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TIGSource ForumsPlayerGamesWhat are you playing?
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Koicrow
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« Reply #8800 on: August 22, 2017, 12:39:50 AM »

Playing Kingdom Hearts for the first time ever. Super late to the party probably, but good god am I enjoying it so far.
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« Reply #8801 on: August 22, 2017, 06:50:23 AM »

Just finished Ori & the blind forest. Absolutely beautiful precision platformer. Took me 11 hours with very little replayability, but 100%-it and I do recommend it.
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« Reply #8802 on: August 22, 2017, 06:52:15 AM »

Playing Kingdom Hearts for the first time ever. Super late to the party probably, but good god am I enjoying it so far.

Played KH1 and bought and beat KH2 multiple times. The story does get convoluted, but they're really great games. If you like the first one, you'll probably love the second one.
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« Reply #8803 on: August 22, 2017, 12:16:54 PM »

yakuza is still too fuckin long
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diegzumillo
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« Reply #8804 on: August 23, 2017, 08:21:28 AM »

I just finished replaying all classic sonic games, from 1 to 3+knuckles. The idea was to hype myself for sonic mania but with each game I played my hype died a little lol. It's a fun game with a somewhat inconsistent design. It wants you to go fast but then punishes you for doing it, so you go slow and it punishes you for going slow too. Look at this huge loop and ramp! run!
 run, sonic! oooh did I put those spikes there? oh wow, jeez, sorry. OK be careful now. Careful! ooh you don't have enough speed to climb that ramp? oh jeez, wow, sorry about that.
But with proper level design these things balance each other nicely. I still want to play sonic mania!
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« Reply #8805 on: August 23, 2017, 09:48:10 AM »

west of loathing is probably my favorite indie game in years
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gimymblert
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« Reply #8806 on: August 23, 2017, 10:49:43 AM »

I just finished replaying all classic sonic games, from 1 to 3+knuckles. The idea was to hype myself for sonic mania but with each game I played my hype died a little lol. It's a fun game with a somewhat inconsistent design. It wants you to go fast but then punishes you for doing it, so you go slow and it punishes you for going slow too. Look at this huge loop and ramp! run!
 run, sonic! oooh did I put those spikes there? oh wow, jeez, sorry. OK be careful now. Careful! ooh you don't have enough speed to climb that ramp? oh jeez, wow, sorry about that.
But with proper level design these things balance each other nicely. I still want to play sonic mania!

Which version did you play? because there is a significant quality drop between the original on the genesis and the badly emulated port version (that goes for all version of the game, modern like classic, at least up to heroes).

Also there is a culture shock with people accustom to playing mario like game, the problem you mention are so easily avoidable (I did it when I was 7) that it boggle my mind lol. But games have literally standardized their navigation around mario so it's not surprising.

I literally never had to run into trap ever in the original, the whole game is about momentum management they are the main challenge, if you have problem with that you are playing like a mario and didn't bother to learn the very basic of the game (especially when the game offer alternative routes when you don't have momentum, except in the first level because it's trying to teach you the game). To me the level design appear very consistent, there is a ebb and flow from slow part and fast part, and transition between the two and "tease" about secondary skill routes that you only notice a split second on first playthrough in fast part, and anticipate on second playthrough. All fast section tend to stop you before any enemy or obstacle, either by having them potent if they have a full stop, or have a slight ramp or bumper to have a slow spectacular jump to a "stop landing" without removing your control, the game design is about playing with anticipation and surprise the player, it's also immensely replayable because the game is packed with secret and alternate path. In a way mario is a theme park, you have a sequence of separated navigation challenge, sonic is a skate park, element relate to each other base on your movement, entirely different expectation.

The game is also base on committing to your action and trusting the level design, the roll allow you to literally beat any enemy and uncap speed limit, the game teach you the roll using these tubes in the first level by literally force you into a roll, go through an enemy, get to great speed then launch you through a ramp that lead you to great height and a path impossible to reach otherwise with an enemy bait to rebound and maximize ring, then it land you on a sequence of moving platform you have to pay attention to proceed, this sequence is literally a well packed microcosm of the entire game. Thing is mario player don't pick up this stealth tutorial because they never roll and never use momentum ever again in the same way, and mario don't teach you the gameplay as greatly as this sequence (that mushroom bullshit in mario 1-1 is bollocks I never get that mushroom ever as a kid because I jumped a second time and it reverse direction lol). Also unlike mario, ball form of sonic is literally invincible save for trap and projectile, using the ball form is the basic of sonic. You have far more protection than any other game when messing up, which give you time to learn.

A lot of the level design is based on near miss of danger that only hit you when you lose a steady hand and you lose when you just don't trust the gameplay or level design. That's where the port mess up, a lot of near miss are based on precise timing, ie for example when the enemy is triggered by the screen scrolling, which the port messed up, I know there is portion of metropolis where the projectile of enemy hit mean when they should have just grazed me in the genesis version, it's also particularly broken in chemical plant where some trampoline straight don't send you into the air as they should. There is some bad enemy placement, metropolis act 2 I'm looking at you, brain scrap zone, or even mania titanic monarch (not sure for that level, I haven't the game yet, it's out the 28 on pc, my switch is held by sister now, but I watch playthrough and even pro get those nasty enemy who have front circular saw, which defeat split second roll the game teach you all along). But even with that, the game reward exploration (of level and gameplay) by giving you literally infinite regenerating health with the ring if you can fathom the small challenge of taking them again, so you don't have the pressure of losing all health like other game.


