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1028319 Posts in 41280 Topics- by 32897 Members - Latest Member: SilverDeoxys563

July 30, 2014, 09:22:24 PM
TIGSource ForumsPlayerGamesfemfreq tropes vs women is out
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Author Topic: femfreq tropes vs women is out  (Read 4784 times)
Alec S.
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« Reply #30 on: March 07, 2013, 09:16:46 PM »

I feel the time and money would better be used making videos trying to attract females to games and the games industry. Fund events or get clubs running that try to interest females in programming and game creation. Or show the positive side of games, make it a point to showcase and applaud games that actively avoid stereotyping and gender tropes.

Agreed, it could even have been used to pay a developer to make such a game, or used to make a new women empowering game studio
Anything is better than pointing out flaws and condemning past wrong that can't be changed

I disagree, criticism, deconstruction and analysis are incredibly useful tools.  You might as well tell the Errant Signals "well, why don't you go out and make a game with ludo-narrative cohesion and responsible subtext instead of talking about what games do or don't do this".  It's building upon a dialogue of gender roles in games which I think is ultimately valuable, really just as any other form of game analysis is valuable.  The analysis could be deeper, but it's only the first episode, so I'm hoping it'll improve as it goes on.
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AshfordPride
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« Reply #31 on: March 07, 2013, 09:20:41 PM »

Errant Signal wasn't given $160,000.
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Alec S.
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« Reply #32 on: March 07, 2013, 09:21:57 PM »

Yeah, I'm not sure why this needed a big kickstarter, but I'm glad it exists anyway.
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zanielyene
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« Reply #33 on: March 07, 2013, 09:45:20 PM »

you heard it here first

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feminazi
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« Reply #34 on: March 07, 2013, 09:50:40 PM »

>browses 4chan
>posts 4chan screen caps
>is fake gamer manbaby
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Derek
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« Reply #35 on: March 07, 2013, 09:59:46 PM »

I don't get the Big Bang Theory part. Explain?
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Landshark RAWR
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« Reply #36 on: March 07, 2013, 10:01:21 PM »

is "nerd blackface" and is popular with girlz
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SundownKid
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« Reply #37 on: March 07, 2013, 10:04:15 PM »

Depends which series you select to look at, Pokemon lets the player choose a female or male character since Crystal version.

In Pokemon, a female viewpoint doesn't make a big difference because there's barely any plot based on anything besides training and battling Pokemon. If you look at one of the console Pokemon games that DID have a larger plot, it has a male protagonist. Then you have the anime, with Ash, a male protagonist as well.
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deathtotheweird
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« Reply #38 on: March 07, 2013, 10:13:26 PM »

I disagree, criticism, deconstruction and analysis are incredibly useful tools.

No one said they weren't. What we did say is that we've already heard these arguments from many people over and over. The things she are saying are elementary. She's doing what people already have done, which is why me and others are suggesting alternatives of what people aren't doing but should.

She had fans and the opportunity to take what she and others have already said about these things, and spin it into something proactive rather then reactive. But, she's not. She's just saying the same old things.

Which isn't totally devoid of value, but the balance between people who do things and the people like her who are just saying things is completely fucked up.

Yes women have been portrayed in a not so positive light in the history of games. What  are you going to do about? Oh, you're going to make some videos repeating what everyone already has said. Well, okay. That is certainly her prerogative. Just not the course of action I would have taken if given the same opportunity and finances.
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Alec S.
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« Reply #39 on: March 07, 2013, 10:38:11 PM »

And this is only the first video, and it tackles a trope that, while fairly obvious, is also prevalent in enough games, particularly in some of Videogeme's cornerstones, that it seems a good jumping on point to discuss the issue of gender in games.  The video didn't seem particularly reactionary, but simply seemed to be building the conceit that certain common tropes prevalent in videogames are part of a culture of sexism.  For those who already accept that premise, hopefully the videos will go more in depth as they continue and highlight some positive examples (which she seemed to indicate she would be doing next episode).  For those who haven't really thought much about the topic, but are interested, the video seems like a fairly good introduction. 
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Blademasterbobo
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« Reply #40 on: March 07, 2013, 10:38:16 PM »

if you want a video series like that to be able to stand on its own, you have to cover basics in order for it to be a complete argument / package

i'd wait until she releases a few more videos before making any judgements

@poe i don't get why anyone thinks she's particularly annoying (compared to other youtube people, at least), aside from buying into all the bs that her main detractors throw at her... you seem to just dislike her because she says negative things about something youve wasted a large portion of your life on ? ? ?

why would she bring up metroid? unless maybe she was bringing up examples for ways in which games could change, which this video wasn't trying to do? bringing up one game series that wasn't sexist doesn't alter any of the points she was making. it's a systemic thing, and one exception doesn't suddenly change that.

and honestly, metroid is another example of the things she talks about. the latest metroid game (and basically the first one to try to tack any real personality onto samus) killed any sense of strength or independence the character had.
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Derek
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« Reply #41 on: March 07, 2013, 11:30:22 PM »

A passing mention of Metroid, even as an exception, would help her argument, I think.

I mean, it's like the difference between saying:

"Games are not art and here are examples why."

vs.

"Most games are not art. This one is close, but it's an exception that proves the rule."

Makes a world of difference if you're actually trying to reach people who disagree with you or are on the fence. And if it's a particularly contentious subject, I would think you'd want to lead with the latter and not the former.
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feminazi
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« Reply #42 on: March 08, 2013, 12:26:05 AM »

it makes zero sense to mention metroid when the topic of the episode is damsel in distress, as metroid doesn't even subvert the trope.
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deathtotheweird
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« Reply #43 on: March 08, 2013, 12:46:20 AM »

damsel in distress from their point of view is women being too weak (either physically or mentally) to save themselves.

samus does a pretty good job at subverting that trope, as she is a strong independent woman who don't need no man.
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feminazi
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« Reply #44 on: March 08, 2013, 12:50:39 AM »

oh yeah so metroid magically subverts the trope by simply not having it. good job. let's start listing every single game that doesn't feature the damsel in distress plot device, that'll be fucking relevant.
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