next »

[matwek]

When I’m not making indie games I work full time as a Support worker for the severely disabled and today at work I was thinking about disabled people in games. Now before I let this topic turn into a preachy debate about the lack of disabled people in games or discrimination like that I wanted to take it down a different path.
In the real world disabilities are recognised in many different forms but in video games people follow a different set of rules and I wondered how disabilities could be portrayed in different types of games in unique ways.

For example imagine an RPG character that can’t level up in a world where everyone else can, how would that character feel? How would the NPC react to him?
That in turn got me thinking about the various “No Level up Walkthrough” guides that people have written for many different RPGs, just to give themselves a challenge. Could a game be designed with that already in mind? And what other Game disabilities could be explored?

Looking more at the RPG genre you could have a character that was born with his Max HP and Max MP reversed so that when he takes damage he can’t perform certain spells and when he casts spells he loses health.
Or maybe a character with a time bar that won’t fill up without help from his team mates.
Or someone who can only carry what they have equip rather than magically carry a massive collection of loot, because they have no inventory.
How about a character that lacks the ability to use a save point? You can have him in your team until you die and have to reload, at which point he never comes back.

[gimymblert]

It's not that disabilities are not represented in game (not about main character) is that disable people are indistinguishable from valid because generally they get high level prosthesis, mild disabilities are shown as scar which mean badasserie or even hidden superpowers. Being disable is literally having super powers because you will get "augmented" in some way (hidden weapon, sleeping powers, maximum resistance, maximum strength, etc...). Sometimes it is used to display victimization (oh no can't walk) or villainy too if the person is highly disfigured.

The problem is more that we don't deal with the experience itself of the disability.

[Muz]

I could imagine it working, like some "Trait" in Fallout where you can't do certain things.

But most people enjoy having a born advantage in RPGs. That's why you're so often a "chosen one" or "prince(ss)" of some kind.

[matwek]

The problem is more that we don't deal with the experience itself of the disability.

This is the thing that interests me. I'm not too bothered about the politics behind why it is portrayed so tactlessly but im more interested in how disability in a gaming world would be different to the real one. Almost in a breaking the forth wall kind of way.

I guess I'm more interested in the story side of things rather than gameplay. How would the chracters parents react to having a son/daughter who could never level up?

[agersant]

Lots of creative ideas in the OP, I like it.
Not leveling up is one of the least valid ones I think, because levels are extra-diegetic and NPCs rarely have a level (only PCs and sometimes monsters do). The ability to level up is the real anomaly here.

[randomnine]

I like this... you're essentially talking about using game systems to provide a narrative metaphor for disability which lets you explore it without people's preconceptions clouding the issue, right?

agersant's point about diegesis seems relevant. If a character couldn't level up or their HP and MP bars are swapped, would them being aware of it feel plausible? What could you get away with that gives you a sufficiently consistent, relate-able world in which to tell a good story?

In a city populated entirely by heroes, a child like no other is born - with no class or level - an NPC...

[wccrawford]

Quite a few JRPGs feature people who can't do what the rest of the world can, such as the protagonist who can't use magic, etc.

As for 'not being able to level up', that's too meta.  That's basically saying the person can't improve their skills, which only makes sense if the person is mentally deficient or the game is a game about a game.

[matwek]

As for 'not being able to level up', that's too meta.  That's basically saying the person can't improve their skills, which only makes sense if the person is mentally deficient or the game is a game about a game.

Well I don't think it could work on a full scale RPG but it could work with a smaller scale one. The chracters can still learn skills but their stats would just remain the same, it would put more focus on equipping the right armor and accessories, using items to change the course of a battle and picking and choosing your fights carefuly.

As for no leveling up being too meta, I think I disagre. If done correctly the concept of 'leveling up' could be made to seem more realistic. I mean we do it in real life as well to some extent, grades in exams, white belt to black belt in the martial arts, certificats for first aid training...etc. Whos to say these chacters can't live in a world were everything from strengh to intelligence is measured in levels and your social standing is based on that?
To quote randomnine...
"you're essentially talking about using game systems to provide a narrative metaphor for disability which lets you explore it without people's preconceptions clouding the issue"
To us having the other characters acknowledging the heros level might seem 'meta' because its a tool we use to measure porgress outside of the game, but to the people inside the game its no more different than judging someone for being poor.

