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TIGSource ForumsCommunityDevLogsEven the Ocean (Behind the Art series started!) OUT NOW!
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melos han-tani
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« Reply #1220 on: August 16, 2014, 06:16:15 PM »

Now that I think about it, I really need to delete that demo...it was from like 2 months ago for so. It's even an old player sprite! Reasons why below..


the important stuff:

Anyways, the occasional hiccups are sort of disturbing to hear about. What are your system specs? I get those too....I really have no idea why. It might be Garbage collection...will have to look into why.

Did the flickering lines happen in any other maps?

---

The lower level platforms, getting used to the meter, shield are just not really introduced well in the demo (didn't have time / not worth the effort): there's an entire intro gauntlet in the actual game where these things are a bit easier to get used to.

More detail on the meter: it's important it's rolling like that since it expands the platforming a bit more in terms of possibility - it's important to be able to take more damage and fill the bar and be able to recover. But yeah, in terms of the demo the problem is that the demo doesn't make an effort to introduce these things at a long enough scale - the final game should be better with that. also the final game isn't as 'difficult' as some of the parts in the demo, focus is less on trying to kill you now, more on just presenting fun/interesting situations.

Checkpoint is tmep, I agree it is a bit faint.

The demo gauntlet is a bit too hard for a first gauntlet I think so it's expected people would have trouble - the four chambers isn't really how I'd do level design now (avoiding precision platforming. Plus those rooms are a bit tricky, esp. the wind one). So I agree those are problematic too.

--

will answer your music quetion soon . what songs in particular? (musics at seagaia.bandcamp.com ) more at soundcloud.com/seagaia
« Last Edit: August 16, 2014, 06:22:23 PM by Sean Hogan (seagaia) » Logged

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melos han-tani
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« Reply #1221 on: August 16, 2014, 06:29:58 PM »

wait...if you press "\" does weird stuff pop up? maybe its cause that version is compiled in debug mode...though wait...i would want that in release for debugging crashses. argh! looking into it..
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« Reply #1222 on: August 16, 2014, 08:08:54 PM »

Oh okay so that picture was when you weren't moving? It seems like it has to do with GPUs and certain transparent tilesm...something with sampling...er anyways I think I just need to include an option to change this one setting with scaling tiles just so slightly that that gap doesnt happen. i can send a build later. if you could check on win7 and see too, that would really help , thanks!

could you email me at [email protected] ? i'll work on this tomorrow (I'll add a visual way to change this tile scale thing and have yuo tweak it in game to see if it goes away or not.)

hopefully that does fix it, if so i will add it as an option in-game, since it seems to vary based on peoples' GPUS


also i'll send you a build with the optimizaitons on. that should fix the lagging! (...maybe.) play it in the smae conditions/OS as when you had the problems.

i'll do this tomorrow (sunday)

--=

there's a few ways i'd do it now but they're sort of the same (just changing the pitch). I opened the project file, it looks like to achive that effectI just added a few cents of pitch modulation to the entire master track, seemingly randomly for effect. it's possible I might have doe this in real time to record the pitch envelope.

that track is just 3 soundfonts

Ultimate megadrive soundfont - nylon guitar (bassline)
"" - brightness (bass line in the more fast seciton)

'harp' (i dont know where i found this) (melody)

there's this weird Floaty delay thing I like to use (http://remaincalm.org/index.php/category/software/plugins) in REAPER

then some pitch shifting stuff/formant shifting with REAPER's built in pitch shifting
then apparently some bitcrushing (going to 14 bits, whatever that means. doesnt seem to make a difference tho


i can look at the other things too (the guitar and "brightness" (warm synth)) but I thik the harp has the most stuff on it.
---

for anyone using haxe reading this, I found this article:

http://gamehaxe.com/2012/09/14/hxcpp-built-in-debugging/

I was compiling the game in debug mode, which removes optimizations. However it turn sout useful things like stack traces, checking for null pointers, and stack line numbers are available WITH the compiler optimizations: you just compile the game in flashdevelop in release mode, but add some flags to the project file. very useful.

now I can run my game at 60 FPS , with that useful debug information, in my laptop's battery saving mode (usually the game would get stuck at 30-50 fps)
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melos han-tani
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« Reply #1223 on: August 16, 2014, 08:11:03 PM »

stil need to respnd to original question. later!
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« Reply #1224 on: August 17, 2014, 10:28:18 AM »

that's fine, no rush on that all (won't really matter till release anyways!). will try to get it out monday for you.


anyways further question on music. thanks for the Demo feedback, btw.

