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May 17, 2021, 01:46:14 PM

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TIGSource ForumsDeveloperPlaytestingManufactoria: A Game About Putting Robots In Their Place
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Author Topic: Manufactoria: A Game About Putting Robots In Their Place  (Read 130901 times)
höhöhö
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« Reply #380 on: September 06, 2012, 04:19:01 AM »

hi, Seraphim wants me to accept an empty string, but that does not count as two equal strings separated by a green. the minimal accepted string should be one green.
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PleasingFungus
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« Reply #381 on: September 06, 2012, 06:38:20 PM »

hi, Seraphim wants me to accept an empty string, but that does not count as two equal strings separated by a green. the minimal accepted string should be one green.

Yeah, that's an oversight on my part! Sorry about that. If there's another update, the fix will go in it.

EDIT: actually, you shouldn't be getting that string as an input - are you testing on the custom input mode?
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höhöhö
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« Reply #382 on: September 07, 2012, 03:13:00 AM »

yes, i was testing it in custom input mode.
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PleasingFungus
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« Reply #383 on: September 07, 2012, 08:03:01 AM »

yes, i was testing it in custom input mode.

Well, the game will only test your machine with strings of the correct format (x+green+y). The behavior for strings not of that format is unspecified - the fact that the custom input claims empty strings should be accepted is arbitrary & meaningless! Don't worry about it.

(Glad to hear from someone enjoying the game!)
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höhöhö
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« Reply #384 on: September 09, 2012, 01:07:39 PM »

oh, i enjoy this game a lot! (unfortunately i deleted my cookies ...)
but it is sad that in a game about computability problem definitions are not to be taken as they are.
isn't it quite easy to implement the accept/reject thing for custom input via regex? (i mean, you did program the whole game, so it should be easy for you, at least in theory)
or adjust the problem definition.
feels like a nerd game, so it should be for nerds (thus consistent).
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PleasingFungus
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« Reply #385 on: September 09, 2012, 08:21:07 PM »

oh, i enjoy this game a lot! (unfortunately i deleted my cookies ...)
but it is sad that in a game about computability problem definitions are not to be taken as they are.
isn't it quite easy to implement the accept/reject thing for custom input via regex? (i mean, you did program the whole game, so it should be easy for you, at least in theory)
or adjust the problem definition.
feels like a nerd game, so it should be for nerds (thus consistent).

(A) Manufactoria is Turing-complete; that means that formal regexes aren't sufficient to describe the later problems, and actual-programming regexes... might work, but it'd be really clunky.

(B) The situation you described is in fact an oversight, but it's a very minor one, given that the game will never test strings of an invalid type when running your machine.

Thanks!
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höhöhö
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« Reply #386 on: September 12, 2012, 12:59:14 AM »

(A) didn't think this the whole way through. you're right. what do you mean with "actual programming regexes"?

(A') so you're testing input against a given list of possible solutions? you could use a Manufactoria-Automaton to check ...

(B) no problem. still like the game. sometimes i'm starting with base cases, that's is how i found it.
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PleasingFungus
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« Reply #387 on: September 12, 2012, 07:25:11 AM »

(A) didn't think this the whole way through. you're right. what do you mean with "actual programming regexes"?

(A') testing input against a given list of possible solutions? you could use a Manufactoria-Automaton to check ...

(B) no problem. still like the game. sometimes i'm starting with base cases, that's is how i found it.

(A) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Regex#Patterns_for_non-regular_languages

(A') Sure, but that'd be a lot more work (& a lot more error-prone) than just writing a few lines of code. (It would have been a much better approach to custom levels, but, well, live and learn!)

Anyway, glad to hear you're happy!
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rmsgrey
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« Reply #388 on: May 10, 2013, 03:29:56 PM »

The Malevolence Engine is out of patience!

My solution to Politicians (two blues per red) is correct (I assert) and only uses 31 pieces, but Malevolence gets bored with the less-than-optimal time taken.

Solution: http://pleasingfungus.com/Manufactoria/?lvl=22&code=g12:2f3;c12:3f3;c12:11f3;c12:12f3;b13:4f0;r9:3f2;q10:2f5;p10:3f1;b11:3f0;p11:4f0;r11:5f1;p12:4f7;c10:4f3;c10:5f3;q12:5f6;g12:6f3;p12:7f7;i12:8f1;q12:9f6;c13:6f0;c13:7f3;p13:8f7;q14:6f1;p14:7f5;p14:8f2;b14:9f1;r15:7f0;c12:10f3;q10:6f3;r11:6f2;r11:2f2;

The machine runs a two-pass algorithm, first sorting the string by repeatedly stripping the first red to the end of the string until there are no blues after the first red, and second repeatedly stripping the first two blues and the first red from the sorted string.

