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TIGSource ForumsDeveloperTechnical (Moderator: ThemsAllTook)Is there a way to completely, utterly prevent a game or application from[...]
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Zaphos
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« Reply #20 on: March 29, 2010, 10:34:39 AM »

Especially if they don't have anyone else's beta copy to diff against.

But if they do, it's trivial. Just diff the two copies and put garbage in the differing parts.  You'd need to do some checksum thingy to prevent that.
Sure ... another option is to consider all possible pairs of beta testers, and add a watermark that each pair shares.  (And possibly also consider groups of 3, 4, etc)
Then if they just nuke what's different, the watermarks that remain identify the exact group.  You would need O(n^2) watermarks just to account for pairs, though.  (And when you need that many watermarks, it's perhaps more easy to damage watermarks you haven't even found just by writing where they might be stored ...)

If the game is high-profile enough for some sort of large-scale collaboration, another possible problem-scenario is if someone breaks into a beta tester's computer and gets their copy that way; then sharing it with watermarks intact would just point to someone who did nothing wrong except maybe bad security.  (And of course, there is the related issue that someone could leak the beta and then claim it was stolen to avoid blame...)
« Last Edit: March 29, 2010, 10:38:46 AM by Zaphos » Logged
Zaratustra
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« Reply #21 on: March 29, 2010, 12:00:15 PM »

Do what OnLive does. Have the players play the game on your machine through a web interface.
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LemonScented
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« Reply #22 on: March 29, 2010, 01:29:54 PM »

no matter how inconvenient it is to the user...NO MATTER HOW RIDICULOUSLY INCONVENIENT IT IS

Invite all users to your home and make them play though dumb terminals. Make sure they are all naked before they enter the room of testing.

And just to be sure, murder them before they leave.  Evil
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Notch
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« Reply #23 on: March 29, 2010, 01:44:31 PM »

Care to elaborate? I don't believe there are any uncracked DRM. Well, some games haven't been cracked, but this is mostly a case of obscurity, not security.

Ah, sorry, I didn't mean there was uncrackable DRM.
I meant basically exactly what you said in the second sentence there. Some things haven't been cracked yet, so it CAN slow down some people (especially if you're not huge), but there's no way to make it truly secure.
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Core Xii
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the resident dissident


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« Reply #24 on: March 31, 2010, 01:54:25 AM »

Is there a way to completely, utterly prevent a game or application from being redistributed or used after a certain date, no matter how inconvenient it is to the user?

Never give it out to anyone!

Fine, not that funny. Roll Eyes
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Rob Lach
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« Reply #25 on: March 31, 2010, 02:21:57 PM »

The easiest way I can think of is to move essential game components onto a server.
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