Seagaia, how long have you been writing music? I'm curious, since your style is very unique. I love the Anodyne soundtrack - that dreamlike, almost-out-of-tune wavery quality is so beautiful. I'm curious if that was intentional or just a byproduct of the samples you used? It really makes the soundtrack to me. Sort of Boards of Canada-esque.


I've been writing music constantly for a bit over 3 years now, got into it about 4 years ago, but have dabbled all my life in various ways (arranging songs via Midi files, etc.) I think a lot of my style comes from the focus I put on expression when playing Piano or Violin, since I was never very technically skilled with doing fast or complicated things....so I was always into the expression markers during orchestra, frustrated that others didn't follow them very well, etc, critical of that. That's sort of translated into my music composition style, I think, though definitely a lot of that now is informed by the games I'm making it for, but everything influences eachother.

For ETO, much of the music is from one synthesizer, Carbon2.


I've been trying to gravitate towards live-setting music, for dancing or listening. It's harder though, because most of my experience is in the narrow context I've been writing music (for games - specifically my games, haha). But idk, I'll put something out eventually...maybe. I use Ableton for that since I don't think the Carbon2 synth (easily) produces sounds that are good for a dance floor context. Plus Ableton is much easier for that sort of music stuff: ETO music tends to be much more free and spontaneous in the writing.
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melos han-tani
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« Reply #1225 on: August 18, 2014, 11:21:11 AM »

Sent you the build. Thanksf or the help!

and thanks!
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« Reply #1226 on: August 19, 2014, 06:39:26 AM »

fixed programming things yesterday!
and did some design

today...music stuff probably...and more design.
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« Reply #1227 on: August 19, 2014, 07:53:08 AM »

Sorry if I have overlooked this question being answered previously but is the game directly linked to Anodyne's world? Anodyne is one of my favourite games of all time and is hugely inspiring!
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melos han-tani
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« Reply #1228 on: August 19, 2014, 03:34:52 PM »

Sorry if I have overlooked this question being answered previously but is the game directly linked to Anodyne's world? Anodyne is one of my favourite games of all time and is hugely inspiring!

Oh wow, thanks!

No, it is not linked to Anodyne's world directly. I have played with the idea of linking it with something post-game-y but I feel like I'd rather have ETO just be very standalone and contained, though weird little mechanic breaking things are always fun.
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« Reply #1229 on: August 19, 2014, 03:56:57 PM »

Okay! Well it is still very exciting to see Even the Ocean coming to life.
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« Reply #1230 on: August 20, 2014, 11:56:00 AM »

Finished a draft of all the main intro dialogue (up until the point where the player leaves to choose which of the first 3 main dungeons to take on). It's definitely shaping up to be a more JRPG scale than we initially thought, though I guess we've been predicting that for a while. Hope you'll like it! I always get nervous... thinking about all the people irritatedly mashing through dialogue... but we'll probably have a lot of customization settings to change dialogue speed... and like... the story and characters are a big part of the game and really important to it so I should stop being so timid about it. I'm really committed to there being no filler in the game, so I don't think it should be boring.

There are certain touchstones that I always come back to when I start worrying about these things. 1) Analogue: A Hate Story, which is literally just reading but was both good and well-received. 2) Bravely Default, which is a 60 hour RPG where 90% of the dialogue is boring, predictable, superfluous, literally repeated... but I and many others still played through the game just because the battle system was OK and we wanted to see what happens.

As bad as it sounds, I honestly do take comfort in how terrible Bravely Default's writing was... I honestly think I can do better than a huge fancy Square Enix production, and that thought motivates me. Sometimes you need a little petty motivation working day in and day out on a long project.
 
Sorry if I have overlooked this question being answered previously but is the game directly linked to Anodyne's world? Anodyne is one of my favourite games of all time and is hugely inspiring!

Thanks! And yeah, like Sean said, it's not. It WAS initially more related... the nebulous original ideas were sort of that the "Even" section of the game was a story about a normal person in a "real world" sort of setting, while "the Ocean" was the character Even's dream. So we were sort of seeing it as parallel to Anodyne, which we saw as a dreamworld of Young's. But as you'll see a few posts up, a lot has changes, long story short: The Ocean became much more of a self-contextualized world, rather than a vague/abstract dreamworld, so the connection to Anodyne more or less faded away.
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« Reply #1231 on: August 20, 2014, 12:04:38 PM »

Thank you Jonathan! I'm very excited to experience the story of Even the Ocean although you saying that Anodyne was Young's dream world kind of blows my mind. I guess I had never made that final step.
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melos han-tani
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« Reply #1232 on: August 20, 2014, 05:58:11 PM »

Hmmm...this post was going to be about planned post-game stuff of Even the Ocean, but it's still in ways tied to themes of ETO  and the plot structure so I can't say much. ...I want to say stuff but you'll have to wait!!!

