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[Inane]

Okay, so I'm thinking about trying to learn flash once I'm done with my current projects; the thing is, I want it to be a fairly long game (let's say, 4-6 hours singleplayer campaign) with a plot in it. Not exactly a for-the-sake-of-it plot, either.
The thing is, I think generally people who play web-games are seeking short-term receive-bacon type games, so I don't know if it's worth it going with said language.
So yeah, wanted to know what you guys had to say about this.
DISCUSS.

[Melly]

Well, it's certainly something that hasn't been done much yet. I could very well imagine myself playing a long high-quality Flash game (as long as it easily recorded my progress). If you're thinking of making it freeware I say go for it. Not like you're risking anything and it'd be a neat experiment.

[Saint]

Well, you can make downloadable executables with flash as well as reading and writing save files, so I don't think you would be worse off than with any other wysiwyg-like editors. Some friends of mine made Promqueen with flash a few years back and the framework has only evolved since then. The lessons and tutorials included with flash are also very helpful.

You'll have to be careful about one thing, though, since you have the project decided before learning the tools. You need to be careful not to start working on the actual project before you have a good sense of how you want to structure it; specifically, since you're going to have a lot of dynamic content you might want to use dynamic loading and generic formats (like XML) to make development manageable and counter long initial loading times. When starting out with flash it's easy to simply use the graphical editor and just drop everything you want where you want it, but this will most likely come back to haunt you if you're making a long game.

[Guert]

If you are about to learn a new language, I suggest that you first do some tests with it.  As Saint mentionned, you need to have a good sense of what your tool can and cannot do. That doesn't mean you can't start designing the game you have in mind.  In fact, elaborating the design might help you choose the right tool to create your game (confimring the use of flash or discarding it)

Also, like Melly said, web-games can be quite long if the game allows the player to easily save his progress. You'll also need to supply plenty of mid-term goals to make sure your player will want to come back to your game. I feel web-games are just like what arcade games used to be. Thousands of game, in one single place, all wanting the player's attention. Each game tries to attract the player with all sorts of tricks but the game with the best gameplay and short-term/mid-term goals wins his attention. So, to answer your question, yes the game may be worth it and players will enjoy it if you manage to fulfill their "short-term, receive bacon" need as well as offering something deeper along the way. Of course, that's my personal view.

Good luck on the project

[handCraftedRadio]

I definitely would rather play a long game as an application.

[Xion]

I definitely would rather play a long game as an application.

What he said. Among other reasons, the ability to play offline is quite nice. Of course, you can have a standalone flash file, right?

[deadeye]

I definitely would rather play a long game as an application.

Thirded.  When I'm online I'm pretty much looking for quick entertainment.  The longest I've ever played a browser game for is about ten or fifteen minutes, with very few exceptions (I went through all of Platform from beginning to end, and a couple tower defense games have had me hooked).  I much prefer longer games to be downloadable apps.

[Xion]

I went through all of Platform from beginning to end....blah blah blah

I like the way it's episodic like that. So there's another option if you're really want it to be browser-based. im ho, that's much more appealing than having an epic, online-only adventure.

[Inane]

Thanks for the all the awesome answers, guys!
It'll actually be atleast a few months before I even start on this, just so you know.
So if you were given the option of choosing between online play (Probably with a small ad at the begining) and offline download, would that get your jollies on or whateverthefuckexpressionyouwanttouse?

[Xion]

Yeah, the option for both would get my jollies on. Get 'em on hard!

[ஒழுக்கின்மை (Paul Eres)]

I don't have a problem with playing long games in a web browser, provided you could save and return at any time.

[BenH]

What kind of game is it going to be?

[Inane]

turn based strategy

[Eclipse]

well, if it's in flash you can do it standalone very easily too, you will have more players because people will be able to run it also offline or on an pc without a connection and an higher quality sense.

Long web based games are good only if played in multiplayer (Mud, mmo or a room based thing)

[Thorst]

What about bandwidth usage?  If people can download your game as an executable, then they will probably only do it once.  On the other hand, I guess you could load a web game in parts depending on how far people play.  Though my impression has always been that flash objects load completely before they start.

That said, I think more people are likely to try a web game than a downloadable one.  I have no idea if there is any research to back that up.  And in the indie, screw capitalism spirit, think of all the people who play games at work.  They might not be able to run executables, but they can play flash objects in a browser.

Edit: I just joined, and I've been reading back several pages.  I just realized how far back this post was.  What did you decide to do, Inane?

[Melly]

I say have the application BOTH on the browser and as a downloadable. Everybody wins.

[PHeMoX]

Yeah, it would be a good experiment too... you know to see if people are willing to spend so much time on playing a browser game. It hasn't been done a lot I think.

[dustin]

I am down and ready for a long web game and I always wonder why there arn't many...

That said I would want it to be more in the style of portable games ie. Fire Emblem it's epic and long and a srpg but you can stop at any time and continue where you left off.  It's good in short bursts.  That's what I think your game would need too.

[Thorst]

The developer Arcane Journeys, just featured on this site, designates its web games as persistent browser-based games (PBBGs.)  According to pbbg.org, this usually implies a massively multiplayer web game, but it includes long single player games also.

And how exactly would saving work?  I would rather not have to create an account or write down anything.  In fact, I think if the game has saving, I would always prefer a download to a web game.

[Edmund]

honestly i think the best way to do it would be in flash (web/exe) but release it in episodes. not only will get get a bigger fan base once you have all the episodes out, but it will also get you a pretty penny when it comes to sponsorship for each episode.

also, from personal experience, its better to do things in little chunks as an indy/web game dev because you never know what will happen while your making it. almost every web game ive done was originally going to be part of a larger game, but for whatever reason the "Full" version never got done.

so really think about cutting it up, it helps. and doing both exe and online flash is ideal.
-Edmund