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[Grhyll]

Hmm... That issue shouldn't occur with the system that I have in mind, I would think.

Specifically, what I envisage is that when the controls switch, the stay switched until another wave switches them again. Releasing or pressing the keys has no effect. Thus they stay consistent within a given wave, and--I imagine--remain effectively consistent across waves.

Maybe I haven't fully understood your suggestion, but it seems that with your system, depending on the way the player entered the wave, the control could be reversed, and I have the feeling it could be quite weird for the player to have one direction taking him one way or the other on different waves.
The current system is a bit complicated to grasp at first, but it has the advantage, once fully grasped, to be very consistent. Beside, it translates very well on controllers or touch screen. I think that with a better tutorial (the current one may give the player the impression he stops moving because he reached the asked point, instead of because he is on the edge of the wave he was pointing to), the learning phase could be a lot shorter and efficient. Yet we are still open to experimenting!

I feel strongly that critique--including having a design be challenged, as you put it--can be very effective in helping us to improve our work, and our skills.

I couldn't agree more

A E S T H E T I C S

Thanks, I guess? 

[jctwood]

I just completed the demo and it is marvellous! The slow introduction of new colours and challenge toward the end is so fun and relaxing. I really look forward to where this goes. My only critical feedback is that I solely used the right and down arrow keys, using all four was just too much for me to handle. I wonder if having joystick input is something you have considered?

[Grhyll]

Wow thanks!
The joystick support is in fact supported, but either it doesn't work on WebGL (it wouldn't surprise me that the input plugin we use has trouble with this platform), either our coder disabled it for this version. It should be implemented in the final game though!
However, it surprises me that you think using the four arrows is more difficult than using a joystick, it seems to me it's almost the same thing (well, except you only have 8 directions with the arrows). To be clear, when moving with the arrows, it just makes your character go in the direction pointed by your input, there's no trick such as "this direction is clockwise and the other counter-clockwise".

[TonyManfredonia]

Hey! Just getting around to your previous question:

Unfortunately, I have yet to give the build/demo a shot. Been unbelievably busy with music.

However, it's on my bucket list for the future! Worst case scenario, I play it during its Early Access or release.

Definitely keep me posted if an open beta or anything along those lines take place! You're always welcome to DM, but I'm on these forums fairly regularly; weekly at the very least.

[Thaumaturge]

Maybe I haven't fully understood your suggestion, but it seems that with your system, depending on the way the player entered the wave, the control could be reversed, and I have the feeling it could be quite weird for the player to have one direction taking him one way or the other on different waves.

That is a potential issue, indeed. However, it may have the advantage of remaining consistent from a moment-to-moment perspective: The player is pressing a key to move in a given direction, and when they cross waves, they continue to do so. Pressing the other key makes them move in the opposite direction (whichever that happens to be).

Such a system would very much call for testing, I daresay--it's hard to say with confidence whether it would be more or less intuitive than the current one.

The current system is a bit complicated to grasp at first, but it has the advantage, once fully grasped, to be very consistent.

But does a complicated (or more accurately, I feel, an unintuitive) control system not run counter to the goal of a relaxing game?

Beside, it translates very well on controllers or touch screen.

True--but then, what works well under one set of controls may not work well under another. I feel that interacting with a touch-screen is different to interacting with a keyboard--to my mind, at least.

I think that with a better tutorial (the current one may give the player the impression he stops moving because he reached the asked point, instead of because he is on the edge of the wave he was pointing to), the learning phase could be a lot shorter and efficient. Yet we are still open to experimenting!

I honestly don't think that the tutorial is unclear. As I recall, I understood it well--I just quickly forgot what I had been taught, it seems, and I'm guessing that this is because I found the controls unintuitive. (It's possible that I was simply tired, admittedly.) If I were to sit and practice, spend time becoming accustomed to the controls, perhaps they'd come more naturally.

[Grhyll]

Hey! Just getting around to your previous question:

Unfortunately, I have yet to give the build/demo a shot. Been unbelievably busy with music.

However, it's on my bucket list for the future! Worst case scenario, I play it during its Early Access or release.

Definitely keep me posted if an open beta or anything along those lines take place! You're always welcome to DM, but I'm on these forums fairly regularly; weekly at the very least.

I can understand that Thanks for showing interest!

Such a system would very much call for testing, I daresay--it's hard to say with confidence whether it would be more or less intuitive than the current one.

Well for sure, we have already tried something like 4 or 5 control scheme, but haven't given up yet on finding the perfect one, so there will be a few more fiddlings! Presenting the game on conventions should help us greatly to grasp the expectations of players as well.
The ideal goal would be a scheme that just doesn't require any thought from the user to use, and there might be something like that between our current system and your suggestions.

[Moriny]

wow it's really convenient to play in my browser! But something's wrong cause it's still loading.