Later game like sonic colors was popular because it's literally a mario game, momentum was only one tool or a set pieces, not the core fundamental of the level.
« Last Edit: August 23, 2017, 10:56:21 AM by gimymblert » Logged

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« Reply #8807 on: August 23, 2017, 11:06:50 AM »

You made the mistake of mentioning Sonic, now you pay the price.
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« Reply #8808 on: August 23, 2017, 11:13:44 AM »

One summer I spent some time playing the sonic game for ngpc thought it was kinda alright
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« Reply #8809 on: August 23, 2017, 12:01:46 PM »

You made the mistake of mentioning Sonic, now you pay the price.
Cheesy

@gimymblert
I am indeed playing emulated version, maybe that influenced my experienced a bit. But I don't know, I never owned an NES. I'm from Brazil, one of the places where SEGA dominated, so I know I wasn't Mario biased at least. And I know sonic games are not about going fast but speed management. Anyway, some levels flowed really well, while others didn't. Mostly the levels I never played before didn't, which might not be a coincidence.
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gimymblert
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« Reply #8810 on: August 23, 2017, 12:07:19 PM »


I am indeed playing emulated version, maybe that influenced my experienced a bit.

I'm talking about the port made by sega, I think fan emulator tend to be good, but I haven't tried them that much.

But I'm not only responding to you, It's an occasion to praise the level design Tongue

Also A lot of complain I have studied are similar, it's not just about mario in itself, it's about mario like platformer, sonic is unique, even if you didn't play mario, other platformer and side scrolling game follow the mario formula. Any game that tried to emulate the sonic formula missed the mark completely by being mario with speed and nonsensical level design (bubsy and co).
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diegzumillo
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« Reply #8811 on: August 23, 2017, 12:24:53 PM »

Now I'm curious to know your thoughts on Sonic Mania. Does it live up?
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« Reply #8812 on: August 23, 2017, 12:53:48 PM »

I hadn't played it YET, but consensus in the design fan community (yes there is a community specifically dedicated to learning and perfecting the sonic school of level design) is that it's the best one so far. Also they are free from the 16 bit limitation, that mean longer level and more ambitious set up.

The thing is that more than other platformer, sonic is all about the level design, extra actions and power up are more little sugar than main modifier or key to level design, becausee the level design is already rich in itself. Sonic is already a bit "3d" in that you constantly shift between a hidden foreground and background (2 lanes) unlike other platformer that keep you on one plane, that's why there is loop de loop (lane shift), the fact that level stay readable despite this lane shift (for example when a bumper send you in another lane with a different slope (chemical plant do that a lot) and you can't access the other lane anymore), is a testament of the sophistication of the designer. Mania expend on that using the legacy of fan games who explored specific level design consideration.

I think boss design look a bit too rough:
- because they changed the formula (for the better but ...)
- some don't communicate what to do as greatly as they should
- some have pacing problem
- they are quite unequal among themselves, some are clearly better than other
I personally like it, they become little puzzle to figure out, too much predictability bores me now, but the designer in me can see the flaws. Also they are all super creative and surprising, it does go all other the place though.

Have you heard the soundtrack?
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diegzumillo
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« Reply #8813 on: August 23, 2017, 01:47:43 PM »

Well, you hyped me up again. :D

Quote
Have you heard the soundtrack?

YES. I love it.
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« Reply #8814 on: August 23, 2017, 05:46:03 PM »

Started Ori and enjoying it.

Also reinstalled Cities Skylines as I'm feeling the itch again. Nice game to play in short bursts every 4-6 months.
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« Reply #8815 on: August 23, 2017, 06:10:58 PM »

@muki - Good call ! Ori has a small number of places where there are long areas/cutscenes and you cannot save until you completed the entire area. Those tend to be the difficult part of the game, the ones that involve precision platforming. Except those, the game feels like a pleasant breeze.

For the skill trees I chose the middle one, then the upper one. Made it a bit more difficult to deal with monsters, but knowing where all the secrets are helped me a lot to complete all the skills faster and having 10+ life makes a huge difference.

Also - there is an area on the lower right side - not connected to the main story or any quests, but you should visit it before going for later quests as it gives you new abilities.
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« Reply #8816 on: August 24, 2017, 06:49:21 PM »

I cant stop playing Tekken 7.

Besides that I'm new game+ ing Nioh. That game is really good and with the mission structure I can sit down for an hour, do a mission and move on.

Finally Persona5 when I'm not playing the other 2. Almost finished the game.

Downwell because it was free on ps4 and I can just play a game whenever.
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« Reply #8817 on: August 24, 2017, 07:35:03 PM »

Since Sunday I've beaten

Dragon Quest V
And Yet It Moves
Capsized
Brothers: A Tale of Two Sons
Shank
Evoland
Noitu Love 2: Devolution
Octodad: Dadliest Catch
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« Reply #8818 on: August 25, 2017, 09:16:19 AM »

i really want to keep playing dq v, but i have it on my phone and it won't let me listen to podcasts while i grind so i no longer want to play it on the train. it's a shame, because it's basically perfect for that, but square enix is dumb.
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« Reply #8819 on: August 25, 2017, 10:01:20 AM »

I don't know if that's an oversight or intentional on their part. Sucks either way.
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