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TIGSource ForumsPlayerGeneralIGF Thread 2012
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Author Topic: IGF Thread 2012  (Read 122869 times)
increpare
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« on: October 14, 2011, 01:22:18 pm »

Keep it constructive.
« Last Edit: October 14, 2011, 01:34:22 pm by increpare » Logged
deathtotheweird
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« Reply #1 on: October 14, 2011, 01:23:26 pm »

phil fish re-entered fez despite already winning an award.

please don't tell me I am the only one who finds something wrong with this.
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Manuel Magalhães
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« Reply #2 on: October 14, 2011, 01:24:41 pm »

you're not.
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increpare
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« Reply #3 on: October 14, 2011, 01:26:25 pm »

brandonnn sez

"I have already said 2012 is a leeway year for re-entry, with 2013 taking a stronger approach to discouraging prior finalists/winners."
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jotapeh
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« Reply #4 on: October 14, 2011, 01:30:03 pm »

I said this in the previous thread but I'll say it again here.

I think it's a little shitty ONLY because future entrants won't be able to do this. It's clearly against the spirit of the thing (since they're making it a rule, and all that.)

Anyway I don't pretend to have any authority on this topic. I've never made anything IGF-worthy, though I do plan to in the future, I should probably shut my piehole until such time.
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deathtotheweird
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« Reply #5 on: October 14, 2011, 01:34:06 pm »

that's ridiculous.

I hope the judges make the right decisions when judging the game and take into account the fact that Fez wouldn't exist in it's form today without already winning an award.
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increpare
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« Reply #6 on: October 14, 2011, 01:35:10 pm »

EVERYONE COME JOIN THE IGF PIRATE KART BUNDLE
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jeb
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« Reply #7 on: October 14, 2011, 01:35:54 pm »

I'm really looking forward to the participation list! Since I started working on you-know-what, it has been hard for me to keep up with the indie community, so I'm sure it will be full of surprises.

Also, I don't fully understand the whining about Fez. They won a prize for their art style, and if they win a prize for having a good game too, then they deserve it. I'm more into whining about games that have been pseudo-published by Sony and what-not Wink
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« Reply #8 on: October 14, 2011, 01:41:32 pm »

Trying my best to not take sides here, but if you don't think Fez should win, submit a better game? No competition can be as level a playing field as you want unless everyone starts out broke.
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Glaiel-Gamer
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« Reply #9 on: October 14, 2011, 01:44:31 pm »

Also, I don't fully understand the whining about Fez. They won a prize for their art style, and if they win a prize for having a good game too, then they deserve it. I'm more into whining about games that have been pseudo-published by Sony and what-not Wink

Well fez is being published by microsoft isn't it?

I dunno, I know how phil feels here, a game can change a tremendous amount in 2 years, nevermind 5 years, to the point where its embarrassing to think that the shitty demo you submitted so long ago was actually able to win stuff. I feel the same way about Closure, but since it has only been 2 years it would just feel wrong for me to resubmit, even though the game is so different now. We wouldn't be where we are today without the IGF award so it feels wrong to submit again and potentially rob someone else of that opportunity.

other (neutral) thoughts:
Would there be this much controversy if the game wasn't called "fez" 5 years ago? If the current version was called "fez 2" or "new fez" or something to that extent?
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Hangedman
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« Reply #10 on: October 14, 2011, 01:51:18 pm »

I'm not terribly concerned. I hope the judges use their discretion. That's the idea.

I'm entering because I could really use feedback and also a bit of noise if I do well. I have no illusions about winning, and I know if I do even marginally well people will immolate me for it. Or if the game improved and changed and I wanted to resubmit, the same would happen. I don't know.

Ultimately it's the people involved who decide whether the IGF becomes a joke or not. Remains to be seen.

