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[Renton]

What relationship?

[xerus]

I agree with Renton.

[Marmaduke Slam]

I would think that games could have no more negative effect on a relationship than, say, reading a lot (although it seems that things like reading books and playing games are treated differently when it comes to how people spend their time). Overall though, you just need to have priorities and decide which is more important to you.

[fullspectrum]

Lots of interesting stuff said over the weekend 

. Is it because she thinks you don't give her enough attention because you are playing games or is it because she doesn't like the type of games you are playing?

It's a mixture of those, but I am lucky in that she is understanding of what games mean to me, and she'll ususally compromise with the amount of time she will be happy with me spending playing. For example last night, we watched a movie together, but when she came and asked me if I wanted to, I was stalking some science lab in Fallout 3 so we agreed a time and watched the film a bit later.

I've had the dubious experience of getting out of a relationship because my girlfriend was more into playing games than I was. Getting second place in level of attention the two or three times a month a new game came out. Not fun. Doubly not fun when I would introduce -her- to a game and then be mostly ignored while she played it for four times as long as I did.

It's a bit strange. I spend hours a day making games but I don't think I can really be with someone who sees being a gamer as a lifestyle choice rather than a pass time.

I found this really interesting, especially that last bit - when your at the level of following games that some us here are, me included I fear, it certainly does feel like a lifestyle choice rather than a passtime sometimes. The isolation you talk about feeling of her passion for games is what i'm afraid I put my girl through. Just wish I could make the suckers like you 

 

[Titch]

I would think that games could have no more negative effect on a relationship than, say, reading a lot (although it seems that things like reading books and playing games are treated differently when it comes to how people spend their time). Overall though, you just need to have priorities and decide which is more important to you.

Reading a book IS different to playing a game. One is passive, the other is active. Sure you can get wrapped up in the narrative of a good story and want to continue reading it. Games demand all your attention nearly all the time, you aren't just passively receiving the information it's sending to you, you are having to send the game information out.

To put it in simple terms, if you are reading a book and get distracted the worst that is going to happen is you'll have to re-read the last page or so. If you get distracted playing a game it has a permanent effect on the state inside the game. Not to mention games are designed to condition you to like them. Books aren't messing with your head through Pavlovian psychiatry. So I think there is a big difference.

I think if you where looking for something more on par with games as a hobby, I would say something like model building or some kind of detail orientated art. Where the level of attention you can give the task at hand directly reflects the feedback you get from the interaction with what you are working on.

[agj]

I'm pretty sure that reading a book is not passive at all; the book doesn't go on by itself, like a movie, if you don't read it, and that's because you have to read it, which is an action that involves a lot of concentration.

[Gainsworthy]

I'm pretty sure that reading a book is not passive at all; the book doesn't go on by itself, like a movie, if you don't read it, and that's because you have to read it, which is an action that involves a lot of concentration.

Agreed. Books are perhaps the least passive form of media, on average. All that processing going on inside your mind, interpreting all the words, turning them into images, sounds, characters. Maintaining some sort of continuity, keeping all the information in your memory when old things return.

And getting distracted totally impacts on a book, too! A song playing in the background can totally ruin the mood, and general interactions with the outside can weaken what's going on inside.

From my experience.

[moi]

REading a book obliges you to mobilize your imagination (I said a book, not a comic).
When doing so, youu're recycling all your memories and real life experiences. Thus it can be said that reading books is somehow a formative experience.
It makes you think about life in general, about your past experiences and makes you consider other experiences happening to you (realistically).
Videogames OTOH leaves you constantly in a virtual world with artificial reward stimulations. Videogames trigger the same neural response that casino games or crack cocaine for example. Some people play MMOs so much that they lose their jobs and don't feed their children.
Also some people think that super mario, pokemon and final fantasy are real cultural masterpieces. Which is totally wrong.

[fullspectrum]

.... Videogames trigger the same neural response that casino games or crack cocaine for example.

Aint on topic, but from personal experience I can tell you videogmaes are not as addictive as crack! 

Not really Chutup But I imagine it's true.

[William Broom]

  Really...

[ஒழுக்கின்மை]

REading a book obliges you to mobilize your imagination (I said a book, not a comic).
When doing so, youu're recycling all your memories and real life experiences. Thus it can be said that reading books is somehow a formative experience.
It makes you think about life in general, about your past experiences and makes you consider other experiences happening to you (realistically).
Videogames OTOH leaves you constantly in a virtual world with artificial reward stimulations. Videogames trigger the same neural response that casino games or crack cocaine for example. Some people play MMOs so much that they lose their jobs and don't feed their children.
Also some people think that super mario, pokemon and final fantasy are real cultural masterpieces. Which is totally wrong.

