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[kamac]

Hey Mr. J

There's actually a free version release of DarkBasic Pro:
http://www.thegamecreators.com/?id=2000&m=view_product&page=free

The problem is it IS *supported by ad's* and it may come with license issues (like you can't sell your game, unless you purchase full version of DB) I'm not sure on that at all. It may be worth checking it out.

I checked out a Dark Basic trial yeeaars ago. It was pretty cool, but didn't know enough about code to actually do anything, and the time trial ran out..! Now I'm using GameMaker, really great program. And, despite it's rep as a 2d program, is fairly capable at 3d.. it's got a good core of simple, basic 3d functions, fully capable of making fine 3d games

Since your looking at making an RPG, I have to say for me you have 2 main choices: It's GameMaker, or RPGMaker (version whatever)

GameMaker will offer you tons of flexibility over your game, and it isn't 'limited' so when your project is finished (in the next 10 years!) you'll be able to make virtually any other genre, even 3d games.
Issues: You will need to learn to become a competent programmer with the GameMaker Language(GML), and yes, it's an easy language, but it will take time! The GM community is a fantastic place for help, though.

RPGMaker: Never used it, but even as a non-programmer I'm relatively certain you'd still be able to pick it up, and use it.. and as you get better with the program, I think there's a relative amount of flexibility *with in that genre*. But when your game is done, it's another RPG game..

People do know nothing about DBPro on TIGsource, do they  ?

It's free, free... free. Free for personal use (not for big companies), what you make with it is yours (royalty free), you can sell it or do whatever you want with it. About the ads it is being supported with, it's just a bar in the IDE, which is giving you only The Game Creators ads, like Dark Game bonanza or whatever they have in offer, it's always the same ad. It doesn't give any ads in your game.

Free download (no trial or anything): http://www.thegamecreators.com/?m=view_product&id=2000&page=free


But at the end i wouldn't recommend Game Maker if you want to become a C++ programmer this way. So let me describe some paths:

If you want to become a programmer:
-Pick up some free BASIC language, because paid aren't worth it.
-Learn it until you understand basics of loops, conditional "ifs", variables and all which resolves to programming in general.
-Then, if you want to learn C++ and you have been programming in BASIC language (or LUA. Some recommend Phyton) just buy a book. Don't try to learn from the internet, it's giving way too small experience.


And if you want to stay small and use easy ways not giving you perspectives for being a programmer in an company (What company uses Game Maker for game development?  ) then use:

-RPG Maker 2003 or any of it's further versions (XP, VX, there was also 2000 and some others, the difference between 2003 and XP/VX(?) is that you can program in ruby in XP/VX(?). Useless for me, but...)

OR

-Game Maker (Great tool, you can make a selling game with it, but don't count on 3d. Actually, there aren't good 3d 'game makers' or any click-to-make programs)

OR

-Multimedia Fusion 2 (Developer) (I think it's worse than Game Maker, i've been using both, but Game Maker is giving you waaaay bigger possibilities. Just because GM is using scripting language)



And that's it.  

!Addition!

Pricing:

DarkBASIC Professional -	FREE
Blitz3d -	100$
BlitzMax -	80$
RPG Maker 2003 -	Couldn't find, free everywhere but not in Japan/China
C++ -	FREE (doh  )
PlayBasic -	~ 30$
PureBASIC -	79 EUR
LUA -	FREE (doh  )

[1982]

Well it is all about how you use the tools what ever they are. They just need to fit your purposes, if not, then your game designs had to fit to the tools  RPG Maker is the easiest of making "simple" 2D games, mostly in top-down forced perspective. I don't have experience on GM, but it is a lot more flexible, although probably harder to use too. Then there is free(?) Scirra Construct, which is quite similar with GM.

Talking about RPG Maker, its functionality is not limited to just jrpg style games:
(examples don't include any custom scripting, just standard RPGM functions)

[ink.inc]

-Then, if you want to learn C++ and you have been programming in BASIC language (or LUA. Some recommend Phyton) just buy a book. Don't try to learn from the internet, it's giving way too small experience.

I dunno, I taught myself C++ a few years back simply from reading a few tutorials on the internet. It only took a month to get the grasp of it.

But when I took a class for it (with a book and everything) the course took a whole quarter to accomplish what I did in the first week.

The internet is your friend.

[kamac]

I dunno, I taught myself C++ a few years back simply from reading a few tutorials on the internet. It only took a month to get the grasp of it.

But when I took a class for it (with a book and everything) the course took a whole quarter to accomplish what I did in the first week.

The internet is your friend.

Well, i've also tried to teach myself from the internet, and i did, but the results aren't as deep as from reading a book. You just get loads more informations from a book rather than from internet and it is all glued in one place, instead of spread all around the internet. If you didn't read C++ book, you should.

the course took a whole quarter to accomplish what I did in the first week.

