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[PythonBlue]

First of all, I don't care if this makes me look pathetic; I already have a bad reputation on ModDB, anyway...

I've been having serious depression, lately, due in part to the fact that I only have one part-time job other than my music. And for the latter, the only way I appear to get noticed by anyone is if I bump one of my ads so many times that people insult me.

So, a question to the other composers and composer-wannabes: what keeps you motivated?

[gryphonsnyder]

I find that to be an artist you spend as much time looking for inspiration as you do making music.  Actually I think 90% of the work is living a life that is worthy of music.  Its like keeping a healthy garden.  You cant just put the seeds in and yell at them to grow.  you have to be patient, nurture the soil, even wait a few years.  Then if you have taken care, and loved those beds, you get some good veggies.

Its a struggle for most people I know if not all of them.  So you aren't alone.  And with depression, its hard.  But your an artist, most artists are prone to such things.  This is a winter, and if you let it, there will be a spring.  But you have let your winters be winters so your springs can be springs.

Cheesy i know.  Hope that helps.

[lamontx]

Just let insults slide, the last thing you need is to listen to some random guy who doesn't know crap about you telling you what to or what not to do.

Sorry if my tone sounded aggressive, but you'll need to push those negative words aside and do exactly as you wish. (Unless your wish isn't that nice haha)

I'm actually working with a game right now and luckily didn't have to post any ads to get in. But when I'm done composing for it (24 tracks done, 16 remaining as of right now), then I'll post as many ads and bumps as I want and if anyone says anything, I'll be like *DON'T CARE *

Hope this helped. Hope you excel and make enough money from your music to quit your part-time job.

[Lexonite]

I'm not a musician, and I don't want to sound like a psychologist, but I would say that listening to insults is not the main issue. Sure it hurts, but it wouldn't hurt as much if you were comfortable with yourself. Most discomfort stems from inner turmoil over whatever is on your mind, whether it is stress over a job, a perceived lack of something, or whatever else.. Sometimes it is better to just look at what you can do right now. Spending time thinking how things ought to be won't reveal the steps/parts you need right now so it's better seeking out those things within your reach that can help propel you forwards. It may require looking in different places you haven't looked before, or trying thing you hadn't considered before. Sometimes you won't know what you need, so it's good to find people that might lead you towards something you hadn't considered or tried or whatever.

[Lauchsuppe]

If you have a serious depression, this is your most important problem. You will have to deal with it first in order to be as productive as you were before. People tend to think that their depression was dependable on different details in life (like not needing an additional part time job in your case). But really, depression is more than that. You should really see a psychologist and seek professional help. Not because you aren't able to overcome the depression yourself, but because this speeds up the process. Each day you have to deal with your current depression is wasted. So you will want to get over it as soon as you can. Motivation will probably come back at once. You will also see a lot more opportunities again. But as long your depression endures, you won't be as productive.

[dlt.fm]

@PythonBlue,

Don't depend on others for validation that your music is worthwhile.  That's a sure path to burnout, low self-esteem, and bitterness.  Instead focus on whether the music represents yourself; if you can hear yourself in the music, keep writing.

Music is an art form.  One person's idea of a really transcendent piece of music might sound like razor blades to someone else.  You're never going to please everybody with your music.  If you can please even 10% of the people who hear your music, you're doing unbelievably well.

Don't beat yourself up so much about not "being noticed".  Bumping your posts can make you look desperate; why not add a new post once a week, or once a month, showcasing your latest song, instead?  If you're not writing at least one new piece a week, why not? 

Work on your music foremost, and constantly.  Work on touching people emotionally.  When your music is there, trust me, people will notice.

Also, look for more supportive places for showcasing your music.  Try to stay away from places where the maturity level is about that of a YouTube comment. 

Online forums can be pretty harsh, since it's easy for people to rattle something off on their keyboard -- they don't have to tell you to your face how they feel.  And the fact of the matter is, some people are just going to be judgemental assholes.  They don't bring anything of value musically, so they feel by passing judgment over your work, they're elevating themselves above you.  Don't let them, because they're not above you.

