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[Edmund]

Well all actions you do for each of the puzzles also have meaning to what each of the planets represent. and if you go back to earth as you explore you do notice the earth is shrinking... but again i wasnt saying i perfected it with aether, i said i was trying to do it with aether. Its a personal goal of mine.

Yeah, I know you weren't saying you perfected it, but I was still confused because I didn't think Aether even attempted it, and everything you described is just visual elements which are affected by playing the game but which have no gameplay impact themselves.  But I think we might just have different ideas of what it means to communicate through gameplay; I was looking for the interaction itself to communicate something, where I think you're looking for the interaction to have visual effects that progress the story.  (For example, more like Samorost than The Marriage.)

I still think the preference for pictures over text is totally arbitrary in that context.  Or either context, really -- why would it matter if you use text or pictures to convey the scene?  They're just different means to the same end.

yeah i guess we are just talking about different things, i was more talking about physical actions having a relative effect on story or mood, using symbolism not something where all graphics could be replaced by colorless boxes and still send a message, but that idea is pretty intriguing. i guess what i was going for is something more along the lines of making a story/mood with gameplay/graphics that could be played by anyone in the world and they would understand/feel it. more of a language barrier thing.

i did play the marriage, but never though about going that abstract with my work, thought it might be fun to try down the road.

-Edmund

[Zaphos]

yeah i guess we are just talking about different things, i was more talking about physical actions having a relative effect on story or mood, using symbolism not something where all graphics could be replaced by colorless boxes and still send a message, but that idea is pretty intriguing. i guess what i was going for is something more along the lines of making a story/mood with gameplay/graphics that could be played by anyone in the world and they would understand/feel it. more of a language barrier thing.

That makes sense, then

That is a pretty cool goal.  I don't think it's the right direction for everyone, but I'm excited to see what you do with it!

[DecipherOne]

WOW! and not the MMO. It's amazing to see how much the participation for this compo has grown. Interesting to see a lot of projects that people have been working on for a while submitted. Good luck to all 

[Synnah]

(just tried out where is my heart there, graphically (stylistically and substancewise, and gameplay-wise it has a lot of potential, though the sound effects aren't the best at the moment).

I really liked Where is my Heart, too. It definitely has a lot of potential, and I love the art style (Which seems to have been strongly inspired by Psychosomnium).

We should nominate someone to play through Laxius Force, to see if it's any good.

[jeb]

I went from being somewhat confident I'd clinch a finalist spot to suddenly not being so sure in a hurry!  But it's great to see so many neat things going on in indie-land.

Don't get too disappointed if you aren't nominated. There's a degree of lottery involved as well. Last year the Penumbra team was quite upset about the technology category...

EDIT: Linkage... http://tigsource.com/articles/2007/12/03/10th-annual-igf-finalists-announced#comments

[increpare]

We should nominate someone to play through Laxius Force, to see if it's any good.

You volunteering? 

[Alex May]

Haha Seol is on the penumbra team? it suddenly all makes sense after all these years

[Edmund]

Don't get too disappointed if you aren't nominated. There's a degree of lottery involved as well. Last year the Penumbra team was quite upset about the technology category...

EDIT: Linkage... http://tigsource.com/articles/2007/12/03/10th-annual-igf-finalists-announced#comments

Im positive that the "technical excellence" category isnt ever judged properly (at least from my point of view) they need to just call it "excellence in programming" so its more straight forward. i dont know how many years ive seen games get into the finals on tech and even win when their game doesn't do anything excellent with their tech.

[increpare]

Im positive that the "technical excellence" category isnt ever judged properly (at least from my point of view) they need to just call it "excellence in programming" so its more straight forward.

How about something along the lines of 'technical innovation'?

[Synnah]

We should nominate someone to play through Laxius Force, to see if it's any good.

You volunteering? 

Nah, man, I'm... uh, allergic to RPG Maker games.

At any rate, I just realised that it's actually shareware, and you have to pay to play any longer than an hour!

[dc2005]

My impression that anything made with the free Source Engine SDK would be classified as a mod.  But maybe I'm wrong about that.

Hi, I'm one of the members of ACE Team, developer of Zeno Clash.

you can read more about us here (a couple of interviews in a russian site):

ACE Team interview: http://playhard.ru/Article.aspx?id=3219
Zeno Clash interview: http://playhard.ru/Article.aspx?id=3218 (this one is a bit outdated since we are currently working with another composer)

You can see that we are a really small group and we have been working on this game for over a year already!

