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[Craig Stern]

A word of warning about DigiPen--when you sign up with them, you sign away the rights to your schoolwork while you're there. (reworded for clarification)

USC's film program is apparently no better, although I personally haven't had any experience with their game design program.

[Glaiel-Gamer]

A word of warning about DigiPen--when you sign up with them, you sign away the rights to your work while at school there.

You sign away the rights for stuff you do in school, not side projects.

[Matt Thorson]

I'm finishing up my CompSci degree (from University of Alberta) in 3 semesters (have to take one extra because I only took 3 courses last semester to relax a bit) and I've enjoyed it.  

Taught me all the skills I'll probably ever need for the technical side of game dev.  More importantly I feel like I could now teach myself anything further I need to learn for game dev.

And as a bonus it'll be a good safety net if the whole indie thing doesn't pan out.

[MrChocolateBear]

As I haven't attended a traditional college, I would appreciate it if someone posted some of the game dev. related things they have learned in their CS degrees. Do you learn how to render? Build tool/asset pipelines? Networking? Stuff like that. I know you learn how to code in a CS degree and all of the things I mentioned can be self-taught with that knowledge, but I am curious about what is covered in traditional school curriculum.

[aeiowu]

The best way to learn to make games is to make games. There's no way around it.

Quoth for truth.

With that said, some courses will drop you in a room with a bunch of other students and force you to work together. This can be very useful since they'll probably be more reliable than random folk you meet on the internet.

Reliable? Maybe. Skilled? If you're lucky...

Based on my conversations with a bunch of people, super self-motivated and talented people don't really get all that much out of a game school. They end up learning/done things that they would have learned/done on their own time, and the result was time and vast amounts of money wasted.

My advice: go to well respected university. Take advantage of their resources, broaden your horizons at school, and make indie games to learn the craft of game design.

Listen to this guy. In regards to the teams, it's very true. It took me 3 solid years (at university) to find people that were worth their salt to even get _moving_ on a game, let alone finish one.

There are a ton of factors that govern what the best answer is for you. College was a waste of time when I first got there (because I was immature and didn't know what I wanted to do, nor was it the right fit), then I transferred, buckled down and squeezed every last drop of utility out of my time there. I even wrote a little testimonial up on my experience at ISU (state college) here for game career guide: http://www.gamecareerguide.com/features/440/student_testimonial_iowa_state_.php

Simply put: learning in a vacuum isn't for many people, but then again college isn't for everybody either...

ps. what Glaiel said about "teaching game design = stupid," I whole-heartedly agree with. Learn a craft (art or programming) that's vital to completing a game and use it to make games. If you wanted to collab with me and all you wanted to do was design I wouldn't want any part of it.

[MrChocolateBear]

ps. what Glaiel said about "teaching game design = stupid," I whole-heartedly agree with. Learn a craft (art or programming) that's vital to completing a game and use it to make games. If you wanted to collab with me and all you wanted to do was design I wouldn't want any part of it.

The way I see it, game design should be taught like music is taught; through theory. There is a lot of interesting things you can learn from game design theory, which when paired with real world application and experience (ie making games and having made games), can be very beneficial.

I also highly recommend learning a discipline in addition to design theory, should you choose to go that route. Being able to contribute more to a team and its product(s) will always make you a more attractive candidate, be it for a company or a small indie team.

[Reiss]

um.  definitely go to college.

My advice: go to well respected university. Take advantage of their resources, broaden your horizons at school, and make indie games to learn the craft of game design.

this.

[Paul Eres]

The way I see it, game design should be taught like music is taught; through theory. There is a lot of interesting things you can learn from game design theory, which when paired with real world application and experience (ie making games and having made games), can be very beneficial.

the problem is that there is no theory for game design yet (apart from a few books that don't make sense and are based on guesswork), and the other problem is that people with music majors are often horrible musicians and music composers (or at least no better than people who play and write music as a hobby)

if you have to go to college at all, i recommend going to college, and taking any major, and just taking as wide a variety of classes as possible; that'd probably help more than any specific degree. i've taken classes in poetry, the history of games in anthropology, personality psychology, cell physiology, love letter anthropology, enzymology, the differences between male and female use of language, social psychology, medical anthropology, latin, abnormal psychology, sensation & perception, etc., and most of it has been useful here and there. not crucial, but useful.

[PGGB]

The way I see it, game design should be taught like music is taught; through theory. There is a lot of interesting things you can learn from game design theory, which when paired with real world application and experience (ie making games and having made games), can be very beneficial.

the problem is that there is no theory for game design yet (apart from a few books that don't make sense and are based on guesswork), and the other problem is that people with music majors are often horrible musicians and music composers (or at least no better than people who play and write music as a hobby)

Exactly, main reason why you should try to get to some school/university that has as much practice as possible. After you learned all the theory you know how you should make a good game but the really basic stuff escapes you. In my opinion it is better to get this down first and to study alongside the practice a bit of theory, then try to apply it and move on.

