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[PleasingFungus]

Love the game!  I may have found a bug, though.  Below is a custom level and a proposed solution.  The solution passes the first four tests, but fails the fifth with "ACCEPTED, should have been REJECTED".  The problem is that it should be an *output* test, not a filter test...  If it's not a bug, what am I doing wrong?

?ctm=UnaryToTernary;OUTPUT:_Given_a_string_of_X_reds,_return_X_in_ternary_(R=0,_B=1,_G=2).;:r|r:b|rr:g|rrrr:bb|rrrrrrrrrrrrrrr:gbr|rrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr:brrg;7;3;0;

?lvl=35&code=p14:5f4;q13:5f2;g13:4f3;r14:4f3;b14:6f1;c15:5f0;c9:6f3;p9:7f6;p9:8f6;p9:9f6;r9:10f2;c10:6f0;i10:7f4;i10:8f4;i10:9f4;c10:10f1;c11:6f0;q11:7f7;q11:8f7;q11:9f7;y12:6f0;y12:7f2;y12:8f2;y12:9f2;q13:6f4;i13:7f5;i13:8f5;i13:9f5;c13:10f0;r14:7f2;b14:8f2;g14:9f2;c15:6f1;c15:7f1;c15:8f1;c15:9f1;y12:5f3;&ctm=UnaryToTernary;OUTPUT:_Given_a_string_of_X_reds,_return_X_in_ternary_(R=0,_B=1,_G=2).;:r|r:b|rr:g|rrrr:bb|rrrrrrrrrrrrrrr:gbr|rrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr:brrg;7;3;0;

That's a bug, yeah. Had a similar report earlier. "If you make your own binary output level, if it gets the wrong output it gives the wrong screen." There's a reason for that, internally... it's still a bug, though. I'll try to have it fixed in the next release, whenever that will be.

Glad you're enjoying the game otherwise!

[Notch]

Great game! I just beat the Metatron level for any two numbers of up to 9 digits each. I've got some space left over to try to count the digits instead of having a fixed size loop.
Sure, there are plenty of interface quirks, and I couldn't for the life of me figure out how to copy an area of the level, but it all kind of adds to the charm.

By the way, the game IS turing complete! (That's an interpreter for Rule 110, a turing complete cellular automata.)
Well.. It WOULD be turing complete if the tape was unbounded.

[naath]

Counting the digits... that's an interesting approach; out of interest why?

(My solution to Metatron starts at the back end and goes forward until it runs out of number in both halves; which in theory ought to work on numbers of any length at all although obviously in practice limited by the size of the tape)

[Notch]

Some of the random tests had strings of different lengths, meaning I had to have a fall-through case for "no data" to mean "0". And that meant it just kept looping forever, so I added a simple loop counter thing.

My solution probably isn't optimal.

[naath]

Ah, yes, sometimes it requires you to read 'run out of number' as 'pretend it has a zero here' which did cause infinite loops of adding zero to zero for a while ;-)  But I now have a "detect that both numbers are finished" section that it starts running through once the first number is empty.

[PleasingFungus]

Oh wow, oh wow, it's Notch! All of my indie heroes are posting in this thread! It's like a dream come true!

...hm um yes

Sure, there are plenty of interface quirks, and I couldn't for the life of me figure out how to copy an area of the level, but it all kind of adds to the charm.

You copy by selecting an area with the select tool, then hitting shift-c. I'd have used Ctrl-C, like a sane person, but apparently Flash does very strange things when Ctrl-C (and -V, and probably a few other things) are involved.

By the way, the game IS turing complete! (That's an interpreter for Rule 110, a turing complete cellular automata.)
Well.. It WOULD be turing complete if the tape was unbounded.

Nice!

I designed the game to be Turing-complete (ignoring the finite tape issue) - it's a queue machine. But that is really dang cool! Totally justifies that binary-number-display I stuck on. More than justifies it.



Anyway, glad you enjoyed the game! If there's anything in particular you had trouble with in the UI, let me know, and I'll look into it. (I still have at least one major update planned before I stop maintaining the game.)

[Notch]

I designed the game to be Turing-complete (ignoring the finite tape issue) - it's a queue machine. But that is really dang cool! Totally justifies that binary-number-display I stuck on. More than justifies it.

Ooh, I'd never heard of queue machines! Thanks for the link.

As for the interface, I found the way to rotate or flip copied regions 100% unintuitive. It took me AGES to figure it out, and it's basically a ui gesture you don't see anywhere else (hover something somewhere to change it?). But somehow, it kind of adds to the charm.

If you do want to fix it, give them each a keyboard shortcut and show that under the icons, like the quick switching to different blocks work.

You know, I've probably spent more time playing this than I did playing Mass Effect..

[man-man]

As for the interface, I found the way to rotate or flip copied regions 100% unintuitive. It took me AGES to figure it out, and it's basically a ui gesture you don't see anywhere else (hover something somewhere to change it?). But somehow, it kind of adds to the charm.