That is not a secret, that classes are for dummies usually, and what they accomplish in month, you can accomplish in approximately a week and it's not just about IT classes. If you would be deep interested in maths, you would get the same effects, instead of doing 5 excercises over whole class in one day.

[danny34]

I think that NaaLaa is an excellent tool:
1. Create standalone programs for Windows
2. Generate Java applets for the web
3. Use the NaaLaa standard libraries and tools to make advanced games in no time
4. It is freeware
http://naalaa.com/

Games:
http://games.naalaa.com/

Official Forum:
http://forum.retrogamecoding.org/

Author's Blog:
http://blog.naalaa.com/#home
    

[ஒழுக்கின்மை (Paul Eres)]

i'd recommend GM if you want to make 2d downloadable games, unity if you want to make 3d games, flash (with flashpunk or flixel) if you want to make 2d webgames, and c++ if you are a control freak and like programming engines more level design, or if you want to become a professional game developer one day

there are other options but those are like the 'standards' of indie games

[MattG]

its really all about performance. If you dont care about pushing tons of stuff in real time then using flash type or premade game makerstuff will save you alot of work. IF you need very high performance the best thing is c++ and do everything you can on hardware

[mirosurabu]

You can learn programming via trial-and-error. No book or tutorial required really, so as long the language is a simple one (like Basic or Python). That's how I started programming back when I was a kid. Had nobody to help me, help function didn't work, so I had to literally figure out how it all works through trial-and-error.

Of course, you don't have to be as hardcore as this, but that's only better for you.

[dustin]

I would rate my prefrence on learning a language as follows...

Class
Internet
Book

and as far as this...

That is not a secret, that classes are for dummies usually, and what they accomplish in month, you can accomplish in approximately a week and it's not just about IT classes. If you would be deep interested in maths, you would get the same effects, instead of doing 5 excercises over whole class in one day.

Different classes target different audiences.  I would't say they are usually for dummies just that if you take an intro class in something your good at then of course it will be slow.  I've taken classes were we had to learn a new language every week and a half for 9 weeks.  Obviously C++ and other languages are huge and you can't possibly learn it all in a week and a half but if your familiar with programming you can learn enough to do useful stuff with.

[kamac]

Different classes target different audiences.  I would't say they are usually for dummies just that if you take an intro class in something your good at then of course it will be slow.  I've taken classes were we had to learn a new language every week and a half for 9 weeks.  Obviously C++ and other languages are huge and you can't possibly learn it all in a week and a half but if your familiar with programming you can learn enough to do useful stuff with.

I've meant those in schools (where learing direction isn't programming).

[Serapth]

I put together a rather comprehensive beginners guide to getting started at game programming, that people have told me is quite useful.  It covers languages to choose from, the tools to download, the libraries to use and links to free and recommended books as well as gives a recommended getting started process.  It is a very very very long read, but I promise you, if you do read it, you will definitely know more than when you started it.  I tried my hardest to keep personal bias out, but with all things programming, that's an almost impossible task!


That said, I have no coverage of Flash, GameMaker, DarkBasic, etc...  mostly because of lack of personal experience, partially from lack of personal interest and finally because the document was already long enough and I was approaching small book territory!

Hope you find it useful. 

[dustin]

I only have one question for your guide...

Why in the world do you not like VIM/emacs?!  Or do you just think they are bad for beginners (which I can see).  I can code so much faster in VIM then in anything else...

[danny34]

oh..don't need to buy book to learn programming.
There should many books about learning programming in public library.

Moreover, many good programming tutorials can also be downloaded from the Internet.

[Nix]

There should many books about learning programming in public library.

All the public libraries I've been to had pretty paltry programming sections.

Moreover, many good programming tutorials can also be downloaded from the Internet.

Books go into much more depth and detail than internet tutorials. They are also more complete and are often better written.

[Fanotherpg]

IMHO Multimedia Fusion 2 Developer (and yes I'm using mainly it but alongside GM 8.1 Pro, Construct 2, Stencyl, UDK or Unity):

You can create 2D and 3D games as well as programs with hardware acceleration (Pixel shaders)

You can export on several platforms: PC, Vitalize (their web plugin), Screen Saver, Java (Sub-application, Stand-alone, Internet Applet, Web Start, For Mobile, Blackberry, Mac App) Adobe Flash, Android, XNA (Windows, Xbox, WP7), iOS, Anaconda (Python: Windows/Mac/Linux).

You decide where to put your applications - you don't need to ask Clickteam for permissions or even attach their logotypes.

Over 550 Publicly available extensions.

You can get your games on Steam, Gamers Gate, Desura, Big Fish Games and other services.

Last but not least huge and helpful community with own Article and example libraries, Wiki, Repository and IRC Chat available 24/7/365.

People like: Nifflas, Hempuli, Radix, Konjak, Derek Yu, Satan Sam just to name few are or were using this range of products and some of them made quite good money out of it.