[MrChocolateBear]

Exactly, main reason why you should try to get to some school/university that has as much practice as possible. After you learned all the theory you know how you should make a good game but the really basic stuff escapes you. In my opinion it is better to get this down first and to study alongside the practice a bit of theory, then try to apply it and move on.

I agree. There is nothing as good as practice. Regardless of your educational background, it's actually making games that will set you apart from everyone else.

the problem is that there is no theory for game design yet (apart from a few books that don't make sense and are based on guesswork), and the other problem is that people with music majors are often horrible musicians and music composers (or at least no better than people who play and write music as a hobby)

What do you consider game design theory? There are plenty of articles, books, and papers on things like designing games for specific demographics and things of that nature. None of them are perfect, but few things in life are.

As for people who take theory classes being no better than anyone else, I'd attribute that to experience. Often, people who "learn" things in school don't think to use that knowledge to improve themselves and their work. This may or may not be the case, but that's where my money is.

[Aquin]

I never learned game design officially at UBC, but I consider the experience invaluable for creating games.  Sure it's all technical and theoretical, but the high-level courses discussed how to create an efficient and provocative GUI or HUD.  Another high-level course actually requires that you make games to test certain OpenGL concepts. 

I dunno, I found that we made a lot of games during the labs and tutorials at UBC.  By the end of my degree, I had made a few dozen small ones.  Does it actually 'teach' game design?  No.  But the experience was quite nice and I think it paid off in the end.

[Alec S.]

One of the good things about the USC program is that they teach some theory (there is some theory developing for videogames and some classical theory applied to videogames.  Narratology vs. Ludology, Flow theory, types of play), but also give you a lot of experience actually making games.  They teach you about iterative design, setting milestones, prototyping, working with artists and programmers, ect...

[Paul Eres]

What do you consider game design theory? There are plenty of articles, books, and papers on things like designing games for specific demographics and things of that nature. None of them are perfect, but few things in life are.

those are the things i meant, yes. game design theory only goes back to around the 80s, so it hasn't had much time to develop, whereas music theory goes back centuries. so i think the main difference between game design theory and music theory right now is that music theory is far more developed, and game design theory is often just some guy's idea about how to design games rather than being based on empirical research or even agreement by experts

[phubans]

Yeah, it seems like a lot of people in this thread are saying to avoid school and just make games on your own. I feel that there's some truth to that. I've been trying to get my Bachelor's in Game Art and Design at this art school for the past 3 years now, and I just turned 28. I'm going into massive debt and I still have at least another year and a half or more before I finish. Plus, at my school they're not very focused on building specific strengths but rather stretching you thin across a medley of courses, some of which are probably ultimately useless to most people. I mean, if you're trying to focus on becoming a 3D modeler, there's no need for you to know scripting languages.

Anyways, I kind of regret getting stuck in this, and a lot of my time and energy is spent working or worrying about school. I got a lot more done with games when I was simply working an ordinary job and not in school. Sure, it didn't feel like I was moving forward much being "stuck" in a job like Starbucks, but little did I know I was making tremendous advances on my games that I haven't had the time nor energy for since.

A lot of people have told me that the degree itself is irrelevant to this industry. It's really more about your portfolio and who you know. I went back to school for the degree, but also to make contacts and hopefully be placed in a job when I finished, but there's really no guarantee. In regard to feeling as if I'm not moving forward now that I'm in school, well, to be honest I feel more like I've started to walk backwards.

[Reiss]

The way I see it, game design should be taught like music is taught; through theory. There is a lot of interesting things you can learn from game design theory, which when paired with real world application and experience (ie making games and having made games), can be very beneficial.

...  and taking any major, and just taking as wide a variety of classes as possible; that'd probably help more than any specific degree. i've taken classes in poetry, the history of games in anthropology, personality psychology, cell physiology, love letter anthropology, enzymology, the differences between male and female use of language, social psychology, medical anthropology, latin, abnormal psychology, sensation & perception, etc., and most of it has been useful here and there. not crucial, but useful.

yeah.  taking a variety of courses is important -- it'll expand what you can use as influences in your games.  generally the more life experience you've had, the better your creative endeavors get.  and game design is definitely a creative endeavor.

also, to agree with paul some more, i'd be wary of game design courses as well.  game design is so new, it's not like some guy can definitively tell you "this is bad" or "this is good."  nobody knows.  obviously not all courses would be fluff...  but a lot of them could be.  if your college offers some, by all means take them -- but probably don't go to a school just for its game design courses.