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TIGSource ForumsDeveloperPlaytestingGemini (Space RTS) , Work in Progress
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Camel
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« on: February 07, 2010, 05:26:32 PM »

Hi everyone Smiley

Gemini, it's a space themed RTS game, that it's under development.
It's still way away to being ready, but we can already get some nice shots and videos Smiley
I'm looking for feedback on the way our cinematic cameras are working
What you can see in the video, is basically 2 enemy fleets engaging eachother.
Because we are still re-working the GUI, i just turned on the Cinematic Camera, that the player can turn on or off at anytime of the game, and took a video of it.
Do you think the battle effects are cool ? Would seing this video (as a player and not as a developer) make you interested in finding more about the game ?
You can see the video in our blog :

http://www.camel101.com/devblog

Thanks
Bruno
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Sam
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« Reply #1 on: February 08, 2010, 02:58:08 AM »

Hello!

It feels like the camera is making basically the same movement again and again, just centered on a different ship each time.  Varying between a selection of such pre-defined movements would help keep it interesting.  Sometimes a zoom, sometimes a pan, sometimes attach the camera to the hull of a ship so you can watch it zoom about (or if the ship models have the level of detail; show a battleship's laser guns swing around and blow something up.)  Don't be afraid to add camera shake when there's an explosion near the camera's position too.

If you want to have a more recent sci-fi feel to the cinematic camera, consider having it behave much more like it's attached to a physical object that's moving through space rather than being a purely abstract position vector.  Consider how the camera moves in the Firefly series or Serenity film when it shows ships flying around - it gets knocked, rocked around and the camera seems to struggle to track fast moving ships, which creates a powerful physical sense of these ships actually existing.  Compare this with Star Trek:TNG era sci-fi, which has perfectly smooth camera pans and tracking much like your current camera system.  Smooth and well controlled cameras are a great asset during standard gameplay, but for this kind of optional cinematic camera you can afford to concentrate more on neat effects at the expense of practicality.

Is the direction that the camera ends up pointing random?  Would be nice if it more clearly showed what the ship is engaging.  I really know nothing about film directing, but I think there are various techniques for showing conflict between characters by their positions on screen.  At least aim to have the camera's set up take into account the position of a ship and their target.

An example of a cinematic camera that occurred to me was the one used in GTA4.  It was completely impractical for actually playing the game (too often failing to show where the player was headed) but it had a good variety of camera positions and movements which kept it interesting to watch.  If you're able to check that out it may give some useful ideas.

The effects are pretty nice, and I'm glad to see at least fairly colourful planets and space backgrounds.

I notice on the blog post you talk about how particular ships take much more damage to destroy.  I wasn't able to see this from the video. I think this is due to the camera cutting to a new sweeping movement all the time, which made it hard for me to keep track of where a particular ship was; let alone its relative health.  This isn't necessarily a problem, as the cinematic camera would be for getting neat views of the battle rather than being the primary means of getting information about what's going on.

The fight itself feels very static.  Obviously the game is still in development, but as a potential player I would be worried that it looks like combat is just lining up ships and watching lasers.  Show light fighters darting around the hulking battleships and missile frigates lurking at the back hurling attacks from range.  It is quite possible that these things are happening in the video, but I wasn't able to see it.

Showing some tactics in action throughout the video would be nice too, telling a simple story through the video.  It's a strategy game, so be sure to show potential players some strategy in action! Smiley

Now you should really introduce yourself!  Hang around, give feedback to other people, discuss art stuff, technical stuff, argue with Paul Eres.  It'll be grand.
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Camel
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« Reply #2 on: February 08, 2010, 11:51:57 PM »

Hello Salt,

Thank you very much for your feedback Smiley
It was much more than i was hoping for.
The camera is indeed "random", it cycles trough all the ships in the player fleet that have the flag "engaging" enabled to true, and smoothly moves into the same position as the ship at a predefined height above it, and then looks at a enemy ship that we are currently engaging.
The problem with having a selection of pre-defined movements, it's that, it's rather complicated of doing that, because i have no idea where the ships will be in the map, or what positions they will have, but yes, i need to come up with some other system, this gets kind of boring.
Galactica (with sepia and animated noise over the camera), and their rapid camera changes, and cameras attached to fast moving ships it's a nice touch. Another thing i want to make, is detect when a ship is about to explode,and change a camera to it.
Ships do actually have diferent damages, diferent shield energys and everything, but i understand it gets hard to track with the camera changing all the time.
Thanks a lot man, your feedback was precious Smiley
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Tapio
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« Reply #3 on: February 09, 2010, 12:58:50 AM »

Hi!
I agree with Salt in many of the points (me wants fighters to circle around the capital ships, leaving colorful trails behind them like in Homeworld Tongue ).

The graphics seemed very nice. What are the (estimated) system requirements, operating systems supported and technologies/programming languages used? Also, is this going to be a free game?

Looking forward to see and hear more! Hand Thumbs Up Left Hand Thumbs Up Right
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Camel
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« Reply #4 on: February 09, 2010, 01:17:05 AM »

There's actually already fighter squadrons in the game Smiley
However, they were implemented in wip art, and they are not yet working with the new carrier model, so they did not get to the video, the fighters actually do what you said, ehh

The game is being done in Unity, and the system requirements shouldn't be that high, but i didn't made any tests yet.
And the game is a commercial venture Smiley
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