....maybe there will be post-game stuff...we'll see. that stuff tends to be last-minute ish anyways...

dunno. i'll talk it over with jon down the line whether it's appropriate. It would be in some weird ways, further de-abstracting the game in a srange way, at least the idea I have in mind. wouldn't be much extra work.

it feels like a good idea to put it in ....well see. at least in this case it will make sense thematically, rather than something so weird like Anodyne's post game which wasn't explained very well nor do I thikn I justified it too well. just a funny thing i can look upon when i'm 40 or 80 .

it would be short and sweet.

i've said too much


that being said, yeah, it is an intersting connection the planned apartment stuff with Even and stuff...that kind of applies to Aliph in some ways...so maybe...MAYBE ALIPH IS YOUNG!!! (She's not...sorry.)
---------



anyways today I did a little bit of Level design and thought about the future and some music.  Jon just uploaded some new dialogue which I'm reading for the first time. It's always a fun feeling! Takes me back to nearly 2 years ago where i read the first dialogue for Anodyne (The intro part up to the first temple.)

~memories~

Post-ETO.

 I think Jon and I both agree we need breaks to do smaller projects and pursue other interests for a while (if ETO does well, this will be good since we'll be able to not worry about business sides of things for a while.). After "recovering" and learning other things though, I definitely want to work on another large-ish game. Dunno what. Probably smaller than ETO..? We'll see. have to finish ETO first, but it feels closer.
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Loren Schmidt
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« Reply #1233 on: August 20, 2014, 08:05:12 PM »

Good luck with your RSI! I hope you read up on how to take care of it and take good care of yourself.

I had a tendinitis flare up a few years ago, so I have a lot of compassion for the position it puts you in. I wish you the best.
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melos han-tani
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« Reply #1234 on: August 20, 2014, 08:12:13 PM »

Thanks! it is better now. i basically just make workplace changes (external keyboard, elevated laptop monitor, ergonomic mouse, box for my feet, posture changes) and htings are much better. So that is good.
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« Reply #1235 on: August 21, 2014, 12:50:53 PM »

are you guys planning on streaming any more in the future? sorry if I am missing something and you are

been listening to eto music more lately w/ pikmin 2 music, I already told you about that but yeah
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melos han-tani
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« Reply #1236 on: August 21, 2014, 10:32:10 PM »

misc things today...music...level design, some scripting even!

i'd like to stream. im just really lazy onthat Cry

more pikmin music always
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« Reply #1237 on: August 22, 2014, 08:09:43 PM »

today was mostly break...I did a tiny bit of tiling and some other busywork. This weekend I might do something short for Ludum Dare, but I'd like to get started on putting in some of the dialogue Jon has written into the game. I'll also ontinue with doing the re-level-designing of the main Gauntlet areas in the game.

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« Reply #1238 on: August 23, 2014, 07:36:05 PM »

Hi Tigsource,

I'm working ona ludumdare thing, sort of.

Not much else this weekend yet.

hang i nthere!!

OH: fun facts - I did word counts, # of words in the game already is more than anodyne. jon wrote a bout 4-5k more for the first uh...10-15% of the game or so !!! soi'll be slaving away in th enext week putting that in.

the you will be able to very soon play a start-to-finish-broken slice of Even the Ocean!

WOW exciteding!
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« Reply #1239 on: August 24, 2014, 06:43:38 PM »

Not sure what the final ratio will be. Most of what Jon wrote over the past two weeks has been cutscene/story stuff. Games are a good storytelling medium. You get to be forced into the shoes of a character, though  you have to be careful what you let the player do, I guess. Too much and it could be a normal power fantasy sort of thing.

What's in the game already, a good part of it is more incidental..

The dialouge is paced ina way where hopefully people will be less likely to just mash their way through everything..we'll see.

I made a ludum dare game. It's more of a short 2-3 minute video/animation thing, though. About riding the red line from north to south


http://www.ludumdare.com/compo/ludum-dare-30/?action=preview&uid=7853


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