This is not true of all games, I think you're overgeneralizing here. What about text adventures? What about games that are primarily text, like Planescape: Torment, Avernum, etc.?

[Xion]

Some people play MMOs so much that they lose their jobs and don't feed their children.

that's because they're being stupid people, not because games are being over-addictive. Some people eat so much food that they become morbidly obese and die of heart attacks or strokes.
I'm not going to say there isn't an amount of addiction there, but there's an amount of addiction to everything. You can get addicted to books, too. And not just the thoughtful kind that have meaning and depth, but really, really shitty books.

Anyway.

Are you really saying no videogame makes you think about your past experiences and memories? Because when I play games I hardly (read: don't) discard/disassociate my life from them for the duration of play. If there is a betrayal in the game, I am reminded of betrayals in my own life. Locations within the game may make me think of places I've been, or places I'd like to be, or places I'd like to create myself. It's not like games just suddenly turn all this off. It's not like the only reason games are played is because of "artificial reward stimulations." After all, books could be accused of doing the same, constantly wanting to know what's gonna happen next. What do you really get from it? You won't have a new house by the time you finish reading a book, or finish examining a painting, or finish playing a game (unless of course you're actually building as you read/examine/play), nor will your (physical) hunger be satisfied.

[Skofo]

Anyone that lets a video game get in the way of their relationship is an idiot. Play when she's not around? Of course, that's hard when you live together, but, really. Tits beat games any day 

Yes, I know (zomgjokeontigsource)? I'm saying that a human companion is much better than an electronic one.

Bleh, I hate the perspective that people like you have. Sorry if I'm wrongfully judgemental here, but despite what some people want you to think, sex is not the be all end all of fun and goals. It does not make you cool. You do not have to enjoy one set of tits more than playing video games (or traveling, or art, or <hobby>). I suggest you become more confident in your masculinity.

That said, there is no reason you can't have both. I don't think you should have to adjust your lifestyle and adored hobbies for someone else. If your friend or spouse is upset by it, try to get them into it. Try to make them see the light and have fun with it. More often than not people feel lonely when other people play video games (or do other hobbies) because they do not see any meaning in it, so trying to get them into it and let them see why you enjoy it. Sometimes it is, in fact, because their significant other plays too much for them to handle. My personal advice is to consider it a personality and lifestyle collision, and to avoid any extra stress for both parties I suggest to try to find a compromise, even if that compromise may be to officially break up. Don't abandon your hobbies and everything you enjoy doing in life just to have a set of tits, like Tet seems to be suggesting.

I would think that games could have no more negative effect on a relationship than, say, reading a lot (although it seems that things like reading books and playing games are treated differently when it comes to how people spend their time). Overall though, you just need to have priorities and decide which is more important to you.

Reading a book IS different to playing a game. One is passive, the other is active. Sure you can get wrapped up in the narrative of a good story and want to continue reading it. Games demand all your attention nearly all the time, you aren't just passively receiving the information it's sending to you, you are having to send the game information out.

To put it in simple terms, if you are reading a book and get distracted the worst that is going to happen is you'll have to re-read the last page or so. If you get distracted playing a game it has a permanent effect on the state inside the game. Not to mention games are designed to condition you to like them. Books aren't messing with your head through Pavlovian psychiatry. So I think there is a big difference.

I think if you where looking for something more on par with games as a hobby, I would say something like model building or some kind of detail orientated art. Where the level of attention you can give the task at hand directly reflects the feedback you get from the interaction with what you are working on.

That is simply not true. You can stop reading a book just like you can pause/stop playing games. You think that way because you might just not enjoy reading books as much as grinding and doing raids on World of Warcraft or scoring headshots in Counter-Strike. I think that we can all logically agree that if you stop in the middle of either one, the mood that the book/game put you in is usually disrupted or ruined.

Another reason why what you said is false is because not all games demand constant attention (you probably just want to give them constant attention, at least relative to books). Almost all games out there have a pause function, are turn-based and/or are not very action-packed. Even if you they do not have those things, you can always just stop playing. The world does not end and you do not stop having fun forever when there happens to be a power outage or someone turns off your game. What happens then is exactly the same thing that happens when you stop reading a book: nothing, except your mood may become slightly off.

that's because they're being stupid people, not because games are being over-addictive. Some people eat so much food that they become morbidly obese and die of heart attacks or strokes.
I'm not going to say there isn't an amount of addiction there, but there's an amount of addiction to everything. You can get addicted to books, too. And not just the thoughtful kind that have meaning and depth, but really, really shitty books.