Worst case length n string for the machine would be n-1 reds followed by a single blue

So I decided to dust off the game and start again from scratch, and, with a slightly more piece-efficient layout (29 pieces) and the same algorithm, I hit the same problem with Malevolent impatience:

http://pleasingfungus.com/Manufactoria/?lvl=22&code=g12:2f3;p12:4f7;b13:4f0;r11:2f2;q10:2f5;p11:4f0;p10:3f1;r9:3f2;b11:3f0;c12:3f3;r11:5f1;c10:5f3;i12:8f5;c12:12f3;p12:10f3;c12:5f3;c12:6f3;q12:9f6;r10:4f3;c12:7f3;g11:6f3;p11:7f2;p11:8f3;p10:7f1;r9:7f2;q10:6f3;p10:8f4;b10:9f1;q12:11f3;

I didn't bother saving my much more time-efficient layout that just strips out the first red and first two blues it comes across in whichever order they occur and copies anything else but it took more pieces (33)
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phillip1882
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« Reply #389 on: January 25, 2019, 04:28:25 PM »

i was wondering, i ave some ideas for custom levels, but need a larger playfield, could you manage making a 26x26 playfield?

i'll offer 100$ if you do, just tell me where you would like it sent.

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phillip1882
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« Reply #390 on: April 13, 2021, 11:42:23 AM »

i really like my robo-children solution:
?lvl=18&code=c12:3f3;p12:4f7;p11:4f7;p13:4f7;y10:4f1;g14:4f1;c10:3f2;c11:3f2;c14:3f0;c13:3f0;c12:5f3;c12:6f3;b14:7f1;r10:7f1;c10:6f2;c11:6f2;c14:6f0;c13:6f0;c12:8f3;q11:7f3;q13:7f3;q12:7f3;p12:10f7;i12:9f1;r11:10f1;b13:10f1;c13:9f0;c11:9f0;c10:9f0;c9:9f1;c9:8f1;c9:7f1;c9:6f1;c9:5f1;c9:4f1;c9:3f2;c12:11f3;
and my politicians solution, which make use of this:
?lvl=22&code=c12:2f3;g11:3f2;p11:4f0;y11:5f1;c12:3f3;p12:4f3;y13:4f0;c12:5f2;c13:5f2;q14:6f7;q15:6f7;q13:6f7;r16:6f1;b12:6f1;c16:5f0;c15:5f0;c14:5f3;c14:7f3;c14:8f3;p14:9f3;p13:9f3;p15:9f3;g12:9f1;y16:9f1;c12:8f2;c13:8f2;c16:8f0;c15:8f0;c17:10f1;c17:8f1;c17:9f1;c17:7f1;c17:5f1;c17:6f1;c15:4f0;c16:4f0;c17:4f0;c14:4f3;i14:11f7;c15:11f2;c16:11f2;q14:12f7;c14:10f3;g13:12f1;y15:12f1;c13:11f2;c17:11f1;c14:13f0;c13:13f0;
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phillip1882
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« Reply #391 on: May 02, 2021, 09:08:00 AM »

after much frustration i solved the addition one on my own. its only weaknesss is it asumes a and b are of the same lengt?lvl=31&code=b6:7f2;c6:8f2;c6:9f1;c6:10f1;c6:11f1;c6:12f1;c6:13f1;q7:6f5;p7:7f5;c7:8f1;g7:9f3;c7:13f0;g8:6f2;r8:7f0;r8:8f2;q8:9f1;q8:11f6;g8:12f0;c8:13f0;g9:7f3;c9:8f3;p9:9f7;b9:11f2;c10:7f0;b10:8f0;q10:9f5;p10:11f3;q10:12f6;g10:13f0;b11:6f2;q11:7f1;g11:9f3;c11:10f0;r11:11f0;c12:6f3;p12:7f3;r13:6f0;q13:7f5;g13:9f3;c13:10f2;b13:11f2;c14:6f1;c14:7f2;b14:8f2;q14:9f1;p14:11f3;q14:12f6;g14:13f2;g15:7f3;c15:8f3;p15:9f3;r15:11f0;g16:6f0;r16:7f2;r16:8f0;q16:9f5;q16:11f6;g16:12f2;c16:13f2;q17:6f1;p17:7f1;c17:8f1;g17:9f3;r17:12f2;c17:13f2;b18:7f0;c18:8f0;c18:9f1;c18:10f1;c18:11f1;c18:12f1;c18:13f1;r6:4f2;q7:3f5;p7:4f1;i8:3f3;b8:4f1;c7:5f1;c8:5f0;g9:3f2;p8:2f1;r7:2f2;b9:2f0;q8:1f5;r14:10f3;b10:10f3;r9:13f0;p16:10f3;r17:10f0;b15:10f2;b15:13f2;p8:10f7;r7:10f2;b9:10f0;b7:12f0;r9:1f2;r10:2f3;g10:1f2;g11:1f3;g11:2f0;g12:2f2;g13:2f1;g13:1f2;c14:1f3;q10:5f1;q9:5f1;c9:6f2;c10:6f1;c14:5f0;c13:5f0;c11:5f0;i12:5f6;c10:4f2;c11:4f2;c12:4f3;c14:2f3;i14:3f5;i10:3f5;c14:4f0;c13:4f0;c11:3f2;c12:3f2;c13:3f2;c15:6f0;b16:2f3;p16:3f6;r16:4f1;p17:1f6;c17:2f1;q17:3f2;c15:3f2;c18:1f3;c18:2f3;c18:3f3;c18:4f3;c18:5f0;c17:5f0;c16:5f0;c15:5f1;c15:4f0;q12:8f6;c12:9f3;c12:10f3;c12:11f3;c12:12f3;

a brief rundown of the algorithm:
create two new strings, one the XOR of a and b, the other the AND of a and b, shift the AND left one, then repeat the algortim
letting the two new strings be the new a and b. repeat untill the AND string is all red.
 
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