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TIGSource ForumsPlayerGeneralStarcraft Motherfucking Two
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Kornel Kisielewicz
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« Reply #20 on: May 19, 2007, 05:58:10 PM »

Hell, it's about time!
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« Reply #21 on: May 19, 2007, 06:17:34 PM »

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I hate Blizzard with a religious passion

Quote
I'm glad too that it's not another shitty MMO.

What's with you people?  Talk about a terrible mindset for game design.  Sad
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« Reply #22 on: May 19, 2007, 06:29:41 PM »

Quote
I hate Blizzard with a religious passion

Quote
I'm glad too that it's not another shitty MMO.

What's with you people?  Talk about a terrible mindset for game design.  Sad

Word!  You can dislike certain games or certain genres, but to use words like "hate" and "shit" to describe Blizzard...

C'mon now!
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Inane
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« Reply #23 on: May 19, 2007, 06:47:11 PM »

Ehehe, I hold the belief that all MMO's are terrible, personally.
But yeah, to describe Blizzard as shitty would be like describing Cherry slurpees as shitty. Yes, grape and blue raspberry are both better flavors, but cherry is the most common, and is still quite good.

Edit: While I do love my metaphor, and it is definitely the best to ever grace these fine fora, I must state that now I realize that such a thing is a very general statement, and everyone is entitled to their own opinion. You just might get your ass kicked for it, is all.
« Last Edit: May 19, 2007, 07:30:45 PM by Inane » Logged

real art looks like the mona lisa or a halo poster and is about being old or having your wife die and sometimes the level goes in reverse
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« Reply #24 on: May 19, 2007, 07:05:44 PM »

Quote from: PoV
What's with you people?  Talk about a terrible mindset for game design.  Sad

I think recognizing what's good and bad, what people like and don't like, and what you personally like and dislike are vital to design in regards to knowing how what you're doing will be received by other players. And I fail to see how disliking a certain company or artist is poor mindset for when you go to make something.

Personally speaking, I don't like Blizzard. I've played all their games (except WoW but I have enough friends playing it and have watched enough gameplay to know it's more Everquest-esque moneymaking drivel) and I simply don't like their style. They do an amazing job with graphics and sound (voice acting especially), their writing is great, but the actual games... I just really don't care for. So every person that's going to jump up and down over SC2 going "OMG: Zerg rushes return!" I'll be there with a large wooden mallet with bloodstains to cause.

Quote from: Derek
Word!  You can dislike certain games or certain genres, but to use words like "hate" and "shit" to describe Blizzard...

C'mon now!

I'm coming. Believe me, I'm coming.

I'm going to play SC2 once it's available, and like all games on their first play, I ignore previous games, projects, etc, before passing judgement. Should Blizzard manage to prove me wrong this time around, so be it. Til then, I have years of experience that says otherwise.
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« Reply #25 on: May 19, 2007, 11:20:53 PM »

I Started out on Warcraft,
Then Came Warcraft II.
I soon stumbled upon starcraft,
Twice i played it through.
Warcraft 3 was really great,
Played countless hours before I quit.
Now holy shit it's Starcraft 2
That game looks so legit.  Kiss

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« Reply #26 on: May 20, 2007, 01:11:45 AM »

Quote
I think recognizing what's good and bad, what people like and don't like, and what you personally like and dislike are vital to design in regards to knowing how what you're doing will be received by other players. And I fail to see how disliking a certain company or artist is poor mindset for when you go to make something.

I agree knowing what you like and dislike is vital, but at the same time, so is understanding why you dislike something.  I can't think of a good reason to "hate" Blizzard.  They've lead the pack as far CG quality for many years.  They build games that are surprisingly approachable (Diablo is a fantastic example of complex game that almost anyone is capable of playing).  They support their games for years, releasing updates for games nearly 10 years after they've shipped.  They essentially invented the modern multiplayer game lobby.  They do nothing but good things for their community (ban cheaters).  They sponsor tournaments.  I could go on.

Outside of financial or success jealousy, I don't see a reason.  If you've had bad dealings with them or their parent company (Vivendi), then I suppose that's a reason.  Settling for "I just don't like it" is an "F" on your game research homework.

It's like hating bread.  Not because it makes you ill or anything, but because you can.  Congratz, you're a bread rebel.  May your bread rebellion bring you joy and riches in life.

Quote
Ehehe, I hold the belief that all MMO's are terrible, personally.

Sure, but if you break up an MMO in to it's building blocks, you get an RPG and a social community (i.e. chat/forums).  Congratz, you hate RPG's and Forums. Tongue


Now, don't get me wrong.  Just because I'm giving you guys heat for not eating it up, doesn't mean that I'm going to be loving it.  I personally don't get much entertainment value out of learning a new RTS technology tree.  There's a good chance I'll sit down, play one evening, and unless I get caught by the storytelling or general awe, that'll be it.  Sure, $50 for only a couple hours of entertainment.  Insert "cheap hooker" joke here.

You're not doing yourself any favors by "hating" something.
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« Reply #27 on: May 20, 2007, 02:24:31 AM »

I can't think of a good reason to "hate" Blizzard.