[Grhyll]

Mmh and you didn't get any error message?
Sometimes it doesn't load because the browser doesn't have anymore memory to allocate to the game (and I'm afraid there isn't much I can do about it while still using Unity), but the user is usually warned about it. I don't think I have ever heard about the game not loading without any warning :/ Do you have a lot of tabs open, or do you keep your browser open for extended periods of time?

[Nordanvinden]

I just tried the WebGL demo and the Windows version. Im afraid to say that I could not proceed in any of the versions. The "play button" did not work. So all i had was the inital screen after the Unity logo had been shown (Play button at the top, orange circle in the middle with a water-drop, and text at the bottom).

I might have missed something, but I really tried all the keyboard and controller buttons? And I klicked the water drop. Let me know if a screenshot would help.

[Thaumaturge]

Well for sure, we have already tried something like 4 or 5 control scheme, but haven't given up yet on finding the perfect one, so there will be a few more fiddlings! Presenting the game on conventions should help us greatly to grasp the expectations of players as well.
The ideal goal would be a scheme that just doesn't require any thought from the user to use, and there might be something like that between our current system and your suggestions.

Fair enough! Good luck in finding something that works well! ^_^

[Grhyll]

I just tried the WebGL demo and the Windows version. Im afraid to say that I could not proceed in any of the versions. The "play button" did not work. So all i had was the inital screen after the Unity logo had been shown (Play button at the top, orange circle in the middle with a water-drop, and text at the bottom).

I might have missed something, but I really tried all the keyboard and controller buttons? And I klicked the water drop. Let me know if a screenshot would help.

Just to be sure, what you call the "play button" is the small grey square with an up arrow in it? If so, it is part of the tutorial. What you describe seem to be the normal start screen, did you include the arrow keys of your keyboard in your tests? They are the ones supposed to allow you to move (wasd/zqsd not supported yet). When you clicked on the drop, did it wobble with a sound? If none of this works, well I'm kind of baffled, especially with the Windows version, I can't see a reason why it wouldn't work (with the WebGL version, well, it would still be weird, but you never know, with all the browsers...). I'll just hope you didn't try the arrow keys ^^' If you did and despite that nothing happened, I would be interested in knowing your setup, even if I'm not sure it will help me a lot!
Thanks for trying anyway

Fair enough! Good luck in finding something that works well! ^_^

Thanks I'll keep this thread updated with our further attempts!

[Nordanvinden]

I just tried the WebGL demo and the Windows version. Im afraid to say that I could not proceed in any of the versions. The "play button" did not work. So all i had was the inital screen after the Unity logo had been shown (Play button at the top, orange circle in the middle with a water-drop, and text at the bottom).

I might have missed something, but I really tried all the keyboard and controller buttons? And I klicked the water drop. Let me know if a screenshot would help.

Just to be sure, what you call the "play button" is the small grey square with an up arrow in it? If so, it is part of the tutorial. What you describe seem to be the normal start screen, did you include the arrow keys of your keyboard in your tests? They are the ones supposed to allow you to move (wasd/zqsd not supported yet). When you clicked on the drop, did it wobble with a sound? If none of this works, well I'm kind of baffled, especially with the Windows version, I can't see a reason why it wouldn't work (with the WebGL version, well, it would still be weird, but you never know, with all the browsers...). I'll just hope you didn't try the arrow keys ^^' If you did and despite that nothing happened, I would be interested in knowing your setup, even if I'm not sure it will help me a lot!
Thanks for trying anyway

Alright so with that explination I gave it another try, heres is what Ive got:

• I Did not see that it was an up-arrow. When you said it, I felt like "Of course!", but I think without the other three arrow-keys I just didnt make the connection since I never play games that uses those keys anymore.
  I also have a 60% keyboard, which means I need to hold down a funcion key + o,k,l or ö to acces the arrow keys. And thats why I missed them when hitting all keys on my keyboard. WASD would probably be nice to implement since its better located as well when also using the mouse as input.
• In the tutorial (after I knew it was arrowkeys) it was no problem until I was gonna change to the second level. There was no instruction showing I needed to press the right arrow key when I reached the top of the orange half-circle. Just going to the top did not work. It didnt take too long before I figured it out though. But I have seen similar places where people just keep trying and not getting it, and eventually stop playing.
• Sometimes it was bit too much going on. Especially when you couldnt control when the "gong gong" is going off. I felt like I had a hard time planning what to do. It ended up being trial and error until it just worked.
• Also I would have like a way to abort and restart. But Im guessing thats a design choice for making it a more soothing, calm game. Which I think worked in the end. I stopped stressing and started planning for my next run. But still a bit tedious when the ripple moved very slow.
• I liked how you got to discover and figure out how the colors affected you by yourself. I would like more different types!
• The graphics feels very clean and clear. Looked like graphics a finished game could have to me
• I think I would rather play it on a mobile device though.

