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[PaleFox]

Chrono Cross also has no random encounters.

It's a pretty good rpg as rpgs go. It doesn't really have much to do with Chrono Trigger until late in the game even though the entire story is the result of Chrono Trigger's storyline (spoilers I guess the sequel happens after the first one). It has too many characters but it is worth playing.

[s0]

idk i only discovered chrono trigger fairly late (i'm in europe and the snes version was never released here) and tbh, i can't get into most jrpgs anymore because their stories don't interest me for the most part. something like final fantasy is awesome when you're 12 but as you grow up you start to see how it's really just a giant pile of cliches and tropes. i know this is prolly going to piss a lot of people off but i had a similar feeling about chrono trigger. it felt like something i would have enjoyed immensely as a kid and would be nostalgic for now but am simply "too old" for.  

[ஒழுக்கின்மை (Paul Eres)]

it's more of a sequel to the visual novel radical dreamers -- a lot of characters from radical dreamers are in chrono cross. so radical dreamers is sort of like the missing link between cc and ct

and i agree that ct's story isn't that great in retrospect. you should try xenogears if you haven't tho, i think it's better than both ct and cc (it was mostly the same dev team and has some spiritual ties to those games, tho it's a different universe)

although xenogears did borrow a bit too much from evangelion, i still think it's quite a ways above ct in terms of storytelling

[PaleFox]

CAS, I know how you feel. I haven't felt tempted to play a jrpg in ages -- I tried to play ff13 recently and couldn't get through four hours (in contrast I spent eight hours playing Oblivion). They are too drawn out and tedious. Chrono Trigger thrives only because it's got a sense of humor, in my opinion, and also because of romhacks that make the game much more enjoyable -- a noteable one is the "lvl.0" hack which normalizes the entire game at a single level, meaning there is little to no grind involved and you can avoid enemies you don't want to fight. It also means you can't overgrind a boss -- it makes the game much better and more interesting, and is a system more rpgs should use!

FF13 on the other hand is just running down corridors as boring people bitch at you. Not good.




Xenogears is some of the most tedious stuff I have ever played. Cutscenes out the ass. Don't like random encounters? Well you're in for a fucking roller coaster of them.

[s0]

The only new JRPGs I still enjoy are the Megami Tensei series because of they deal with really interesting themes and aren't just rehashes of the same tired cliches and games like the new Dragon Quests and Xenoblade because they're more focused on exploration than story which is kool. My problem isn't so much that JRPGs are drawn out it's just that I don't feel any inclination to play a game that focuses heavily on story when that story is boring to me.

[SirNiko]

Chrono Cross drowned in a sea of characters. 40 characters, literally. And there are literally less than half a dozen combo techs in the ENTIRE ROSTER.

But the story was kind of neat, and it made the new game+ mode interesting because there were actual decisions to make that you could not take back. If you get it cheap it's worth playing through once.

I really look at JRPGs to present me with interesting combat systems to master. I like playing new Final Fantasy games because usually there's a new combat system to learn and some new equipment mechanic to master. The story, puzzles and exploration are there to either dress up the combat system or provide a world in which the mechanics can flourish. FF13 failed because the combat system turned out to be shallow and uninteresting, not because it was condemned to corridors. FFX did the corridor game thing and it really was an enjoyable game (once you got past the absolutely tedious story).

[The Monster King]

Chrono Cross is fun until it mentions Chrono Trigger elements, at which points it feels like they are taking a very large poop on it.


when they kill Robo with text and by that i mean text happens and that means Robo is killed, it was like a big fuck you. also that boss was boring

Like SirNiko mentioned its lack of double techs was pretty shitty too, what was the point of even putting them in! Equipment is sort of "streamlined" and it makes it a bit boring, too, save a few exceptions. Pierre with Hero equipment best character

[baconman]

Chrono Trigger could possibly be a very different experience now, because it coined a lot of the tropes that many games since then have used liberally. But back during it's main release, it was pretty fresh stuff! It was THE pre-eminent "time travel RPG," and the limited-but-flexible cast allowed each character to have a deeper, more intimate involvement with the plot (not to mention personality galore). Plus, geometric and dual-tech attacks just plain rock. Tell me you didn't AT LEAST enjoy THAT...

Although I haven't touched any RPG in ages either. After the PSX era, I pretty much gave up on them. They're still a hit with the ladies, though. Once in a while, I get to wondering what it would be like if there was a condition/ending where you *could* win the game at the "Disc One Final Dungeon." (CT at least makes you wait for the "Disc Two Final Dungeon," ...but yes, it can be done!)

Most people still love it for the music, too. The Magus showdown, the Frog theme, the Zeal Kingdom and Ocean Palace themes are practically historical, now. I personally loved the Ayla and Robo themes a lot too, the jailbreak/battle theme, and the all-too-infrequent "Super Boss" theme that only played a few times, like when facing Giga Gaia and Azala/Black Tyrano.

-And now, back to the main thread...-

Just like music with singing is about exploring the relationship between the two, and not just the sum of them; "artgames" should also be about exploring the relationship between the art of the game and the game itself. Good art != Good artgame. (On second thought, it IS a rather fitting place to be discussing Chrono Trigger, huh? Except the pedo stuff, I mean.)

[baconman]

Lisa died at 43, then adopted two children and discovered she was infertile. Consequently, she was also aware of sustaining precisely 10% of her body being burnt in a fire around the age of 7 or 8, or something like that; and died a multi-hundred-billionaire.

However that works. lol

[shig]

deus ex isn't an art game because its' gameplay isn't subverted

i fucking love you