It's like hating AOL - you just don't have as large of a crowd to identify with.

Quote from: PoV
Outside of financial or success jealousy, I don't see a reason.  If you've had bad dealings with them or their parent company (Vivendi), then I suppose that's a reason.  Settling for "I just don't like it" is an "F" on your game research homework.

I've played all their games, some several times though. I've done some minor corporate history on them, and I've chatted extensively with people from both sides. If you can think of any other homework I could do aside from "working for them" I'd be glad to hear it.

Quote from: PoV
Now, don't get me wrong....There's a good chance I'll sit down, play one evening, and unless I get caught by the storytelling or general awe, that'll be it.

Didn't I say the only good thing they have going for them is that they create really good universes and write great stories? I think I did...

Blizzard has this nasty habit of creating awesome stories and universes to put their games in, writing great story lines, and then making shit games about them.

Oh yea, I did.

Quote from: PoV
You're not doing yourself any favors by "hating" something.

I get to point things out on forums, for one. ^_^

Let's step back for a second, and remove any bias. We have a sequel coming out to a genre that typically either thrives or fails quickly. Warcraft 3 was only mediocre until DOTA. Supreme Commander is still getting wails of "Why wasn't it better?". And the original is still a national sport elsewhere. My opinion/hunch, sans any previous hatred or love of Blizzard, thinks that people are probably going to gravitate back towards SC1 over SC2 in regards to what people will be playing in years to come after SC2 gets released. I could be wrong, it's possible that great care has been taken to ensure success. I do like what I see so far for SC2 so, we'll all just have to wait and see.

Worse comes to worse, Brawl is coming out soon, with a similar site update. I'll be focusing more on nay saying that instead of SC2.
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« Reply #28 on: May 20, 2007, 02:34:23 AM »

well, first of all, blizzard really isn't baf at all when you compare them to other big game companies today... activison, EA, etc... think about it...

second of all, i wonder which is gonna come out first: starcraft 2, or the starcraft mod for warcraft 3 lol (crossing my fingers and hoping you guys have heard about that)
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Alex May
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« Reply #29 on: May 20, 2007, 02:35:05 AM »

If you hate all MMOs then you haven't played Puzzle Pirates. Seems logical
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« Reply #30 on: May 20, 2007, 02:59:04 AM »

Questions for Shinji16:

1. Why have you played through games (several times) that you think are shit?

2. I'm just wondering when you say "shit," are you using such an extreme term to compensate for Blizzard's immense popularity, or do you really believe that they are shit?  Because basically I can totally understand if you don't enjoy playing their games, or somehow feel like their games don't live up to their potential, but to call them shit is just... well it discounts the incredible amount of hard work, time, and talent that goes into polishing a game to the level that Blizzard does, and I feel like a game developer should be more aware of things like that.

3. If you "hate" Blizzard, what word do you reserve for child molesters, rapists, and Peter Molyneux?

4. Wink
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« Reply #31 on: May 20, 2007, 03:01:15 AM »

There's a bunch of gameplay videos on youtube.

As for 'hate' (or dislike, or unwillingness to favour), it can be premeditative or a consequence. It might be a good gamble in some cases to premeditatively disfavour something, as long as you have sufficient data to construct a solid trend. Given that we have finite resources, I think it's a viable strategy to have certain biases. Although... there's always the chance that you can learn to like what you dislike, or ultimately, going into a state of perpetual delirium by watching dutch clog dancing.

SC2 looks pretty nice so far, but I still fear I won't be able to enjoy it. Its design philosophy is the antithesis of where my preferences lie. Pity.
« Last Edit: May 20, 2007, 03:08:07 AM by Arne » Logged
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« Reply #32 on: May 20, 2007, 03:06:37 AM »

Questions for Shinji16:

1. Why have you played through games (several times) that you think are shit?

2. I'm just wondering when you say "shit," are you using such an extreme term to compensate for Blizzard's immense popularity, or do you really believe that they are shit?  Because basically I can totally understand if you don't enjoy playing their games, or somehow feel like their games don't live up to their potential, but to call them shit is just... well it discounts the incredible amount of hard work, time, and talent that goes into polishing a game to the level that Blizzard does, and I feel like a game developer should be more aware of things like that.

3. If you "hate" Blizzard, what word do you reserve for child molesters, rapists, and Peter Molyneux?

4. Wink

And now, for a lesson in reading between the lines!

1) Same reason you read Charles Dickens if you're a literature fan.

2+3) I think about how much money Blizzard makes off of WoW and SC1. Such theft puts them on similar moral levels as rapists - they're both taking something from you.

4) ^_^
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« Reply #33 on: May 20, 2007, 03:17:28 AM »

what about Activision?
what about EA games?
what about Nintendo?
what about ...


there are far worse corporations than Blizzard, my friend...
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« Reply #34 on: May 20, 2007, 04:00:43 AM »

theft  :D
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Derek
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« Reply #35 on: May 20, 2007, 04:27:09 AM »

1) Same reason you read Charles Dickens if you're a literature fan.

