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TIGSource ForumsPlayerGamesWhy do PC games require such high specs?
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ProgramGamer
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« on: March 08, 2015, 09:14:12 AM »

This is something I've been noticing for a while now. PC games, or PC ports of games, consistently require much higher specs than the average personal computer has in order to run smoothly at 60fps, even on the lowest of graphic settings. I have an Alienware Mx11 and I can't even run Borderlands 2 at more than 30 fps. Why do games keep being released with such high expectations of the user's hardware?

On a side note, this is part of the reason why people who think the "PC master race" is a thing seem like idiots to me.
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jiitype
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« Reply #1 on: March 08, 2015, 09:33:59 AM »

I just googled mx11 and it doesn't have the greatest specs. Also it seems to be from 2010/11 so it's not that surprising Shrug
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ThemsAllTook
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« Reply #2 on: March 08, 2015, 10:27:15 AM »

Optimization takes time. A typical developer will first target decent performance on their own computer. If their computer is newer than yours and they're doing something nontrivial, chances are that it won't run as well for you unless they've specifically taken the time to ensure that it does. Time for optimization can be hard to find under a deadline.
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« Reply #3 on: March 08, 2015, 11:25:18 AM »

There's also the issue that unlike consoles, with PCs there are a myriad of different hardware configurations (not to mention software running in the background that gets in the way too) so it's not possible to do a perfect optimization. Admittedly though, it could be better, but as has been mentioned, deadlines usually get in the way.

What really annoys me though is when a 2D game (and I mean standard 2D graphics) slows down with a modern system. Like, what? I guess if you've exhausted memory with tons of high resolution sprites that may start giving trouble, but even many games that would seem to require much lesser requirements still tend to slow down on modern systems. Why?
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« Reply #4 on: March 08, 2015, 11:29:37 AM »

also modern AAA games are generally developed with consoles in mind (because thats where the money is) so PC versions are often poorly optimized. also yeah, sorry but your computer is old, especially for a laptop.
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ProgramGamer
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« Reply #5 on: March 08, 2015, 12:13:21 PM »

Yeah, mx11 laptops have been taken off the Alienware website for quite a while, so I knew it was old. And I know specs and background programs are a big variable that is not easily accounted for. I was just wondering why developers don't make the choice to be modest about the graphic capabilities of the general consumer, or at least consider making a "make everything ugly but super fast" switch, and turn off every shader that is not mandatory or something. I'm tired of not being able to play games even on min settings.

As a side note, a list of major performance drags for PC would be nice as a kind of resource. And a question: is there such a thing as "RAM speed"?

I also agree about the 2D thing. Spelunky, I'm looking at you. Angry
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« Reply #6 on: March 08, 2015, 12:22:06 PM »

yeah well 2D developers (indies) are just shit programmers
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ProgramGamer
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« Reply #7 on: March 08, 2015, 12:25:56 PM »

yeah well 2D developers (indies) are just shit programmers

*Raises hand*  Durr...?
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Canned Turkey
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« Reply #8 on: March 08, 2015, 12:36:01 PM »

Wow thanks schoq we love you too.
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J-Snake
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« Reply #9 on: March 08, 2015, 02:13:33 PM »

What really annoys me though is when a 2D game (and I mean standard 2D graphics) slows down with a modern system. Like, what? I guess if you've exhausted memory with tons of high resolution sprites that may start giving trouble, but even many games that would seem to require much lesser requirements still tend to slow down on modern systems. Why?
One easy way to bottleneck the system is binding the texture for every single sprite/tile you draw. It's easier and more flexible to program that way but for everything outside snes demands you should structure the code according to the pipeline of your hardware.
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« Reply #10 on: March 08, 2015, 02:14:48 PM »

pc games need to be poorly optimized so they can more fully utilize the hardware available, so that the pc master race folks don't feel like they wasted money by buying like 30 gpus.
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ProgramGamer
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« Reply #11 on: March 08, 2015, 02:16:56 PM »

pc games need to be poorly optimized so they can more fully utilize the hardware available, so that the pc master race folks don't feel like they wasted money by buying like 30 gpus.

I lold
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« Reply #12 on: March 08, 2015, 02:19:36 PM »

I agree with MetalGearFrog
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J-Snake
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« Reply #13 on: March 08, 2015, 02:56:59 PM »

While you are at it:


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Faust06
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« Reply #14 on: March 08, 2015, 03:47:41 PM »

Why I'll never get a beefed-up pc, basically. Buy a console, you're good for a decade. Buy rec spec'ed pc, good for a couple of years.. for more money.
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« Reply #15 on: March 08, 2015, 03:47:53 PM »

And a question: is there such a thing as "RAM speed"?

Yep, and in fact it tends to be a much bigger bottleneck than CPU speed in practice (the reason caches are so important is because RAM is much slower than the processors). It's rarely talked about though, everybody likes to talk about the amount of data that can be stored instead - I guess that the cache playing a big factor in the total potential performance makes things kind of muddly. The kind of RAM also matters (old example but e.g. the GeForce 7300GS has more memory than the rest of the 7xxx series, but it's DDR instead of GDDR so it's much slower for its intended purpose).

For the record, RAM speed seems to be the main bottleneck for the XBox One and why it tends to cause more performance troubles than on the PS4, if this thread is anything to go by (the XBox One discussion is some posts down). Incidentally, that thread discusses why consoles can perform better than PCs even with worse hardware.
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« Reply #16 on: March 08, 2015, 04:03:04 PM »

Why I'll never get a beefed-up pc, basically. Buy a console, you're good for a decade. Buy rec spec'ed pc, good for a couple of years.. for more money.

pc is either the cheapest or most expensive way to play gams depending on what you want to play and how you want to play it. i don't play many recent AAA games (i can still run them well at low-ish settings tho) so PC is optimal for me in terms of price (this is factoring in software prices and the fact that i'd buy a computer even if i didnt play games on it). ive barely even used my ps3 as anything other than a blu ray player ever since dark souls got ported to pc lol.

also a laptop is like 10 times more convenient than a console, that's probably the biggest factor for me. i dont have to sit in front of a tv to play games and i can actually take it with me when im moving around.
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Faust06
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« Reply #17 on: March 08, 2015, 04:43:54 PM »

Why I'll never get a beefed-up pc, basically. Buy a console, you're good for a decade. Buy rec spec'ed pc, good for a couple of years.. for more money.

pc is either the cheapest or most expensive way to play gams depending on what you want to play and how you want to play it. i don't play many recent AAA games (i can still run them well at low-ish settings tho) so PC is optimal for me in terms of price (this is factoring in software prices and the fact that i'd buy a computer even if i didnt play games on it). ive barely even used my ps3 as anything other than a blu ray player ever since dark souls got ported to pc lol.

also a laptop is like 10 times more convenient than a console, that's probably the biggest factor for me. i dont have to sit in front of a tv to play games and i can actually take it with me when im moving around.

True, I consider it a given that I'd have a laptop. You don't need much to run the vast majority of multimedia and cheap indie games. In the future I'll upgradejust to run a backcatalog of pc games I couldn't play before. ATM, my circa 2009 Dell Latitude can't even run Fez properly but it's fine for most things.
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Uykered
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« Reply #18 on: March 08, 2015, 07:28:00 PM »

New computers are great for gaming, I'd recommend them to everyone.
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ProgramGamer
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« Reply #19 on: March 08, 2015, 08:00:38 PM »

I'm considering buying something like an alienware area 51 and pay it off over maybe six years or something. I'd have it during university and I would make close to minimum payments during that time and once I get a job after that I can pay it off completelly in lke one or two years. How does that sound?
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