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TIGSource ForumsDeveloperPlaytesting404Sight - A game about net neutrality
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RetroYetiGames
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« on: November 04, 2014, 12:06:28 PM »

Hello everyone!

We're a dozen graduate students working hard to make a game that helps spread the word about net neutrality. We recently entered alpha and submitted to IGF, but we know we have a long way to go. We would love some feedback on what you like, what you don't like, and what you wish was there.

404Sight is a first (or third) person playground runner with the aesthetics inspired by Mirror's Edge added to the level revealing of Devil's Tuning fork, equipping the player with a foresight ability to reveal helpful and harmful areas within the level. It shows players what it'd be like to be in an environment where the hidden fast and slow lanes are apparent, but only if they have the right tools. It takes a bit of planning to plot a course through an area full of hazards, especially if the corporations themselves are actively trying to impede you.

The loss of net neutrality is one of the biggest threats of our time, and it seems like no one's really talking about it. So we set out to make a game that highlighted elements of net neutrality and tried to create an experience where players could take an active role in acting against the enemies of an open internet.







Check out our trailer!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6zu21Sgxn8E


You can find the latest build on our website http://404sight.com/builds
Questions for this build: How do you feel about the foresight ability? Are the levels too hard or too easy? Do you prefer to play with a controller or a keyboard and mouse?

Thank you so much for your help!
« Last Edit: December 23, 2014, 12:11:54 AM by RetroYetiGames » Logged
debugchicken
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« Reply #1 on: November 08, 2014, 02:45:16 PM »

After downloading 287 MB, going through a installer, the game does not run. It says:

XAPOFX1_5.dll is missing
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« Reply #2 on: November 08, 2014, 03:58:36 PM »

After downloading 287 MB, going through a installer, the game does not run. It says:

XAPOFX1_5.dll is missing

Looks like you'll need to update DirectX! After a bit of troubleshooting, it turns out that's a DirectX component. Arma 3 and Borderlands have had this same issue, according to google.

You could also try a computer reboot if you haven't yet.

From the internet:

Quote
The xapofx1_5.dll error might be a fluke and a simple restart could clear it up completely.
Install the latest version of Microsoft DirectX. Chances are, upgrading to the latest version of DirectX will fix thexapofx1_5.dll not found error.

Note: Microsoft often releases updates to DirectX without updating the version number or letter so be sure to install the latest release even if your version is technically the same.

Note: The same DirectX installation program works with all versions of Windows including Windows
7, 8, Vista, XP, and more. It will replace any missing DirectX 11, DirectX 10, or DirectX 9 file.

Thanks for letting us know!
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debugchicken
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« Reply #3 on: November 08, 2014, 04:29:24 PM »

After downloading 287 MB, going through a installer, the game does not run. It says:

XAPOFX1_5.dll is missing

Looks like you'll need to update DirectX! After a bit of troubleshooting, it turns out that's a DirectX component. Arma 3 and Borderlands have had this same issue, according to google.

You could also try a computer reboot if you haven't yet.

From the internet:

Quote
The xapofx1_5.dll error might be a fluke and a simple restart could clear it up completely.
Install the latest version of Microsoft DirectX. Chances are, upgrading to the latest version of DirectX will fix thexapofx1_5.dll not found error.

Note: Microsoft often releases updates to DirectX without updating the version number or letter so be sure to install the latest release even if your version is technically the same.

Note: The same DirectX installation program works with all versions of Windows including Windows
7, 8, Vista, XP, and more. It will replace any missing DirectX 11, DirectX 10, or DirectX 9 file.

Thanks for letting us know!

Well, updating it seemed a little tricky so I solved the problem by putting the DLL aside with the EXE.
Luckly it was the only DLL needed, so please consider putting the DLL yourselves in the next release.

Well the game is too laggy on this "old" (2007) pc I am at. I'll try again When i get back home.

but FYI, geforce 8600 GT on a dual core 3 GHZ is not enough.
« Last Edit: November 08, 2014, 04:37:58 PM by mirrorlink » Logged
RetroYetiGames
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« Reply #4 on: November 08, 2014, 05:19:45 PM »

After downloading 287 MB, going through a installer, the game does not run. It says:

XAPOFX1_5.dll is missing

Looks like you'll need to update DirectX! After a bit of troubleshooting, it turns out that's a DirectX component. Arma 3 and Borderlands have had this same issue, according to google.

You could also try a computer reboot if you haven't yet.

From the internet:

Quote
The xapofx1_5.dll error might be a fluke and a simple restart could clear it up completely.
Install the latest version of Microsoft DirectX. Chances are, upgrading to the latest version of DirectX will fix thexapofx1_5.dll not found error.