Ooooh, so that's how that works. Thanks 

[PleasingFungus]

I designed the game to be Turing-complete (ignoring the finite tape issue) - it's a queue machine. But that is really dang cool! Totally justifies that binary-number-display I stuck on. More than justifies it.

Ooh, I'd never heard of queue machines! Thanks for the link.

No prob! They're a bit obscure, I think - I only thought of them because they were mentioned briefly in passing in my automata class. I think Manufactoria is pretty much the only actual use for them!

As for the interface, I found the way to rotate or flip copied regions 100% unintuitive. It took me AGES to figure it out, and it's basically a ui gesture you don't see anywhere else (hover something somewhere to change it?). But somehow, it kind of adds to the charm.

Oh gosh, that.

Yeah, that's a bit silly. It would make more sense if I made it like Paint (i.e., selections only 'drop' once you make a click outside the selection, not just whenever you release the mouse)... as it is, the bizarre hovertron is a compromise with necessity. (I mean, you can't click the buttons to rotate it; you're already holding down the button to drag the selection around!) It's a mess.

BUT

If you do want to fix it, give them each a keyboard shortcut and show that under the icons, like the quick switching to different blocks work.

The thing is...

They already have shortcuts! (Look at the bottom of the screen when you have the select tool equipped! Or others, for that matter.)

I do like the idea of adding the shortcut-indicator-light beneath the rotate/flip buttons, though. That would probably help... (many people miss the stuff on the bottom of the screen.) I'll put that on my List.

You know, I've probably spent more time playing this than I did playing Mass Effect..

Anecdote time!

I just returned from southernly exile, and went to visit a friend's house for the first time in months. As I walked in the front door, my friend's brother greeted me. We spoke for a moment, and then he asked: "Hey, you've played Minecraft once, right?"

"Yeah," I agreed. (A bit more than 'once', but I wasn't going to split hairs.)

"Is 'Pleasing Fungus' your brother?" he asked. He'd spotted the last name, and figured that it was one of us, but had gotten a bit confused about which - I corrected his misapprehension.

"Notch posted about your game on his Twitter," he told me.

I am still new enough to this thing that it surprises me whenever my game-developer secret identity spills over into real life!

This is the end of the anecdote.


-


I've added a few features / bugfixes since 20e (for that matter, since 20d, which pleasingfungus.com is still running on since 20e was mostly Kongregate stuff), so there might be one more small update before the massive, terrifying MALEVOLENCE UPDATE. (Due somewhere between the 14th and the 21st). Also, I've been working on the NEXT GAME for a few weeks now; details posted in (as ever) excruciating detail on the devlog. Lots of screenshots!

-

On which note: I'm looking for an artistic collaborator. The programmer-art in Manufactoria was mostly all right, I think, because of the style of game it was, and because it was always going to be a game with a strictly limited appeal... but I think the ~~next game~~ could actually maybe go commercial, make tens of dollars, that kind of thing. It could be the next Flytrap, the Daikatana of our generation! It deserves better than I can do for it. (Art-wise.) So: collaboration!

I'll probably post an announcement in the appropriate forum in a few days with proper details (what sort of game ~~nextgame~~ actually is, moneystuff, etc), start actively hunting... but I'm writing this now while I'm too tired to know any better.

Yes.

This post is done now.

[Batmanifestdestiny]

I noticed that most people used lots of green and yellow to solve Androids.  I found a solution that I think is a bit more efficient:

http://pleasingfungus.com/?lvl=17&code=p12:4f3;c11:5f3;p11:6f3;p12:6f2;p10:6f4;c10:7f0;c9:7f0;c8:7f1;c8:6f1;c8:5f2;c9:5f2;c10:5f2;c12:5f0;c13:5f0;c14:5f0;c12:7f2;c13:7f2;c14:7f1;c14:6f1;c11:8f3;c11:9f3;c11:10f3;c11:11f2;b11:4f3;c11:7f3;


I dunno, maybe this has been done before, but when I checked out the walkthroughs on jayisgames I didn't see a solution like mine.  I noticed that most of my solutions end up being lollipop shaped. O_o

Cool game, bro!

As for your art issue, I know a couple of people, but I'm not sure if they would help you out or not.  I could ask!

[naath]

Yeah, um, Batmanifestdestiy, I know that passes the tests... but it isn't a solution to the question.  Try feeding it BRBR which should fail but passes yours.  I think it is just accepting any even length input that starts with a B.

[Batmanifestdestiny]

Yeah, um, Batmanifestdestiy, I know that passes the tests... but it isn't a solution to the question.  Try feeding it BRBR which should fail but passes yours.  I think it is just accepting any even length input that starts with a B.

Oh, well, I passed the level, so...I'm too lazy to fix it.

[man-man]

Yeah, um, Batmanifestdestiy, I know that passes the tests... but it isn't a solution to the question.  Try feeding it BRBR which should fail but passes yours.  I think it is just accepting any even length input that starts with a B.

Oh, well, I passed the level, so...I'm too lazy to fix it.

