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TIGSource ForumsDeveloperTechnical (Moderator: ThemsAllTook)General thread for quick questions
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gimymblert
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« Reply #300 on: October 07, 2015, 04:50:50 PM »

https://www.khronos.org/
try at the source

or here?
http://stackoverflow.com/search?q=%5Bdocumentation%5D+opengl
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ThemsAllTook
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« Reply #301 on: October 07, 2015, 05:53:13 PM »

Here's the one I usually use: https://www.opengl.org/sdk/docs/man2/
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ProgramGamer
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« Reply #302 on: October 07, 2015, 06:00:55 PM »

Ok, so from what I've gathered so far (mostly form the default code::blocks project for OpenGL) there are functions to begin drawing and finish drawing, the settings for drawing functions on a stack data structure and you have to draw individual points separately in odrer to form polygons, also you need to specify what you want to draw in order for you points to be interpreted as the correct shape. This is just the bare basics but I think I have them down decently. I'll look into how OpenGL expands those concepts.
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InfiniteStateMachine
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« Reply #303 on: October 08, 2015, 05:34:23 AM »

Ok, so from what I've gathered so far (mostly form the default code::blocks project for OpenGL) there are functions to begin drawing and finish drawing, the settings for drawing functions on a stack data structure and you have to draw individual points separately in odrer to form polygons, also you need to specify what you want to draw in order for you points to be interpreted as the correct shape. This is just the bare basics but I think I have them down decently. I'll look into how OpenGL expands those concepts.

Not trying to scare you off or anything but those concepts change profoundly in different opengl versions. Right now you are describing immediate mode openGL. Which I actually think is the way to go because it has the least amount of inertia to get something up on the screen.

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« Reply #304 on: October 08, 2015, 07:57:30 AM »

Heya guys!

I'm an artist so essentially nothing about programming makes any sense to me. We are in a position with our game where we may need to hunt for a programmer soon, but I wanted to make sure I do my homework before I make that move.

So, my question is this: Is it usually an easier task to:

A.) Convert a complex & expansive series of existing scripts from a niche coding language (like, say, Ruby from RPGMaker) into Javascript (& remove a few scripts here and there that aren't necessary for our game)

-or-

B.) Custom build an engine from scratch in Javascript similar to the one mentioned in option A, excluding the scripts we don't need and adding in some additional scripts we would like to have

Seems like option A would be easier, but then again you would need to have a solid understanding of the code language used in the existing scripts to even be able to convert them, so maybe I'm way off here?
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Layl
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« Reply #305 on: October 08, 2015, 08:00:05 AM »

Heya guys!

I'm an artist so essentially nothing about programming makes any sense to me. We are in a position with our game where we may need to hunt for a programmer soon, but I wanted to make sure I do my homework before I make that move.

So, my question is this: Is it usually an easier task to:

A.) Convert a complex & expansive series of existing scripts from a niche coding language (like, say, Ruby from RPGMaker) into Javascript (& remove a few scripts here and there that aren't necessary for our game)

-or-

B.) Custom build an engine from scratch in Javascript similar to the one mentioned in option A, excluding the scripts we don't need and adding in some additional scripts we would like to have

Seems like option A would be easier, but then again you would need to have a solid understanding of the code language used in the existing scripts to even be able to convert them, so maybe I'm way off here?

This question is hard to answer without some more context about what should be converted. Depending on that it can either be really easy or really hard. Either way, porting isn't the most fun of programming work.
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« Reply #306 on: October 08, 2015, 08:13:31 AM »

thanks for the quick response Layl!
To be specific, the Ruby scripts I'm referring to are these:
http://forums.rpgmakerweb.com/index.php?/topic/16085-gubids-tactical-battle-system-v24-for-ace/
Unfortunately there's so many scripts making up this battle engine that I can't really share any specific examples here. Probably equally unhelpful is the link to the project's Redmine page:
http://gubi.us:8001/redmine/projects/0_010
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InfiniteStateMachine
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« Reply #307 on: October 08, 2015, 08:18:26 AM »

 In A's case do you mean converting to an engine with a javascript scripting layer?
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Layl
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« Reply #308 on: October 08, 2015, 08:21:51 AM »

This seems like you're taking too many decisions away form the programmer. You should not be picking technologies or languages for your programmer, you should only be giving requirements like "this should be a web-based game". If the programmer thinks that for your game's requirements, porting the scripts over is the appropriate decision then they would do so.