EDIT: While I like the spirit of the En Masse Trainwreck Entry, I doubt it won't be disqualified out of hand, for being multiple games/using copyrighted assets/not having full information on everyone involved. That's neither here nor there, but it seems like a bit of an empty gesture.
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« Reply #11 on: October 14, 2011, 01:53:07 pm »

Another thing I think is important is that many years, a single game win will 2 (I'm not sure if ever 3) different awards. Fez has only won for visual art, but there are a lot of other innovations in audio and probably tech as well, which I don't think should be ignored simply because a prototype of the game won an art award 4 years ago.
Still he won once regardless of the category. The "ITS A DIFFERENT GAM" argument doesn't work because if it wasn't for the first time he won the IGF FEZ wouldn't have the awareness that has today. Even if this time wins a different award it's not fair for the other contestants.
I agree with what Glaiel-Gamer said, the game might have been shit compared on how it's today, but since the prize helped to make the game like it's now it's fair to give the same opportunity to other devs.
« Last Edit: October 14, 2011, 01:59:29 pm by Manuel Magalhães » Logged

Zaphos
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« Reply #12 on: October 14, 2011, 01:56:00 pm »

Well fez is being published by microsoft isn't it?
I always hear that microsoft is a publisher on xbla games, but it never sounds like they're really fitting that role ... what does it mean in practice?  Do they provide financial support to devs they publish?  Do they have any creative/editing control (or apply any pressure like this)?  How does their role as xbla publisher compare to a traditional publisher?
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Hangedman
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« Reply #13 on: October 14, 2011, 01:56:58 pm »

Well fez is being published by microsoft isn't it?
I always hear that microsoft is a publisher on xbla games, but it never sounds like they're really fitting that role ... what does it mean in practice?  Do they provide financial support to devs they publish?  Do they have any creative/editing control (or apply any pressure like this)?  How does their role as xbla publisher compare to a traditional publisher?
I'd also like more clarification on this. I was under the impression that it was really just the approval process/a bit of publicity on the dash or whatever. Hardly publishing.
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« Reply #14 on: October 14, 2011, 01:57:10 pm »

Are there any statements made about (non-)acceptance of unfinished games, for this edition, or in the future?
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increpare
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« Reply #15 on: October 14, 2011, 01:57:46 pm »

Are there any statements made about (non-)acceptance of unfinished games, for this edition, or in the future?
nope
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deathtotheweird
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« Reply #16 on: October 14, 2011, 01:58:23 pm »

maybe not a "traditional" publisher role but they still perform the role of publisher. they market and advertise the games, and you have to sign a contract and presumably you also get paid more if you make your game xbla exclusive. and they do certainly have editing control since your game has to meet their standards in regards to control schemes and user interface elements and such (got that from the introversion post about the xbla process)
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« Reply #17 on: October 14, 2011, 01:59:30 pm »

Are there any statements made about (non-)acceptance of unfinished games, for this edition, or in the future?
nope

they will and should always allow unfinished games
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Glaiel-Gamer
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« Reply #18 on: October 14, 2011, 02:00:27 pm »

since your game has to meet their standards in regards to control schemes and user interface elements and such

fyi this is the same for wii, xbox, and ps3, regardless of if you're self publishing or not every single game has to meet a set of technical requirements
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fish
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« Reply #19 on: October 14, 2011, 02:07:45 pm »

here's my reasoning.

IGF wants the biggest and best games to enter their festival.
they allow both prototypes, and finished game to compete in the same categories.
sometimes, a prototype is so good that it beats out complete games.
sometimes they cant compete. but they want the best game to win.

4 years ago, our first 30 days of work got us an art award.
it launched our careers and we might not be where we are today without that award.
but that was 4 years ago. and it was a single level. just a proof of concept.

almost 5 years of work will have gone into the final product that fez has become.
none of the art that won that art award is still in there.
by my count, the game that ships is FEZ 3. there's 2 other games you'll never see that came before it.

im extremely proud of the game we've made.
i love fez. i think we accomplished exactly what we set out to do.
the game works. it's great.

it's been doing great at festivals and other competitions so far.
and that's fantastic. but why should i stop here?
entering festivals and maybe winning awards is one of the best things i can do to promote the game. we dont really have any budget for promotion and PR. no big stunt. we have to do everything ourselves.

although it's starting to feel like fez is going to be a success, i cant assume anything.
the game is not out yet. i think it's going to do well, but i don't KNOW that. it could still fail. i might be kidding myself thinking the game is so great. who knows.

but it's my job to promote that game as hard as i fucking can. i can't sit on my ass and tell myself that it's enough and that i should stop here. im going to pimp this as hard as i can. i owe it to the last 5 years of our lives.

i hope the judges dont knock the game for having won an award 4 years ago, and instead judge it for what it is today. like somebody else said in this thread? what if we changed the name? seems like that would solve everything. it IS a different game. it's a WHOLE game. a game that i think can compete with any other game entering this year.

so we're entering it.

why shouldn't we?
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