2+3) I think about how much money Blizzard makes off of WoW and SC1. Such theft puts them on similar moral levels as rapists - they're both taking something from you.

4) ^_^

1. I guess... seems like a waste of time, though.

2/3. I've never understood the mentality that a successful person deserves any more hate than an unsuccessful person.  But then again, you're equating creating a video game to rape without any hint of irony or sarcasm, so you must live in an alternate universe that is beyond my comprehension.

But yeah, if playing Starcraft is violating you physically and emotionally, robbing you of your self-worth, and also putting you at risk for VD, I would suggest that maybe you stop playing video games altogether!

4. :3
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« Reply #36 on: May 20, 2007, 05:44:17 AM »

MMORPG is theft? In a way perhaps. They're doing something to the game in order to make you want to subscribe for years, and I bet it's not all Gameplay-MegaFun(TM) enriching your life. Fun alone can't account for the excessive amounts of time some people spend on these games. The Fun has to be dilluted and rationed in order to last for months or even years. This is where grinding comes in, and loss of time.
I know people who've lost their education thanks to... well, it's hard to know where to place the blame when it comes to addiction. But they lost something.

(I have a lvl 51 Runescape character.)


SC 2 is beginning to grow on me in some areas. I like the secondary abilities of the units, it's not all Gun-Health-FlyOrDrive. RockPaperScissor aspect still drives me nuts though. I'm not sure why, maybe I just don't like artificial 'mapping' (of what's good against what -only cuz the game says so).
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« Reply #37 on: May 20, 2007, 06:56:20 AM »

Oh my god, these comments are simply awful!

It is a disgrace to see someone using the word rape in such amnner.

Blizzard, or any other video game company, are in no way close to raping you or steal your money.

When you walk in a store to buy a blizzard (or any company) game, you willingly pick it up, put it on the cahsier, pull out your wallet and give it to the company. HWen you register online, you willingly give your credit card number to the company. You can choose to stop paying or refund the game. You have the chance to tryout the game with demos or free accounts.   

Sure, you don,t have to like everything Blizzard has created. Lord knows I don't. I'm not a Diablo fan at all but I can't help to marvel at how blizzard took a simple concept of "clicking on a enemy until it disapears"  actualy fun and popular. I never got into WoW, or any MMo's for instance, because it's not my cup of tea, but that doesn't stop me from thinking that WoW is quite a phenomenon since there are a lot of MMo's out there and I've witnessed people actually get so hooked on the game that they vansihed from social existence for months. Not a lot of games of any genre have done that.

When somebody is raped, it cannot stop it, it cannot control it, it is not willing and doesn't enjoy it. Nor when you've been stolen. You can,t do a damn thing about it and that's left afterward is psychological pain. I've never been raped or victim of theft, but I know some who have. Blizzard is merely offering you entertainment of high quality, like it or not, just like any other entertainment company of any field. I love games, I love music, I love movies and I love art in general. When I choose to buy something from these fields and tunrs out I don't enjoy them, I should feel bad because I didn't act like a responsible customer, not because the company did do what I wanted them to do.   

Maybe some of you didn't enjoy Starcraft at all. It's okay. I loved starcraft because of it's simplistic approach. Fast paced and worry-free gaming is what I enjoy the most. Starcraft was never about making several types of units with statistics that counters other statistics with certain upgrades that boost some statistics while not helping other statistics until you get the right statistics to beat the statistics of the enemy. Starcraft was about making lot's of units of different types and blast the crud out of an enemy base. Sure you could boost some stats but that wasn't the point at all. Making a 200 unit army was alot more interesting. Most armies in starcraft focused on little diversification of the units and have MANY of them.

Anyway, please, think a bit more before posting such things, siply ut of respect to thousands of people out there who didn't have much luck or to those who worked hard to bring a product that is enjoyed so much by so many people. Try to do a game like that and you'll see how hard it is...

Well, take care!
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« Reply #38 on: May 20, 2007, 07:58:31 AM »

If Blizzard would be a criminal organisation, they wouldn't be rapist or thieves. They would be drug dealers  Wink.

As for me - I'm excited as hell to hear about SC2 and that basically it's going to be the good ol' SC, with improved graphics and more units.

For me SC and War3 are still RTSs #1. And that's because of the extremally good design, polish, balance and support. In single player you've got a great story (best in RTSs so far for me) and in multiplayer... man it's a drug! Simple-yet-balanced design and focus on the reflex makes it a perfect online experience.

I can understand that's not what everyone likes. Some people prefer more easy-going RTSs with more units and flashy stuff - not everybody is a hardcore Korean gamer obsessed with showing his insane micro abilities Wink. But imho, the word "hate" is going to far.

But then again, I'm a person that rolls eyes when someone states that he/she HATES Micro$oft Wink.
« Last Edit: May 20, 2007, 10:17:11 AM by TeeGee » Logged

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« Reply #39 on: May 20, 2007, 09:45:37 AM »

How did a thread about a new game turn into Charles Dickens-bashing?  This is the silliest internet argument I have ever read!
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