I hope that we can get a nomination since any exposure would be great for our studio. It's really hard to start a studio from scratch with an innovating title like ours since many people see it as a risk, so any help will be welcome. (and for those who are wondering this game is completely self funded)

PS: I have played most of the games in the list, but I'm still waiting for Blueberry Garden

[Jabberwocky]

I went from being somewhat confident I'd clinch a finalist spot to suddenly not being so sure in a hurry!  But it's great to see so many neat things going on in indie-land.

Don't get too disappointed if you aren't nominated. There's a degree of lottery involved as well. Last year the Penumbra team was quite upset about the technology category...

EDIT: Linkage... http://tigsource.com/articles/2007/12/03/10th-annual-igf-finalists-announced#comments

Thanks for linking that thread - interesting read!

In my opinion Seol did come across as a poor loser, and should have stayed away from directly criticizing some of the other finalists.  Still, I agree with him that his game should have been a finalist in the technical excellence category.

Many of the arguments against him were based on the opinion that "technical excellence" does not mean "technical complexity", and that technical innovation was actually more important for this category.  Since there is already a separate category for innovation, I would have actually thought more along Seol's lines, that a game showing off many highly complex technical features should have clinched a finalist spot. 

The other interesting part of that thread is the debate on whether 2D games are more favored by the IGF than 3D.  My sense is that quirky, novel games tend to do very well at the IGF, which does favor 2D games somewhat.  This isn't a bad thing; mainstream tends to prefer 3D games, and the IGF is trying to represent a different kind of game.  This doesn't mean that 3D games can't do well at IGF, they just need to be really good.  People seemed really pissed after "Savage: The Battle for Newerth" won in 2004 - largely due to that game's budget, but also perhaps because it felt too mainstream.  I think the IGF may somewhat shy away from entries with a mainstream commercial feel after the 2004 backlash. 

Just my thoughts, having watched the competition over the years.

[dc2005]

I went from being somewhat confident I'd clinch a finalist spot to suddenly not being so sure in a hurry!  But it's great to see so many neat things going on in indie-land.

Don't get too disappointed if you aren't nominated. There's a degree of lottery involved as well. Last year the Penumbra team was quite upset about the technology category...

EDIT: Linkage... http://tigsource.com/articles/2007/12/03/10th-annual-igf-finalists-announced#comments

I played the demo, and it certainly seemed impressive from a technical point of view, specially if you think that they made the engine from scratch...

[dc2005]

mainstream tends to prefer 3D games, and the IGF is trying to represent a different kind of game.  This doesn't mean that 3D games can't do well at IGF, they just need to be really good.  People seemed really pissed after "Savage: The Battle for Newerth" won in 2004 - largely due to that game's budget, but also perhaps because it felt too mainstream.  I think the IGF may somewhat shy away from entries with a mainstream commercial feel after the 2004 backlash. 

I can see your point, but then I remember all the people asking for novel ideas in the mainstream and how could they benefit from looking at the indie developers taking risks.

I think it's good to have both, the more experimental, art games that will never make it into the mainstream since they are ideologically the opposite of it, and on the other side the more "mainstream" indie games (if you can call them like that) that keep trying to push new ideas and innovation (from a gameplay, art, story, etc) to the public.

People still makes jokes about Narbacular Drop going mainstream, but they took an idea that they loved and showed the mainstream studios that things can be done differently...

[Jabberwocky]

My impression that anything made with the free Source Engine SDK would be classified as a mod.  But maybe I'm wrong about that.

Hi, I'm one of the members of ACE Team, developer of Zeno Clash.

you can read more about us here (a couple of interviews in a russian site):

ACE Team interview: http://playhard.ru/Article.aspx?id=3219
Zeno Clash interview: http://playhard.ru/Article.aspx?id=3218 (this one is a bit outdated since we are currently working with another composer)

You can see that we are a really small group and we have been working on this game for over a year already!

I hope that we can get a nomination since any exposure would be great for our studio. It's really hard to start a studio from scratch with an innovating title like ours since many people see it as a risk, so any help will be welcome. (and for those who are wondering this game is completely self funded)

PS: I have played most of the games in the list, but I'm still waiting for Blueberry Garden

Hey dc2005,

Zeno Clash looks really awesome!

I've been thinking about your entry over the last couple days, usually while I have a cigarette and my mind naturally wanders.  Specifically, whether licensing the source engine put you at too much of an unfair advantage over other indie teams.

What I ended up deciding was that if I were a judge, I would probably nominate your game for certain categories, such as "audio" and "visual art", since obviously you guys have done fantastic work here.  I don't think your game should be nominated in other areas, such as "technical".  The real one I'm stuck on is whether a Source Engine-driven game is indie enough to be considered for the Seamus Mcnally award.  Tough call.

Anyway, good luck at the IGF, and I'm excited to see more of your game!