It's this need for validation we all have as musicians and composers that stymies us.  We often let the last thing we wrote dictate how we perceive ourselves.  We often judge ourselves pretty harshly in that regard.

I forget who said "Art is never finished, only abandoned" - it might have been Leonardo Da Vinci.  That's a good thing to remember - know when to move on to the next piece.  The potential to beat yourself up about a given album, song, or cue is huge; you could spend an infinite amount of time tweaking -- and in the end, you burn out on the joy of creation.

I think you indicated in a different post that you've only been making music for a little over a year.  I've been making music for 20 years, and I still think everything I write is crap.  I find I'll really dig a piece for a couple of days, then immediately hate it.  It takes kind of a Zen attitude to look at the last thing I wrote, look at what I liked about it, and move on.

What's worked for me in staying excited and motivated is simple.  I just try to make every cue I write a tiny bit "better" than the last.  It doesn't have to be a radio hit.  Not everybody has to like it or understand it.

For me, personally, if something I write fulfills just one of the following criteria, I feel I've been successful, and I move onto the next:

• Expresses my sentiment more clearly than the last piece.
• Does something musically I've never done before.  Trust me, there's a lot musically none of us have ever done before.
• Wins a personal compositional game.  I like to use "games" when I'm composing to keep things interesting.  I'll create rules like: only use these 4 notes, only use these instruments, write a piece in 9/16, modulate 6 times in N bars, etc.  If I've followed the rules of the game, that's validating for me.
• The piece makes a client happy, or they give me a compliment.  "I love how purple this sounds!"
• The piece perfectly serves the client's purpose (if it's for a job).
• The piece accurately reflects the state of my psyche at the time (this is my catch-all).  I think of these pieces as diary entries, whether listeners know that or not.  Just this simple change in perceiving the identity of a piece of music allows me to forgive any warts or musically "incorrect" aspects.  It doesn't matter if people like it, since it's a snapshot of myself; for that, it's valid.

Pick your own criteria for easy wins, and stick with those.  You'll be much happier person as a result.  Don't try to win the World Cup or a Grammy every time you write a piece of music, just try to touch one person, or improve one aspect of your composing in some quantifiable way, or simply to be happy. 

This isn't striving for mediocrity, it's striving for happiness.

Nobody's perfect.  So don't try to be.  Be content with your imperfections in all aspects of your life, and you'll be rewarded with much richer experiences.

Sorry for the novel, but I hope it helps at least a little.

[MoritzPGKatz]

Hello,

Great advice by David! Listen to that guy, he obviously knows what he's talking about.

I'd like to add to this with another quote (Goethe, I think):
"Talent finds its happiness in execution."

Try to have as much fun as possible making music. People - musically inclined or not - will hear that.

I find that as long as I myself am finding some sort of fulfillment in what I'm producing, it can be any genre or mood or instrumentation: There will always be someone who can relate to the music, and it doesn't really matter if it's just one person who digs it, or hundreds or thousands.

Art, and music composition in particular, is an unbelievably self-centered act of showing your personality to people. Be honest about what you do and don't try to imitate other people or - even worse - their success.

Don't forget why you loved writing music in the first place. Because it pleases other people?
No. Because it gives you that good feeling of creating something out of thin air.
People appreciating what you've created is something that will happen by itself, eventually.

Cheers,
Moritz

[PythonBlue]

Thank you all for the advice. It is deeply appreciated. Rest assured, I am trying to fight my depression, however difficult it is sometimes.

The only problem I can find is that it appears forums are the only place where people converse regularly, so, when it comes to finding a position for a game or mod, I don't know where else to go.

[Soundhound]

David does make some good points, but I'll add my two cents.

Speaking as someone who also suffers from depression I know how you feel, but have you ever tried to channel it into your work? I'm not talking about deliberately being miserable or anything but when I listen to work I've done when I'm down, it's marginally better than when I'm not and often it can actually make me feel a bit better.