Note: Microsoft often releases updates to DirectX without updating the version number or letter so be sure to install the latest release even if your version is technically the same.

Note: The same DirectX installation program works with all versions of Windows including Windows
7, 8, Vista, XP, and more. It will replace any missing DirectX 11, DirectX 10, or DirectX 9 file.

Thanks for letting us know!

Well, updating it seemed a little tricky so I solved the problem by putting the DLL aside with the EXE.
Luckly it was the only DLL needed, so please consider putting the DLL yourselves in the next release.

Well the game is too laggy on this "old" (2007) pc I am at. I'll try again When i get back home.

but FYI, geforce 8600 GT on a dual core 3 GHZ is not enough.

Oh! We're sorry you had issues - thanks for trying to get it to work! If possible could you get us a snapshot of your old computer's system specs?

The good news is that in our next build, which will be up later this week, we'll have adjustable quality settings so older computers can play our game, too. Hand Thumbs Up Right
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debugchicken
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« Reply #5 on: November 09, 2014, 05:24:46 PM »

On my core I5, nvidia GTS 450 (XXX series come after XXXX), the game runned , I'd say, at 30 fps. (barely playable)

How do you feel about the foresight ability?

Tottaly uncalled for. I wished the "ground modifiers" were just there.

Are the levels too hard or too easy?

They are ok since there are many checkpoints, but I feel the game is too zoomed in, its hard to see the big picture of the stage. I'd go for more open areas, like car games tracks, at least on the early stages.

PS. sorry, not at my old computer anymore. But it was. like I said, a dual core 3 GHZ (dual core comes before core 2 duo, that comes before i3/i5/i7), NVIDIA GT 8600 and DDR2 memory I think, just 2 GB but they werent filled. The disc is a default 7200 rpm.
« Last Edit: November 10, 2014, 07:36:32 AM by mirrorlink » Logged
RetroYetiGames
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« Reply #6 on: November 11, 2014, 10:48:44 AM »

Thanks! The engineers are looking into what might have caused you issues.

As for the feedback, thanks for that too. We're looking into adding a more permanent method of tile revealing that provides the best of both worlds.

For the zoomed in part, we're curious - did you play in first or third person? Both options are available in the menu. We added the third person to give players a more pulled back view of things, which might help. If you did and you still thought it was too zoomed in...hm. Our new checkpoints might interest you, and they should be in by next week. :D
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debugchicken
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« Reply #7 on: November 11, 2014, 11:25:17 AM »

I didn't know there was a third-person option. If there are both options, I would go for the third person being the default, since is more likely that a game that starts in third-person have a first-person option than the opposite.

I'll try the third person on the next build.
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« Reply #8 on: December 18, 2014, 05:33:06 PM »

Whew. Okay. It's been awhile!

We've gone through a couple of iterations and would love to get more feedback on our current direction. Here's a few new screenshots to give you an idea:





You can find the latest build on our website http://404sight.com/builds
Please note! You can switch between first and third person. If your computer struggles, you can lower the visual quality in the options menu.

Questions for this build: Were you able to navigate the levels? Did the levels feel linear or non-linear to you? Was the ping ability intuitive, or hard to get used to? Which POV (1st or 3rd) did you prefer?

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debugchicken
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« Reply #9 on: December 22, 2014, 07:49:26 PM »

played the new version

- the game installed flawlessly
- quality change was very much appreciated
- something weird on the options menu, i could drag the mouse and look around
- also on the options menu i couldnt trigger to get 3rd person view on the HUD
- its possible to change to 3rd person using the key "o"... and if I'm third person on the game and go to the menu, it continues to be third person
- when the game first started i had no idea what was going on, there was like some kind of video playing, but it wasnt full screen, and then i moved and the video stopped, is like the video is being played on a mesh face on a 3d world.. and also, the hud of the time was there, couting, which made everything more strange
- the animation is slippy on third person
- the movemente is not tight, and i don't think the "fire-like" ground, which I suspect slow you down (since there is no visual feedback gor that) is a good idea, at least not the way it is used now, filling the whole path, I would go for small avoidable spots
« Last Edit: December 22, 2014, 07:55:24 PM by mirrorlink » Logged
Quicksand-S
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« Reply #10 on: December 22, 2014, 10:32:20 PM »

Wow. I wasn't interested at all until I saw the new screenshots. I thought it was a side-view "runner" type game. It might be a good idea to put one of the new screenshots in the first post.

I'm not a fan of testing games that use installers. If I might be trying out a bunch of different versions, an installer is especially cumbersome. That said, I still wanted to check it out so I got it anyway.

-When I first started, I was falling endlessly in an area that looked nothing like the actual level once I hit Reset. The background was light grey. There was also a big red sphere in the distance and my character in third-person was transparent.