All in all it was a really nice game. Well made and cool puzzle dynamics.

[Grhyll]

Thanks a lot for the detailed feedback, many valid points here!
Never thought about short keyboard, it definitely raises the need to support wasd higher in our priority list! Same for the lack of clarity for the keys of the tutorial.
There is in fact an indication to press the right key when you reach the first "end wave", but it's hidden if you're at the top of the wave, so we're gonna rework that as well.
Regarding the "trial and error" aspect, it's something we want. We try not to make it unpleasant, but it is part of the game to sometimes just try things to see how it turns out, and then retry with the newly acquired knowledge to succeed, since there is no penalty when you respawn.
We have planned to try a mobile version, even if our main focus will probably remain on PC (less constraints, not to say I don't feel like trying to market a mobile game, this is war over there).
Thanks again for playing and taking the time to give us feedback!

[Nordanvinden]

Thanks a lot for the detailed feedback, many valid points here!
Never thought about short keyboard, it definitely raises the need to support wasd higher in our priority list! Same for the lack of clarity for the keys of the tutorial.
There is in fact an indication to press the right key when you reach the first "end wave", but it's hidden if you're at the top of the wave, so we're gonna rework that as well.
Regarding the "trial and error" aspect, it's something we want. We try not to make it unpleasant, but it is part of the game to sometimes just try things to see how it turns out, and then retry with the newly acquired knowledge to succeed, since there is no penalty when you respawn.
We have planned to try a mobile version, even if our main focus will probably remain on PC (less constraints, not to say I don't feel like trying to market a mobile game, this is war over there).
Thanks again for playing and taking the time to give us feedback!

Totally get what you mean about the mobile market :/

Seems like you have a good idea about where to take this project. Looking forward to future updates

[Grhyll]

Seems like you have a good idea about where to take this project. Looking forward to future updates

We're slowly building our vision, some points are very clear for us, others a bit less We are still at the prototype stage, we want to gather a lot of feedback for it before moving to a full game, and we really take our time.

[Grhyll]

If anybody is in Toulouse or Lyon this week-end, we will be presenting the game at the Toulouse Game Show and the Japan Touch Haru / Geek Zone! So please come say hi if you're around

[Grhyll]

Devlog entry

We are freezing the prototype! We have spent a lot of time working on it in order to gather quality feedback, and now it's time to start the work on the real, full game, with everything we learned thanks to that prototype

What we did since last build:
    - Full support for gamepad on standalone build (not supported in browser, the build can be downloaded on the same page)
    - Polish on ending
    - Heavily reworked the tuto
    - Several LD tweaks
    - Support for WASD/ZQSD in addition to arrows
    - Lots of thinking and discussions regarding the controls and the future of the game!

The two salons were great, we had lot of players of all ages, and it was fun to see that sometimes the children are better than the grown-ups, probably because they are better at adapting to new situations! Nice thing however to see that even the youngest managed to have fun with the game

The prototype can still be played at the same link: oqogame.com/prototype/

Now with the full game!
We are taking things back a bit in order to have a clean start. Among others, there will be a visual update. We aim to keep the minimalist aspect of the universe, but still add some details here and there. Here is a glimpse of what our artist is working on:



That's it for today, there's a long road ahead of us, but we're quite motivated!

[Juliano]

Just played the demo, the game looks pretty fun! Actually I have not stop playing it, I just paused to write the post hahaha

Have you thought about making the movement binded on clockwise and counterclockwise direction? So you could just use up and down or left and right.

It reminds me of this game: http://store.steampowered.com/app/367570/oO/

[Thaumaturge]

Ooh, the new art-style looks pretty. Simple, easily-read, but with enough variety that it doesn't look plain, to my eye. ^_^

[nathy after dark]

I really like it! Playing the prototype now. A couple things that might be janky:



When in a position like this at the start of a new screen, I can't move downwards along the circle past the starting position, only up (counter-clockwise). Is that a bug?

And when playing the tutorial, I had my hands on the arrow keys, then when the mouse controls were introduced I had to reposition my hands and discover WASD. Sometimes it's nicer to be all on the keyboard or all on the mouse (or at least know what to expect). I'm playing on a trackpad, which surprisingly seems fine, but the more quick-timey your puzzles get, the more playing on a laptop might suck. Just some audience-type stuff to think about.

Good work! I'm following.

Edit: One more thing, I was playing the prototype without reading any description first, and was able to figure out the controls and mechanics on my own with a few enjoyable "A-ha!" moments like discovering I could traverse the white circles as well as the static ones. So that aspect of discovery is cool!

I don't know if I would choose the word "soothing" to describe the game, though?