The truth is depression is often not a symptom of being unhappy about something per se (in your case not making music full-time), it just presents itself at times when we're more prone to notice it. So even if you could make a living from music you might still have that depression there, so I would recommend actually assessing how severe you think your depression is. I say this because to be severe you really need to be: having suicidal thoughts on a regular basis, having irrational anxious, guilty and irritable moods regularly and cease to get enjoyment out of anything. If you do think your depression is that bad then get professional help. Seriously.

I also encourage you to take part in the musical challenges in these forums if you feel like it, it's fun yo!

And if by the sounds of things you haven't been composing too long then don't worry about not being a success or not being at the standard you would like yet, it's a skill that takes a long time to get proficient at.

[ROCKYIII]

Python,

Just relax. You are 20 years old (I'm 22). Building a reputation in music composition takes a lot of time. Most people quit before they reach that point. Just sit tight, maybe try and find another job, and keep exposing your music. This is going to be a long haul before you get some recognition, so strap yourself in and DON'T QUIT. Whatever you do, DON'T QUIT

-Michael

[ஒழுக்கின்மை (Paul Eres)]

i'd suggest not worrying about forums. if you make music, make music *for* things. did your favorite musicians get their start by bumping threads about their music in forums? it's hard to imagine my favorite musicians doing that. instead they just made music for games or whatever they make music for, or released albums

in other words, i think it's entirely the wrong approach to try to achieve popularity through forums. even if you make indie games, trying to get them popular by bumping threads about them in forums is like the weakest way possible of promoting them. instead they get the games reviewed in magazines or websites, send free copies to reviewers, etc. etc., and let their fans make the forum threads about their games

so basically i'd encourage you make music *for* things -- there are probably a lot of indie game developers who would love for you to make music for their games (especially if you do it for a low price or free). it's much better to say 'yeah, i did the music for these games, here's a list of those games' rather than 'here's my songs, i posted them on some forums'

don't get me wrong, forums are good for many things. feedback, criticism, etc. -- but forums are *not* good places for promotion or building self-esteem, because they tend to be more critical than pretty much any other type of communication system

[Graham-]

Paul's right.

Forums are to while the time. If you want to move forward in life you need to get good work done, or make relationships with people. Real-life is the best opportunity for the latter.

For the former I recommend doing whatever you can to get your music into things. I only have one life I've lived, so I can only tell you what I did. I've had difficulties with depression too.
  1. I worked at companies as close to what I wanted as possible, until...
  2. I had enough experience to do what I wanted to do on my own.

[lamontx]

@Paul: I thought by "promoting himself," he meant he wanted to put adverts to work with indie games or something. If it just means promoting music that's just composed for well... nothing, then I agree with you 100%.

[PythonBlue]

lamontx, that's exactly what I meant. Paul, you may be right that forums are not a place to make a living, but you don't specify alternatives for how to make oneself known in order to get a paying job. Since I'm not employed at any paid game companies, the only option I have is to compose for nothing, as lamontx put it.

[Graham-]

I think it's more like your tone. You make it seem like it's up to the fates, when it's really up to you.

Find a good project, then hit them with your portfolio and a custom intro. Do this across the web, for paid/unpaid work endlessly.

[PythonBlue]

The problem is that it's NOT completely up to me. I already have tried to find interesting projects, and all of the results I've found already have a composer, who, in many cases, is also the head of the project simultaneously.

[Soundhound]

@PythonBlue I know what you mean, the last two projects I've worked on haven't worked out, but you just can't let it get to you. Grow a thick skin and keep at it.

[Calum Bowen]

finding projects is really really tough then finding within the available projects the ones that will be completed, be worthwhile, offer you what you need is even tougher. I guess you get there by making mistakes, forming bonds with developers and just generally the more you do it the better you get at sniffing out worthwhile projects and the more developers can trust you can do the job, become aware of your presence and music and will seek out you!

The best thing to do is not worry about the end result (i.e. the game's success), if you have the leisure/finances to do so, and enjoy yourself in the process - that way you'll make better music and be happy and ready to advance once this one is through.

[eyeliner]

Dude, go to the Feedback and Devlogs section and offer your services to some project that tickles you. Great things have happened like that.

Just don't give up, message a few project leaders, offer a couple tracks and let the ball roll.