-When I tried running the game again later, the level started fine and I got to the second area (after the diving cutscene). Is there anywhere to go from there? I never reached the areas in your screenshots. Maybe the map didn't load properly? It just looked like empty rooms (one to the left and one to the right) and some cliffs. After wandering there for a while, I suddenly appeared in that area with the red sphere again, falling endlessly. I don't know why.

-At one point, I alt-tabbed to write here and when I returned to the game all I saw was a big wall with an image of a character running. Maybe I fell off the path while typing here? If so, I think it would be a good idea to stop accepting input when the game isn't in focus.

-The movement feels a bit stiff and the animations are really jerky, but the running and jumping was at least pretty easy to control. I only had one issue with the jumping, which was when I landed at the edge of a ledge and couldn't jump up onto it without forward momentum. A tiny bit of air-control might be a good idea, so that you don't need to already be running just to make small jumps forward like that.

-I didn't really understand the point of the foresight ability. It seemed like I just had to click constantly (since I couldn't just assume that a bounce pad would be at every ledge). It made me wonder what the point was for not having the ground types be visible by default. Clicking endlessly isn't that fun. I'd much rather just enjoy running through interesting and varied locations.

I played in first-person and didn't have any issues except that it seemed to take a lot of processing power to just stand at the start of the map while I typed in my browser. My keyboard inputs were really delayed while I had the game running. Actually playing, it didn't seem particularly fast (I expected a speedier character) but the movement through the level was smooth.
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« Reply #11 on: December 23, 2014, 12:33:41 AM »

played the new version

- the game installed flawlessly
- quality change was very much appreciated
- something weird on the options menu, i could drag the mouse and look around
- also on the options menu i couldnt trigger to get 3rd person view on the HUD
- its possible to change to 3rd person using the key "o"... and if I'm third person on the game and go to the menu, it continues to be third person
- when the game first started i had no idea what was going on, there was like some kind of video playing, but it wasnt full screen, and then i moved and the video stopped, is like the video is being played on a mesh face on a 3d world.. and also, the hud of the time was there, couting, which made everything more strange
- the animation is slippy on third person
- the movemente is not tight, and i don't think the "fire-like" ground, which I suspect slow you down (since there is no visual feedback gor that) is a good idea, at least not the way it is used now, filling the whole path, I would go for small avoidable spots



I'll address things point by point. First, thanks for playing and providing feedback! We really appreciate it.

1) Brilliant! We're going to improve the installer soon, so that it looks for and overwrites previous versions. Good to know this version worked well.
2) A vsync and resolution option set should be in the pipeline in the next few months. Definitely before full release.
3,4, & 5) The UMG/wrapper stuff in Unreal 4 has been giving us some issues, we've been troubleshooting those awhile. Bit by bit we fix things, but stuff like that is definitely on our radar. Part of the issue is a team-wide indecision on whether or not we wanted to force 3rd or 1st person.
6) The video you describe is an "idle state" that we put in to play when the game hadn't been touched for thirty seconds. Not sure why it started right when you began playing - sounds like a bug. Thanks for bringing it to our attention! We'll add it to our tracker and see what's up.
7) The animations have been undergoing some pretty extensive tweaking and improvement, so right now they feel a little weird. That should change as we continue to polish.
Cool The slow tiles are something we're playing with, definitely. We want them to feel like an avoidable obstacle that still poses significant risk to the player, but we haven't found a good place for that yet. We'll keep trying.




Quote
Wow. I wasn't interested at all until I saw the new screenshots. I thought it was a side-view "runner" type game. It might be a good idea to put one of the new screenshots in the first post.

I'm not a fan of testing games that use installers. If I might be trying out a bunch of different versions, an installer is especially cumbersome. That said, I still wanted to check it out so I got it anyway.

-When I first started, I was falling endlessly in an area that looked nothing like the actual level once I hit Reset. The background was light grey. There was also a big red sphere in the distance and my character in third-person was transparent.

-When I tried running the game again later, the level started fine and I got to the second area (after the diving cutscene). Is there anywhere to go from there? I never reached the areas in your screenshots. Maybe the map didn't load properly? It just looked like empty rooms (one to the left and one to the right) and some cliffs. After wandering there for a while, I suddenly appeared in that area with the red sphere again, falling endlessly. I don't know why.

-At one point, I alt-tabbed to write here and when I returned to the game all I saw was a big wall with an image of a character running. Maybe I fell off the path while typing here? If so, I think it would be a good idea to stop accepting input when the game isn't in focus.

-The movement feels a bit stiff and the animations are really jerky, but the running and jumping was at least pretty easy to control. I only had one issue with the jumping, which was when I landed at the edge of a ledge and couldn't jump up onto it without forward momentum. A tiny bit of air-control might be a good idea, so that you don't need to already be running just to make small jumps forward like that.

