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[phi6]

Hey guys,

Just working on a new prototype for a platforming game, so I first wanted to nail the physics as a priority. Would appreciate any feedback on the physics and platforming "feel" and tightness of controls

Version 1: http://phidinh.com/games/platformer/Web.html

Version 2 now much less floaty, less sliding and much more responsive acceleration:
http://phidinh.com/games/platformer/v2/Web.html

Version 3, tweaked air and water physics. Jet streams for fun!
http://phidinh.com/games/platformer/v3/Web.html

Verion 4, wall jump and pushable blocks.
http://phidinh.com/games/platformer/v4/Web.html

Also there are slopes, curved surfaces, water physics, swimming, moving platforms, jet streams and some underwater audio filter stuff.

Controls: WASD or Arrow Keys. Double jump enabled.

Apart from general collision detection and raycasting, no rigid body physics was used. All custom old school platforming physics code - I always find it is much better this way as it gives me complete control and platformers aren't supposed to be realistic anyway.

Cheers!

[Quicksand-S]

It's not bad at all.

The character takes a little too long to get up to speed for my liking, but I may be in the minority there.

The jumping feels a little floaty to me. I think the gravity could be increased slightly, but it's pretty close to where I'd like it. I do like the amount of control I have in the air, but whether or not it's "right" really depends on what sort of game you're making.

What sort of game are you making? For example, a difficult, retro-ish game might have more limited air control so you need to commit to every action and live with the consequences.

My only "major" concerns have nothing to do with the physics. I hate using Up or W for jumping, and the camera is really loose, but I imagine both of those things might be adjusted after the physics are finalized.

[jgrams]

I'd second the comment about it depending on the kind of game you want to make. To me, the current pace feels...contemplative. Definitely not like a fast-paced arcade game. But even for a dreamy exploration-type game I think I'd turn up your run speed a little, especially if the player may have to backtrack. I think it would get annoying travelling long distances at that pace.

Maybe a little more oomph when you're starting from a standing position? And a little more slide when you coast to a stop rather than turning around?

The jump height matches your scenery well, but it seems high for the size of your character. So it feels like a small character moving around in an oversized world.

This is probably just an odd perception on my part, but it feels like it takes longer to turn around when you're against a wall than when you're out in mid-air. Are you killing the velocity properly when you hit a wall? Or sticking your character to the wall in some way?

--Josh

[phi6]

Thanks guys for your comments! Yep definitely focusing on the physics and feel right now before I think about the controls and camera stuff. As for what type of game this is going to be - honestly I have no idea, just experimenting for now!

I've just uploaded a new version, now with slopes, limited double jumps, water physics and swimming. Turned up acceleration quite high now with a max speed cap, and gravity is a lot stronger so feels less floaty. Friction is very high, almost no slide. I think I'm after quite a twitchy feel.

http://phidinh.com/games/platformer/v2/Web.html

[phi6]

Just updated to yet another version - fixes some bugs with double jumping and also adds camera panning triggers to highlight "important" areas. Obviously these aren't actual important areas as there's no gameplay yet but the component is re-usable and will be handy for future level design.

[phi6]

And another one! That's probably it for today - new version adds moving platforms and some audio stuff.

Again, it's not for any specific planned game, just an experimental prototype for when I do decide to make a platformer in the future.

[Zaphos]

Seems a bit funky that it does tiny little hops when going down a slope (but not when going up).

I think it might help to have a hypothetical game in mind even if you don't intend to make it.  Or alternatively, to just make the prototype into a tiny game.  Otherwise, there isn't much of a basis to evaluate your choices.

[Quicksand-S]

I agree with Zaphos that it's difficult to give useful input without having at least some idea of what this will be used for.

For example, I think the water works well for small ponds as it is but it would be unbearably slow to travel through if levels had underwater sections.

As for the ramp, it might be a good idea to make the player "stick" to it when going down. What I generally do is make it so that the player snaps to the ramp as long as their vertical speed is in a certain range. That way, I get smooth movement up and down the ramp while making sure that if the player jumps from, or falls onto, the ramp they won't have any weird issues.

On another topic, I had a bit of a graphical issue where the surface of the water was flickering while it was in shadow. It looked like Z-fighting.

I like the adjusted speed and acceleration. The double-jump feels all right.

