012, 08:17:27 PM »

Let's make it so the only people interested in supporting the game + the creator of the game are only interested in how much money it will make for investors
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moi
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« Reply #42 on: November 17, 2012, 08:24:49 PM »

from what I understand, the "appbackr" backers aren't really sure of getting their money back, apprently they pledge money, which is delivered to the dev when the game is released (it's like an advance) , then the game revenus is distributed to the backers until they get their money+ a profit percentage.
So apprently, for the dev it's a cash advance and for the backer it's like a lottery, where if you don't back a succesful app, you won't get the money back.

Unless I didn't understand the system, in which case someone explain to me.

That is my understanding of the system (which doesn't make very much sense to me, but whatever.) I think technically instead of recoup investment + percentages, the backers buy a shit ton of copies at a discount (like pay $0.70 for a $0.99 app) and then sales of the app are attributed to the backers (in what order I have no idea) until all of their wholesale copies are sold. Basically the same thing as a raw recoup + percentage, but with a limited life span and IMO needlessly complex system.

OMFG: Finally reached Level 1 after 5 years! (largely of inactivity  Embarrassed)
I'm glad you reached level 1, ocngratulations
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PompiPompi
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« Reply #43 on: November 18, 2012, 05:30:50 AM »

I think it makes sense for people buying the first\second tier in kick which gives them the game in return.
Basically they buy the game in a reduced price which is actually valuable.

But donating 100$ or even 1000$ and getting something of the worth of 20$ is a bit silly.
Especially if the team don't have much to show already.
It's a bit similar to "overpricing" your game. People are crying that AAA titles cost 60$ but they are willing to pay 100$ for something that is not even ready yet?
What is the difference between an evil corporate that charge 60$ for a game to make maximum profit, and a bunch of indie guys that ask for 100$ and give you back a lot less than you could get with 100$ had you spent it on existing indie games.

Edit: It would make sense to spend a lot of money on Kickstarter game projects had there were not much alternatives. But currently we are in a saturation of games. Why do you spend money on a game that is not even made yet and not spend the same money on a developer that already made a good game but he won't survive because people won't spend more than 10$ on a complete game and wait for a bundle instead...
« Last Edit: November 18, 2012, 05:43:58 AM by PompiPompi » Logged

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« Reply #44 on: November 18, 2012, 05:55:10 AM »

I suppose some people see value in something other than monetary. Personally I don't use much KS, but I'd imagine if I'd see something truly wonderful I would kick it with money I can spare (probably not even 100$ mind you) just to see it realize. However, I'd evaluate the track record and how trustworthy the author is first.
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« Reply #45 on: November 18, 2012, 06:30:50 AM »

Also, all the people who preach me that thinking about profit is evil\non indie\non artistic.
Unless you give all your games for free and don't ask for any donations, don't preach me about thinking of making a profit of a game. It makes you look hypocritical and dumb.

The whole "I am pretending to not making games for the money, though I secretly hope that if I make the game I want to make money will follow in abundance" BS.
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« Reply #46 on: November 18, 2012, 06:36:17 AM »

Although the thing they get when they throw their $100 into someone project isn't the equal value, the thing is, they sometime get something exclusive and limited, which only you and other people that throw $100 and more will have it.

And so the keyword, exclusive and limited.

You get something extra other than the game. Also, people that have extra buck will love to help people that need those extra buck to complete their project, given that the person with extra buck interested in that project, which they sees those project as promising and not a hoax.

Still can't grasp the idea? Just look at the Wasteland 2 Kickstarter, and browse though their reward.

Bottom line, it's their money. They're rich. You can't control what rich people does with their money. At least those money is spend on a project, instead of drug and illegal shit.
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« Reply #47 on: November 18, 2012, 06:48:39 AM »

Does any one of these rich people donate to some indie guy who already made a game and isn't doing so good? Or do they only donate when they get perks or when they are being told to donate?
If that is the case then we can disprove that it's just people who want to help others. There are many ways to help other indies. And I would think that helping indies who already made a game and didn't do so well is more "helpful".

