next »

[Chris Whitman]

(ps 'immersive' is not a word)

It's a pretty standard usage for describing virtual environments and such. Google it if you don't believe me. And I didn't mean to give the impression that I think there are no other "immersive" (or whatever) games, so much as to point out that people do seem fixated on SotC.

I don't know, I really liked SotC. Sure, it's a fantasy game, but Gormenghast was a fantasy book. Unless you can show me video game that has, say, the scope and humanity of a Dostoevsky or a Faulkner (and I'm not sure that's a direction video games will or should ever really go in, anyway), we'll have to make do with some genre-ism without being too dismissive about it (although obviously there's a limit).

[fraxcell]

For me, atmosphere and a large part of immersion is almost synonymous with good sound design. I thought Bioshock did a good job of this. You could always hear something creepy in the background, like the footsteps of a Big Daddy, or the ramblings of a Splicer. Even inanimate objects, like a radio, vending machine, or just some big machinery or the trickling of water. That added a lot to the game for me. I think sound design (music too) is something which gets overlooked in a lot of games.

[ஒழுக்கின்மை (Paul Eres)]

hmm -- you're right, it's considered a new word added to some (but not all) dictionaries in the 21st century, and applies explicitly to 3d computer graphics. it still feels like a neologism to me though. why can't we just say that something produces immersion, or immerses one, rather than is immersive? it sounds so awkward to me. but whatev

and asking people not to be dismissive of games they don't like? on modern-day tigsource? would be great

[ChevyRay]

what are you guys blathering about, i can think of dozens of games that had more immersion for me than sotc. here, i'll name 12: seiklus, glum buster, aquaria, knytt, knytt stories, redder, yume nikki, endless forest, the path, small worlds, au sable, 7 days a stranger

None of those games immersed me as much as sotc did, to be honest. Aquaria was pretty close, but there was occasional things which broke it, and the rest of those games had even more immersion-breaks than that. So yeah, I can totally understand why sotc comes out on top for lots of people.

[TheLastBanana]

In my opinion (and maybe I'm wrong), an atmospheric game is one that makes you truly feel like you are in a unique environment, or can in the very least induce a mood.
Take, for example, Half-Life 2.  That game is very atmospheric, especially if you're wearing headphones - the sounds of machines humming away in the background really does give you a sense that you aren't just playing a game, but that you are within a different world.
On other hand, I would say immersiveness is mostly referring to how much your actual actions have to do with the gameplay.  As another example, take Batman: Arkham Asylum.  Admittedly, I haven't actually played this game, but having watched others play it, I can say that the fighting really takes your input well.  The controls seem responsive, but at the same time, it takes your button-presses and translates them into something that looks like a somewhat cinematic fight.  In contrast, less immersive games would respond to your input but take it literally and make it so that if, for instance, you just keep hitting the "punch" button, you throw the same punch over and over, constantly resetting to the first frame of the punch animation.  This same feeling of immersiveness is achieved in Fancypants Adventure - everything smoothly flows despite there still being user input.

[ஒழுக்கின்மை (Paul Eres)]

the main immersion-break in sotc for me was the palette swapped giants -- it felt like they ran out of time or programmers and had to use the same giants twice, just make them slightly different. that made it feel too much like a videogame to me.

[gunmaggot]

It's weird because there are images out there of, like, 8 or so completely different colossi that didn't make the cut.  So strange that they dumped them and included two that are identical (even if they play out very differently).  I'm just going to ignore your 'felt too much like a videogame' comment >:(

[alspal]

The main immersion break for me in SotC was that I found it boring.

[TwilightVulpine]

I don't know, even those have some differences in the model. They are not just a model with a different texture. And I can only remember two colossi which are similar to one another.

I give credit to SotC for giving full control while climbing the colossi, and not just using QTE, which may be impressive, but are just interactive cut-scenes. SotC is a game that worked hard to keep the suspension of disbelief, and did it better than any game I can remember.

[Ninja Disguise]

what are you guys blathering about, i can think of dozens of games that had more immersion for me than sotc. here, i'll name 12: seiklus, glum buster, aquaria, knytt, knytt stories, redder, yume nikki, endless forest, the path, small worlds, au sable, 7 days a stranger

(ps 'immersive' is not a word)

That's funny because I completely disagree!

[PsySal]

Here are three interesting greek words from the idea of rhetorical arguments:

1. Logos - logic and reasoning
2. Pathos - emotions and feeling
3. Ethos - ...

Here is where it gets interesting. Having looked this up on wikipedia, Ethos has to do with making an appeal to the character of the person making the argument ("Would I lie to you?"). But, how I had it explained to me was different than this.

Imagine you are having a discussion with another person. Certain forces guide this discussion, including your logical arguments, the feelings of both parties, and then Ethos - which is the environment you are in (NOT the true definition but how I had it explained to me.)

So for instance, if you are making an argument or having a discussion about McDonald's food and health, it's a significant thing if you are actually inside a McDonald's; that's the Ethos.

When people say "Atmosphere" in the context of games I most strongly associate with this (again, probably wrong) interpretation of the greek word Ethos. That is, it's what's surrounding us. So a block-puzzle in Zelda: Ocarina of Time has a very different meaning in the Ethos of the Desert Palace (whatever it was called) than it does in the Ethos of the Forest Palace (or whatever IT was called...)

But the logos in both cases is the same; they are block puzzles.

I just think these three distinctions are interesting to make, that's all! Interesting thread, and also it's interesting that's sort-of heated.

[gimymblert]

Whatever, atmospheric game are pathos at their best

[SirNiko]

One thing that makes SotC stand out is the fact that there are no random monsters. There are very few obstacles, and these usually only appear right before the area where the colossus can be found. The focus in the game is about travelling, admiring the forest, marveling at the lake, and climbing up a mountain path. It's a lot more of a fantasy hiking game than anything else. But the game focuses on that single element, travelling across the world, without resorting to annoying random battles or trivial platforming segments, and it's a unique feeling you don't get from many other games.

3-d games have an inherent advantage here, in that you can see forward, noting nearby terrain up close, and distant features either towering overhead like a mountain, or down a hillside spread out before you. As much as I like Knytt and Knytt stories, the experience they provide really can't be compared to what SotC gives you.

-SirNiko

[Ben_Hurr]

One thing that makes SotC stand out is the fact that there are no random monsters. ...

I actually didn't like that there was nothing to use your weapons on except the collosi themselves and wild animals.  Although encountering foes often would still be no better.