[CogentInvalid]

I think you have way too much acceleration while in the air, to the point where just tapping the key to slow you down can send you straight in the opposite direction. The controls would probably be smoother if you had the current, fast acceleration on the ground, but had the acceleration in the air be much slower.

[hmm]

Think its pretty good. Only thing is you fall a little bit too fast while under water.

Very nice so far!

[phi6]

OK new version added:

http://phidinh.com/games/platformer/v3/Web.html

Changes:

Tweaked air acceleration slightly so you don't change direction too quickly mid-air. I'd still like to have some control though as it always seems too stiff if you don't let the player change direction after jumping.

With regards to water physics - you are all correct, it feels totally wrong as I naively just halved every single value. What I really wanted to do was to have water multipliers for water gravity, water jump, water acceleration and so on, so I can tweak and fine tune each value separately.

Therefore this new version now has really slow falling gravity when in water (so you feel quite buoyant) but not to make the jumping and swimming too slow. Another reason why I love having custom platforming physics and NOT using something like Box2D. It's so much easier to tweak little things like this to exactly how I want them to feel, this would have been a pain to achieve in a proper rigid body physics engine.

Oh and I added jet streams as well, just for fun!

What game?

I suppose it is difficult to critique if I don't have a game in mind, I'm thinking a Cave Story style open world metroidvania but with lots of focus on exploration instead of combat. There will be some water but mainly shallow pools and small tanks of fluid rather than large underwater levels.

[suggo]

It all feels pretty good to me so far. I wouldn't mind the under water stuff the way it is as long as it isn't for long periods, like the others said. I think the sliding momentum after you stop moving is just a tiny bit too long for my liking but that may just be me personally.

The only thing I found that really stood out was the bouncing as you walk up and down the slope.

Good stuff

[phi6]

"I think the sliding momentum after you stop moving is just a tiny bit too long for my liking but that may just be me personally."

Do you mean in general or just underwater?

Yeah the bouncing thing is annoying, and difficult to solve with the way I've coded the physics. But I think with the right walking animation it might actually look quite cute to have the character bouncing down the slop - we'll see

[Quicksand-S]

If you want a character to "bound" down a slope, you should probably exaggerate it a bit more, otherwise it will be very obvious to some people that you're just trying to hide a problem.

Ideally, though, you should probably fix it even if it means modifying your physics setup slightly. Purposely leaving in a bug doesn't seem like a great idea. Also, depending on how your game is coded, jittery slope traversal could make it so that the player is sometimes unable to jump (ex. if they're in the air during on of their tiny vibrations).

[phi6]

I did inadvertently solve that particular slope jumping problem by having a slight jump tolerance, so you don't have to be directly on the ground to jump if and only if you were on the ground a fraction of time before. This allows you to jump off a ledge by running off it even if you are slightly coming off it midair - of course this eliminates "hardcore" pixel perfect platforming but in return gives the player a very tiny bit of time to make his decision. So having this feature in also fixed jumping off slopes.

Of course you are right, while I think the feature is a good addition for jumping off ledges, it is obviously just hiding the sloping bug issue. I'm going to go away and have a think this afternoon about fixing it!

[suggo]

I just meant the sliding with movement in general.

[phi6]

Really? I upped friction quite a lot from Version 1, it's very subtle now there is almost no sliding at all. Perhaps there should be no sliding at all... but I do like the feeling of smoothness it comes with!

[phi6]

Alright - just updated V3 to have slopes slow down the player depending on steepness. Obviously it started looking and feeling weird when the player was zipping up and down steep sections without hindrance

There are some test slopes in the upper area of the level.

The bad news I still haven't found a good solution to fix the bouncing downhill yet

[phi6]

New version now added:

http://phidinh.com/games/platformer/v4/Web.html

Now with wall jump and block pushing mechanics. Blocks use the same physics as the player so they will get slowed down by water etc. I've also added a very difficult vertical overhang section for testing wall jump effectiveness. A bit of a homage to The Valley Rule, basically it represents the trickiest wall jump sections. You can find it on the very top right corner of the map (you'll need to travel up the jetstream to get there).

Would appreciate some feedback on wall jump feel in particular. Cheers!

[Quicksand-S]

I think the sliding speed while against a wall could be increased slightly, but it works well.

I feel like the elevator beam thing should reset my double-jump so that special acrobatic feats are possible using the momentum from the beam.

Pushing the box was a bit jittery, but felt all right otherwise.