Video games and books and the stupidity of video games and books are subjective. Some people may think that video games are worthless or that some books are really shitty, but others do not. Why do you think that it's so wrong to enjoy what you want to do and die enjoying what you want to do? Calling other people stupid because they're enjoying themselves is, frankly, stupid. Even if it does result in the hurt feelings and essential abuse of other blood-filled meatbags. Nothing matters in the end; enjoy yourself.

[Marmaduke Slam]

The main difference with (some) games and books that I see is that you can put down books whenever you want and not lose any progress, whereas with games that lack quicksave, you either have to let whatever is demanding your attention wait a minute or so (and seeing as a lot of people think games a waste of time, they frown upon being told to wait a minute while you save) or turning it off and losing game time. You could pause if it's for a little while, but there's still the problem of convenience. Of course, most of the time it's only a couple of minutes of playing (unless the game is really badly designed) and if it's not that's more the game's fault and something you can just let go if the matter at hand is important.

Video games and books and the stupidity of video games and books are subjective. Some people may think that video games are worthless or that some books are really shitty, but others do not.

I agree with this, just because someone thinks it's a waste of time, doesn't mean it is, if you enjoy it (and it's not harmful to others), I don't see why not. Just because someone thinks it's a waste of time doesn't mean they have to hate you doing it if you enjoy it.

[Seth]

Some people play MMOs so much that they lose their jobs and don't feed their children.

that's because they're being stupid people, not because games are being over-addictive. Some people eat so much food that they become morbidly obese and die of heart attacks or strokes.
I'm not going to say there isn't an amount of addiction there, but there's an amount of addiction to everything. You can get addicted to books, too. And not just the thoughtful kind that have meaning and depth, but really, really shitty books.

Saying people are stupid for being addicted to something, I think, is sort of heartless.  It's terribly easy to become addicted to something, and that may say something about the addict, but I wouldn't say they were stupid.

Anyway you're grossly oversimplifying.  It is possible to become addicted to books, but that doesn't mean that the "amount of addiction" is the same.  I challenge you to find one account of someone who forgot to feed his children because he was reading too much, or someone who read for 50 hours straight and then keeled over.  Games are more addictive than books a lot like gambling in poker games is more addictive than playing monopoly with your family (you could even say playing poker for cookies with your family)--there is a more intense and involving risk/reward system.

[Marmaduke Slam]

Games are more addictive than books a lot like gambling in poker games is more addictive than playing monopoly with your family (you could even say playing poker for cookies with your family)--there is a more intense and involving risk/reward system.

This.

[agj]

Also some people think that super mario, pokemon and final fantasy are real cultural masterpieces. Which is totally wrong.

Perhaps they are, in a postmodern sense.

Why do you think that it's so wrong to enjoy what you want to do and die enjoying what you want to do? (...) Even if it does result in the hurt feelings and essential abuse of other blood-filled meatbags. Nothing matters in the end; enjoy yourself.

You sound like you're addicted yourself. Relationships with other living beings are essential to our existence; media and art are not. There is more to life than 'enjoying yourself'. Seriously.

[Skofo]

Why do you think that it's so wrong to enjoy what you want to do and die enjoying what you want to do? (...) Even if it does result in the hurt feelings and essential abuse of other blood-filled meatbags. Nothing matters in the end; enjoy yourself.

You sound like you're addicted yourself. Relationships with other living beings are essential to our existence; media and art are not. There is more to life than 'enjoying yourself'. Seriously.

Like? Every act you do tries to help you enjoy yourself more. Why do you keep playing that 'addiction' card as if addiction is a bad thing? Being addicted is simply liking something enough to keep wanting to do it and preferring to do it over other things. There is nothing wrong with that from an existential standpoint, but you consider it from your biological/sociological standpoint a bad thing because your mind perceives a low chance that people who are "addicted" to something will help make you feel happier. Getting into relationships makes some people happy, too. The point I was making was that some people might not truly like having particular relationships over something you enjoy more like playing games, so there is absolutely no reason to feel obligated to be in one or help others if you don't want to, despite what society might want you to do. Significant relationships are most definitely not essential to human existence, I don't know how you could have come to that conclusion. Everything lacks significance in the grand scheme of things as far as it's been proven, so logically there isn't anything better to do than have fun.

What is more to life than having fun, being happy and enjoying yourself?

[ஒழுக்கின்மை]

And suddenly Skofo's bad behavior on this forum is explained in a single post.

[Skofo]

And suddenly Skofo's bad behavior on this forum is explained in a single post.

Mind you, I am in a relationship. I'm just saying that people should not feel obligated to be in them if they feel happier doing other things. It is certainly not 'stupid' like some people here are trying to get across.

And I am not bad. What are you talking about? 

EDIT: Also, I do enjoy empathizing with people. I enjoy debate as well. Why is a person considered heartless because he likes to argue his perspective? (Sorry if this is not what you were trying to imply.)