Likely they would chose instead to make a new custom system if you're not using RPG Maker anyways, because the entire point of libraries like this is to remove the need for having to write it yourself, porting it over defeats that point. A reason someone would want to port a library over is if they for example like the API or the functionality it provides and want to put in the extra effort to make it usable for other people.
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BBreakfast
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« Reply #309 on: October 08, 2015, 08:24:15 AM »

In A's case do you mean converting to an engine with a javascript scripting layer?

I.. think? If that means an engine that's Javascript-friendly?  Giggle It would be for the new version of RPGMaker (RPGMaker MV), which allows for javascript plugins to tweak whatever you want within the game engine.
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InfiniteStateMachine
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« Reply #310 on: October 08, 2015, 09:25:22 AM »

I take it that the new rpgmaker doesnt work with the old version ruby stuff?
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« Reply #311 on: October 08, 2015, 09:54:00 AM »

I take it that the new rpgmaker doesnt work with the old version ruby stuff?

Yup, that's what I'm wrestling with.  Wink
The new RPGMaker MV has been redone in Javascript so it's now possible to release games made with is for Mac, PC, iOS & Android. It's a little jarring to lose compatibility with all the old Ruby scripts but I think it's for the best since we can now access all the hidden classes the older RPGMakers wouldn't allow you to access.

(sorry, guess this wasn't such a quick question after all! maybe I should have made a new thread?)
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InfiniteStateMachine
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« Reply #312 on: October 08, 2015, 10:04:23 AM »

I think the answer is pretty clear. Port the scripts.

Moving from one version of an engine to another with the same general workflow is going to be a lot easier then writing an engine from scratch. Even if it is annoying they changed their scripting interface. That seems like a bad decision on their part but maybe they have a good reason I'm not privy to.
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Layl
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« Reply #313 on: October 08, 2015, 10:07:56 AM »

I'm just wondering if it's not just faster to write scripts specific for the game instead of line-for-line porting the scripts. (which may not even work with the differences between Ruby and JS)

Again overall this sounds like a decision that should be up to the programmer who will actually be working on the game though.
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« Reply #314 on: October 08, 2015, 10:09:30 AM »

Alright, and where can I find a good SDL-like documentation for it, if there even is a decent doc for that?

Super late response, but I always use docs.gl for an OpenGL reference. So good.
I'd start with a tutorial first though.
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InfiniteStateMachine
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« Reply #315 on: October 08, 2015, 10:11:23 AM »

I'm just wondering if it's not just faster to write scripts specific for the game instead of line-for-line porting the scripts. (which may not even work with the differences between Ruby and JS)

Again overall this sounds like a decision that should be up to the programmer who will actually be working on the game though.

Sorry I wasn't clear. The bolded text is actually what I meant.
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Dacke
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« Reply #316 on: October 08, 2015, 01:17:03 PM »

Probably a mix, though? If I was to do the job, I imagine I'd have the old scripts/engine on one screen and the new scripts/engine on another. Trying to move the old stuff over, keeping most of the structure, rewriting completely when needed and porting exactly when needed.
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« Reply #317 on: October 08, 2015, 01:22:14 PM »

Not trying to scare you off or anything but those concepts change profoundly in different opengl versions. Right now you are describing immediate mode openGL. Which I actually think is the way to go because it has the least amount of inertia to get something up on the screen.

*grits teeth*

And how would OpenGL work if I didn't use it this way? What are the other ways to use it?
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Layl
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« Reply #318 on: October 08, 2015, 01:32:38 PM »

*grits teeth*

And how would OpenGL work if I didn't use it this way? What are the other ways to use it?

It's a bit iffy to get going the first time, but basically you need to tell opengl how your vertices look like, how the GPU should interpret them and then push in all your vertices at once in an array.

Edit: This is generally THE way to get any kind of decent performance out of OpenGL, immediate mode is slow as molasses.
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« Reply #319 on: October 08, 2015, 01:35:22 PM »

I guess if I want to work with OpenGL I should get a computer with a graphic card then, huh. I have a surface pro, so no fancy GPU for me Sad

(I know that I can still use OpenGL with a CPU, I'm just talking about performance here.)

Also thanks for the explanation! Even the simplest description is enough to give me a starting point so I really appreciate it!
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