So my guess it's mostly for the perks. Is a small model or poster worth $100 or $1000 because it's exclusive? Maybe, though it is most likely some rich guy's love with fancy glittery stuff, kind of like a shiny unique diamond or whatever. Only diamond is actually as valuable as it costs if you want to sell it.
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« Reply #48 on: November 18, 2012, 08:41:09 AM »

Also, all the people who preach me that thinking about profit is evil\non indie\non artistic.
Unless you give all your games for free and don't ask for any donations, don't preach me about thinking of making a profit of a game. It makes you look hypocritical and dumb.

The whole "I am pretending to not making games for the money, though I secretly hope that if I make the game I want to make money will follow in abundance" BS.

On this point, we definitely agree, everyone wants to be successful financially. But there is still something important about getting new and untested projects/concepts off the ground (making "the game I want to make"). It helps move the art form forward, and in financial terms, this type of thing is good for the industry. Back in the 2600 days, (most) everybody was releasing the same old shit, and not trying to invent new things, and people lot interest as a result so the industry crashed. But then look at minecraft, it was a fresh idea -or at least, If you are going to bring up dwarf fortress, the first time an idea was accessible to most people- and it made a ton of money because it was interesting, not just for notch, but for the people who it inspired, such as the top few people on xbox indie games. I am definitely not a "rich" person either, I work at a grocery store (although in 2 months I have a internship coding  Smiley). I just see the value in giving a bit of money in order to help a new idea get off the ground, and hopefully getting a good game in return
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Leon Fook
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« Reply #49 on: November 18, 2012, 09:19:41 AM »

@PompiPompi
You maybe right. I can see most people pledge onto a project because of the perk. If there's no perk or any ROI, people would less likely pledge any project. STILL, you can't say that people pledge on a project on Kickstarter purely because of the perk they will get. If people can't find any value on the perk, which will most likely something related to your game, they won't put even a single cent on your project. But if they have a certain interest in your perk, that mean they have a certain interest in your game/project. You won't see someone make a new RPG game and the perk is something like a gold bar or a super rare item from World of Warcraft.

I too kinda agree that there are many way to help a not-so-successful indie, but most of the case now is, if you didn't call for help, no one will notice you. Kickstarter is somehow like a place where you call for help, so people can notice you. You can't just wait forever for a golden turtle to swim by.

Ohh, and you won't gonna get a small model or a poster if you drop in $1000. That would be too stupid and silly for both the developer and the one that pledge. Except the "small model" you mean is 1/2 scale of one of your giant character in your game, like a human sized tortoise monster.
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s_l_m
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« Reply #50 on: November 18, 2012, 09:35:19 AM »

^this is a pretty good way to put it.

But on a side note, while I don't think that most people would, I have once donated to a project where I didn't get a perk. I wanted to support the creator (whose art I have been a fan of since I was like ten) and I didn't have enough money to reach a perk (I literally had five bucks to my name, but payday was the next day so its not like I was sacrificing everything)
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Christian Knudsen
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« Reply #51 on: November 18, 2012, 10:27:51 AM »

http://www.pompipompi.net/

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« Reply #52 on: November 18, 2012, 10:30:44 AM »

 Durr...?

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zalzane
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« Reply #53 on: November 18, 2012, 10:35:22 AM »

you need to change the color of your donate button so it doesnt blend in with the rest of the site
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gggfhfdh
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« Reply #54 on: November 18, 2012, 10:38:56 AM »

stop using your money in ways that i dont like
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Capntastic
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« Reply #55 on: November 18, 2012, 11:40:28 AM »

Hey Pompi how did you derive the prices of adding the rocket launcher model / heavy metal track?  Because some people wouldn't think of donating to a project without having a cost breakdown to see where their money is going.

Also, is the one person who donated five dollars to you a sucker?  What a jerk, right?
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zalzane
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« Reply #56 on: November 18, 2012, 12:06:30 PM »

I reserve the right to necro this thread in 2 years.
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PompiPompi
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« Reply #57 on: November 18, 2012, 01:10:01 PM »

Well that was a while ago and a mistake, that's all... I don't work on that game anymore. I should remove this page.
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Capntastic
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« Reply #58 on: November 18, 2012, 01:26:10 PM »

The last update was like a month ago so it's not like it's ancient history
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zalzane
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« Reply #59 on: November 18, 2012, 01:26:46 PM »

did you give that guy his 5 dollars back
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