Failed in random testing for me. "Any even length input that starts with a B" would be accurate - the only way for input to be rejected is if it runs out of dots on the 1st, 3rd, 5th etc symbol.

?lvl=17&code=c12:9f3;c12:10f3;p12:6f3;g12:4f3;r10:5f2;q11:4f5;p11:5f1;p11:6f4;b11:7f1;q12:7f6;p12:8f7;i12:5f5;

12 piece solution.

[PleasingFungus]

The MALEVOLENCE ENGINE is nearly complete! Version 1.30, which I've slaved over for the last month, is now in BETA.



I’ve uploaded it to Dropbox for the moment, for testing… there’s a few things I still want to add. (New scoring, Kongregate custom level sharing, maybe a MALEVOLENT FLASH as the Malevolence Engine detects WEAKNESS in your creations.) But it works! IT LIVES.

MWA HA HA HA HA

…hm.

Testing would be appreciated - your saves won’t work, but if you press �right.

[man-man]

Testing would be appreciated - your saves won’t work, but if you press �

Gave it a very brief run-through, and it did what it was supposed to do.
Running it from a crappy laptop (slow enough that it occasionally makes twitch-based flash games easier by playing them at a reduced rate) and it still calculated its malevolence in just a moment's wait, at least on the few levels I tried.

Although... ?lvl=2&code=p12:6f7;c13:6f3;c13:7f3;c13:8f3;c13:9f0;p11:6f4;p11:7f7;p10:7f4;p10:8f7;p11:9f7;c11:8f3;

Slip in a circuitous route by which a case that should be rejected might be accepted, and it didn't catch it.

Edit: Or, on the same level, a not so circuitous route to accept a bad case. ?lvl=2&code=p12:6f7;c13:6f3;c13:7f3;c13:8f3;c13:9f0;p11:6f6;c11:7f3;c11:8f3;c11:9f2;

[Istas]

The "Generals" test (in the Dropbox version) gave a blank robot as an input robot.

Also, no problems on the Malevolence engine. Most I've seen it pause is about a second so far (though I've got a fairly fast computer too). It's a bit of a start when it freezes the graphical cursor in the game while it's doing that, but I guess that's not avoidable. (the mouse itself still moves, the computer isn't frozen, just the in-game cursor)

[PleasingFungus]

Gave it a very brief run-through, and it did what it was supposed to do.
Running it from a crappy laptop (slow enough that it occasionally makes twitch-based flash games easier by playing them at a reduced rate) and it still calculated its malevolence in just a moment's wait, at least on the few levels I tried.

Excellent! I'm curious about how it does on some of the later ones, but that's good to hear.

Although... ?lvl=2&code=p12:6f7;c13:6f3;c13:7f3;c13:8f3;c13:9f0;p11:6f4;p11:7f7;p10:7f4;p10:8f7;p11:9f7;c11:8f3;

Slip in a circuitous route by which a case that should be rejected might be accepted, and it didn't catch it.

Edit: Or, on the same level, a not so circuitous route to accept a bad case. ?lvl=2&code=p12:6f7;c13:6f3;c13:7f3;c13:8f3;c13:9f0;p11:6f6;c11:7f3;c11:8f3;c11:9f2;

Haha! I'd actually turned off the Malevolence Engine for a few levels (Robotoast, Robocoffee, RC Cars and Robocars) to avoid confusing new players - it's always going to test the empty string first, and I thought that'd perplex new players unnecessarily.

But perhaps it's inevitable! I've uploaded a new version with the Engine enabled for all levels.

The "Generals" test (in the Dropbox version) gave a blank robot as an input robot.

Agh, that was stupid on my part. Fixed!

Also, no problems on the Malevolence engine. Most I've seen it pause is about a second so far (though I've got a fairly fast computer too). It's a bit of a start when it freezes the graphical cursor in the game while it's doing that, but I guess that's not avoidable. (the mouse itself still moves, the computer isn't frozen, just the in-game cursor)

Yeah, that bothered me too. I've hid the cursor for future; now at least it won't be so jarring!

[Istas]

I just realized how dry and robotic my previous post sounded.
This game is very awesome. It is three layer awesome, topped with awesome icing.
I can't get my mind off it for more than half a day, so I must complete it. Must!

[PleasingFungus]

I just realized how dry and robotic my previous post sounded.

It's okay - that's appropriate to the setting!

(Glad you're enjoying the game!)

[man-man]

My (woefully inefficient) solution to judiciary made the engine give up; it said it was brooding for a couple of seconds, then said it was "out of patience".

Probably a good idea to have a timeout if it's taking too long to look for flaws, but the threshold could be higher. Even on this craptacular laptop it was only 'thinking' for a short time.

Hell, I was thinking of suggesting an artificial delay of a second or so, just so there's time to read the odd screen that flashes by in an eyeblink (on most levels) when you click play. Maybe drop in a fake progress bar or a spinner while it calculates. I didn't even realise it was saying that it found no flaws until I tried it on a more complex level to slow the thing down.