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[ஒழுக்கின்மை (Paul Eres)]

There are still a ton of pretty games that get passed over. For instance, I don't believe J20 was mentioned in tim's blog or on tigsource, and yet it's a very pretty game:

[Alevice]

Maybe we shoudl start posting gameplay gif images?

Juast use youtube to post a gameplay trailer or something. I know thats what got me to play many games actually. Well, actually those lets play type of videos, with almos raw gameplay footage.

[Derek]

There are still a ton of pretty games that get passed over. For instance, I don't believe J20 was mentioned in tim's blog or on tigsource, and yet it's a very pretty game:

Post it, Paul!  You have the power.

I agree with the point of the thread, though - unless you are Tim, there are just too many games to try them all.  I definitely don't think of the front page as "all the games you should play"... that's a full-time job.  Thankfully, I think the collective consciousness of the site and forums tends to catch a lot of what we miss.

[ஒழுக்கின்மை (Paul Eres)]

Well, I wasn't exactly saying that it *should* have been posted -- I felt its gameplay was lacking (although it was unique enough that I included it in my 100 GM games in 10 min video). I just meant that if all someone wanted was to play pretty indie games (or has any other particular tastes), going through the "raw feeds" will fulfill that better than the blogs would (although it'd take a lot more time).

[Josh]

The only bad point for me is that I find it too easy to get distracted from games, even ones I'm really enjoying, and never finish them purely because decent stuff is coming out at a fairly constant rate. Other than that, no complaints here. Rather there was lots of games than none!

[Chris Z]

I think the tools are a big part of it.  Things like Game Maker, XNA, and even SDL really take out a lot of the hard stuff.

XNA really isnt that much easier than native DirectX on something bigger than an SDK sample.  It doesn't really make things that easy to the point that Game Maker does, rather it saves you some hassle with the content pipeline and the .NET framework.  You still have to write your own collision detection, scene management, skeletal animation system, resource management/caching, renderer, shader effects... you get the point.  Same with SDL although I haven't used it in a long time, it's really just some wrappers over OpenGL.  Besides, tools like Game Maker and the like have been around for several years under one name or the other.  Hell I remember the editors of PC Gamer making Coconut Monkey KnP games when I was in grade school.  My point is that games aren't any harder to make now than they were 15 years ago.

I believe the popularity of independent game development comes from an industry that is gaining more and more traction and from a generation saturated with video games growing up and learning to make them.  The success of independent games in the IGF and on XBLA and Steam have no doubt added fuel to this fire. 

[ஒழுக்கின்மை (Paul Eres)]

That was also my thought. Game Maker is no easier than the Ohrrpgce, which in turn was no easier than the ZZT. Yet those communities were much smaller; even GM's community was relatively small five years ago. So I think something else besides ease of use is responsible for the sudden increase in indie games, and most probably that's the increased attention they're getting due to popular indie games like Cave Story, Braid, World of Goo, and the like. Another possibility is the increase in organized sites about indie games -- there were indie games for a long time, but sites like tigsource and indiegames.com/blog are new.

[JoeHonkie]

Another possibility is the increase in organized sites about indie games -- there were indie games for a long time, but sites like tigsource and indiegames.com/blog are new.

This is also quite possible.  Hell, there was half the good games you could get on PC were indie games.  iD and Epic didn't pop up overnight.  I remember downloading their demos off of BBSes.

We used to get Big Blue Disk and between that and dozens of small-time games and clones in the 80s I probably only played big-name games half of the time on PC.

Re XNA and SDL and DirectX: Those take a way a ton of the effort to get into making games.  Input, sprite manipulation, etc.  Those are all things you had to program a long time before you could get into before.  Also those are the things that are most intimidating to someone getting into this stuff.  I say this as someone trying to learn XNA and C# right now.

[GregWS]

I think there are just more good (and bad) games in general now (indie or otherwise), and it's getting more like other mediums where you really have to prioritize what you spend time with.  Really, we should all be happy about this, because it's proof that games are maturing as a medium (I'm not saying anyone here is unhappy about this btw).

[Fuzz]

I read the Tigsource frontpage and forums to find games, as well as indiegames.com, but I also usually read the blogs of developers I like to see if they make new games/write about anything interesting. So I read messhof's blog, cactus's blog, dessgeega's blog, agj's blog, Terry's blog, increpare's blog, Paul's blog, etc. I generally focus on developers I like (doesn't matter if they're well known or not) and read the major blogs to find new games by developers I haven't heard of.

[Lucaz]

There are a lot, and there are a lot I still ahve to play, even in the more famous ones. But it isn't a big problem now, mostly because I don't play many indie games, and I don't keep too updated. The ones I know, I'm told by someone, or I see them through one blog or another. So I usually end playing the more known ones, or the ones by devs I follow. And as I have way too much games in queue, I usually gor for things I'm sure are good.

[Captain_404]

I really don't think there's starting to be more indie games because people are realizing that indie games exist, I find that view just a tad bit self-important.