-I didn't really understand the point of the foresight ability. It seemed like I just had to click constantly (since I couldn't just assume that a bounce pad would be at every ledge). It made me wonder what the point was for not having the ground types be visible by default. Clicking endlessly isn't that fun. I'd much rather just enjoy running through interesting and varied locations.

I played in first-person and didn't have any issues except that it seemed to take a lot of processing power to just stand at the start of the map while I typed in my browser. My keyboard inputs were really delayed while I had the game running. Actually playing, it didn't seem particularly fast (I expected a speedier character) but the movement through the level was smooth.


Hello! Thank you for the suggestion. I've posted the screenshots in the original post - which is definitely a great idea. I should have done that way sooner. Like mirrorlink's feedback, I'll go through yours point by point. Again, we really appreciate all the comments you took the time to give us. It makes us feel really good about what we're making!


1) We created an installer to streamline the process of getting the game on machines without fuss. Previously it involved digging through a bunch of folders and finding the exe and sometimes having to install some Visual Studio dl files, which was a barrier that we wanted to removed. We thought it would make things better to create an installer - it's interesting to hear that you're not a fan. Do you have any recommendations for alternatives?

2) The falling endlessly in the gray area is a bug that we are on the verge of fixing. If you encounter it again, hitting R will immediately reset the level for you and will hopefully prevent your needing to restart the whole game.

3) It sounds like you encountered a problem with our level loading system. The way we set it up was to ease the load on the computer and load each level piece in that room, but sometimes it doesn't work. We're trying to re-create it so we can fix the issue, but we are aware of it. If you continue to have trouble, sometimes it helps if players back up slowly and walk forward slowly, because sometimes that triggers the loading mechanism. I've petitioned the team to put a level selection menu back in the game just in case, though.

4) As mentioned previously, the movement and animations are in the middle of some adjusting, so we'll hopefully get it to a place where it feels better. Today we added a sort of "dash" movement that we're internally testing that may help smooth out the transition from jumping to running while giving the player a boost of speed. Air control is hotly debated among us, but for now there is only air control from side to side, but not forward or backwards. We will continue to experiment.

5) Ah, the ping ability. We keep coming back to it, but having it on automatically also hasn't worked in the past. The player had no control over what they're revealing or when. We've tried a reload mechanic (similar to Gears of War) that expanded the radius to encourage tactical pinging, but that just felt even more rhythmic and mechanical. We want the use of the ping ability to be the difference between good players and great players, but as novice designers we're wrestling with it. In the end, your suggestion may win out, but we're not done trying new iterations with it just yet. If you have any more ideas, we're honestly eager to hear them. Who knows what will spark the eventual solution?

6) Processor load is definitely a known issue. I'm curious - did you try to turn the visual quality down in the options menu? Many people have success with that in easing the lag. At any rate, it's a stop gap, and we're working to fix the strain the game causes. We have a few ideas to help with the feeling of speed, too, so expect some changes on that front in the future.


At any rate, once again, we very much appreciate your help! Please don't ever hesitate to contact us with any thoughts, feelings, or ideas. :D
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« Reply #12 on: December 23, 2014, 01:00:15 AM »

1) We created an installer to streamline the process of getting the game on machines without fuss. Previously it involved digging through a bunch of folders and finding the exe and sometimes having to install some Visual Studio dl files, which was a barrier that we wanted to removed. We thought it would make things better to create an installer - it's interesting to hear that you're not a fan. Do you have any recommendations for alternatives?

For a final release, an installer seems reasonable (although I still personally prefer not to have one if possible). For people testing the game in this forum, though, just having an archive of the files is much simpler to work with. That way, we can easily unzip the game, try it out, swap it for a new version, try that out, and so on without having to install and uninstall every time.

Quote
6) Processor load is definitely a known issue. I'm curious - did you try to turn the visual quality down in the options menu? Many people have success with that in easing the lag.

Nope, I didn't lower the settings. The game itself seemed to run fine. The only lag was from doing other things with the game running in the background.
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« Reply #13 on: March 10, 2015, 11:06:25 AM »

Hello again! We're back!

Lots has happened since we last spoke. First, we're on Steam Greenlight! 

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=400702840

So if you're willing and able, we could use your support.

We have a new build available on our website and a ton more screenshots for you! http://404sight.com/builds/
There's been so many changes since the last build that I won't try to summarize it, but basically things have been refined and adjusted. There's a dash ability! Inhibitors! Slow lanes! There are now more graphics options in case there are any performance issues on your computer.









As always, we'd love to hear your feedback.
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