I really think it has more to do with the videogame audience expanding in general, the people who grew up with all these retro, 2D games are starting to realize that they can remake those experiences with tools like gamemaker, so we're now seeing a lot of indie developers who don't know they're indie, they're just doing it for fun. Sadly, I think most indie games are still inspired by soulless, corporate games, not the indie titles we all love.

That is certainly, however, a more cynical view. It should be noted that I'm only really speaking to the audience who only makes games as a hobby. While it could explain the general expansion of the quantity of "indie" titles, I don't really think it speaks to why we keep seeing the quality increase as well.


Also, someone mentioned the recent explosion of Flash games as well, which is a subject I definitely know something about. When I started programming Flash games about 4 years ago, the community was definitely more fun to be in. More people were actually focused on making games than making money. There was no Mochiads (which is the site you have to thank for all those pesky ads that run in front of every flash game now) and sponsorships for your games worked much less advantageously to the developer than they now do. As a result, it was a lot harder to actually make some cash with, keeping the dirty pac-man reskins for a quick buck at a reasonable amount.

Now, however, it's much easier for a developer to make some cash from his game. While that isn't a bad thing, it has caused the community that I once really loved into a place mostly concerned about how much their games will make once they're sold.

I really hate it. I'm one of only two developers I know who still refuses to put mochiads in their games. Maybe that's just stupid of me, to refuse the quick buck because it might annoy a few players, but you know what? I don't care. My game is more important to me than any money I might make from it.

Anyway, yeah, Flash games got monetized, and that's why there's a lot more of them today than there used to be.

[mirosurabu]

It's easier to share your creations with the Internet today. Moreover, amateur experimentation and rapid prototyping are encouraged more than ever.

[moi]

Just in this forum, there are more games announced than I can play. Many of them good.
(I'm talking released games, not projects or devlogs)

[bigpants]

I agree with the overall point being made.
I'm currently having trouble keeping up with new TIGSource forum postings, let alone games

I touched on this during a presentation I gave at FuturePlay 2008.
The presentation can be found here, I think parts are worth reading
(skip to Indie Games are Indie Bands - Part I)

The real problem, if you're a game maker, is the impact of too many games.
Thoughts from the presentation:

• The chances of someone visting your site, let alone downloading your game, are poor... so make the game you want to play.
  
  
• Since you cannot tour like a band, you'll need to market yourself.
  
  
• If you want people to pay for your game, target an exiting audience or know where to find yours.
  
  
• People are expecting small games to be free.
  
  

What's needed online is more fragmentation. While I love the current TIGSource, I think you'll eventually see TIGSource Retro, TIGSource Macabre, TIGSource Experimental, TIGSource Romance etc.

What's needed offline is an opportunity to connect physically with your audience. This is starting to happen (Montreal's amazing Gamma event, IndieCade, South by Southwest), and it's only going to get larger. It works for comics, movies and music, and it will work for us. I still find it bizarre that the IGF Awards are not geared toward the public.

Saying there are too many games is like saying there is too much indie music.
It's not a problem, and it shouldn't discourage anyone from making games.

[Gainsworthy]

Fragmentation would make me sad. 

I really love that the genres and themes can just pour into one another. Big ol' melting pot. If we break further apart, wouldn't that stop some of that? You'd have to expressly seek someone interested in a "scene" to work with you, and many would only be influenced by their own tribes.

I quite like the current chaos. And yes: there are Too Many Games. It's great. 

[Pishtaco]

Fragmentation would make me sad. 

I really love that the genres and themes can just pour into one another. Big ol' melting pot. If we break further apart, wouldn't that stop some of that? You'd have to expressly seek someone interested in a "scene" to work with you, and many would only be influenced by their own tribes.

That is the way it is already. The TIGSource tribe is mostly inspired by a nostalgia for old console platformers, RPGs and shmups and an affection for pixel art. You don't see a lot of discussion about, say, indie wargames  here.

[Gainsworthy]

Ah, you're right, of course. I often wonder why we don't have more Point 'n' Click Adventure Games, or IFs, or, indeed, Wargames! In fact, we have barely any of those. I'd hope that if someone wanted to post a game from an unusual genre, they'd go ahead and do it, though!

I suppose I meant MORE fragmented. Like an "Art" Games/"Retro" Games divide. That'd be bad.

[Mipe]

All those tower defense, platformers etc. are far too similar; I often find that one won't lose much if one sticks to one or two quality games per genre. And the 'games' that people call artistic expression aren't actual games at all; you try 'em once and then put onto shelves to collect dust.

So, in this flood of small games only the quality games will be recognized. So, yeah... make games for yourselves, don't expect to make a Braid-esque big hit.

Or stop cloning stuff. People will take interest in whatever differs from all the same old on shelves.

[astrospoon]

And the 'games' that people call artistic expression aren't actual games at all; you try 'em once and then put onto shelves to collect dust.

Or stop cloning stuff.

Yes yes yes! If I have to jump around with another badly rendered character in a platformer while I go through 40 single screen levels, I am going to explode. Bring something new or don't bring it at all. Just because you figured out how to make a platform game where you can jump, collect stuff, and shoot some bad guys does not mean I want to play that tired crap. I have things to do!