[Grungi_Ankhfire]

Many of the ideas in the OP could be integrated in a 'believable' way in an RPG world. And they could give rise to some pretty interesting gameplay.

Story-wise though, would it not become like many (J)RPGs where the protagonist has some kind of special power which other people do not understand/see as a curse?

Yet, usually it is not the focus of the game, so I guess one constructing its core experience around a disabled hero in the sense of its game world could be taken in interesting directions.

[rek]

Injury in games tends to be nonspecific: your HP takes a hit, but your abilities are generally unaffected by physical damage, and special attacks only affect abilities temporarily.

In reality, you can lose limbs and organs for good, suffer lifelong brain and heart damage, or be exposed to chemicals that permanently alter mental functions or impede things like digestion.

Tiggers seem to love permadeath, so where's the permadisability?

[Graham-]

I think "disability" is a narrow focus. "Flaws" is better, and disability could be a sub-type.

Removing leveling entirely is narrow too, for a lot of reasons.... Better: control how a character can level. There are a lot of rules about how stats go up and abilities are earned in even basic RPGs. Certain chars could have warped versions of these rules, affecting the way in which they grow.

If a character can't develop a certain set of skills, that all other characters rely on, as easily, then learning how to deal with that flaw will be pushed to the front of the player's mind. It would be a good idea to reflect that flaw in the narrative.

For example, if all characters are stunned for a length in proportion to how much damage they took, and a specific character is stunned for triple that length, then maybe that char has a weak emotional constitution. When his ego is attacked, or his situation looks bad, or his social standing is threatened, he has to go through a longer period of recovery before returning to the compelling person he normally is.

This pattern could represent a lack of inner courage, maybe built on a weak home life from his younger years, covered up by moderate social connections in his later years. An enemy breaks through the veneer and a weak core is uncovered.

[Chromanoid]

I don't like the idea to reward the disability with a cool perk to keep things in balance. The whole topic would loose all depth.

People are labeled disabled, when they have problems doing tasks of the prevalent conduct of life. So you have to add some kind of incompatibility, that the player really feels. Even something, that isn't normally "classified" as a disability, can add a huge feeling of being disabled. For example a health potion allergy, the bottles drop everywhere, but you can't drink them. It must be something, where the player inherently knows, that he would normally be able to.

Over-compassionate NPCs, meritocratic asshole NPCs, bully NPCs etc. would be another way to tell the player he is part of a minority.

[sublinimal]

Some tasty food for thought here. Some of the particular examples (like a character that can't save) are probably too meta to be functional, but I understand the appeal of subverting established game mechanics. Truly memorable RPGs are born when you can tie in such gimmicks meaningfully into an in-game world, and I can see signs of that line of thought here.

You guys seem to be thinking of this in terms of narrative - like how a character would feel if they were the only weak one around. Being my usual puzzly self, most of the ideas I came up with were about weaknesses and strengths that complement each other, sort of like superspecialized class systems.

[Graham-]

I don't think we're suggesting narrative. We're suggesting mechanics that are then complemented in the narrative, so the mechanics force the player to empathize, and the narrative provides context and a link to the real world.

[Muz]

Injury in games tends to be nonspecific: your HP takes a hit, but your abilities are generally unaffected by physical damage, and special attacks only affect abilities temporarily.

In reality, you can lose limbs and organs for good, suffer lifelong brain and heart damage, or be exposed to chemicals that permanently alter mental functions or impede things like digestion.

Tiggers seem to love permadeath, so where's the permadisability?

Dwarf Fortress does this really nicely. Though it is a little depressing when your hero gets a broken spine and can't even stand up to adventure anymore. And really scary when you take a hard hit to the face and see all your teeth everywhere. While teeth have little purpose in the game, actually permanently losing them is sad.

[matwek]

One game I could see this working well with is the mass effect games. They're all about choices which ultimately lead to character deaths, well why not lead to something less final like losing a limb. That character would still be playable but his skills and abilities would be restricted. That would switch the focus onto you as you have to make the decision to cut them from the squad, which could lead to all sorts of interesting story arcs.

Or how about a character that is emotionally tied to someone who gets killed and drops into a deep depression that effects their abilities. As team leader it's your role to try and turn them around and get them back to normal, but if you handle it badly you end up making it worse to the point that it leads to suicide. That brings up some tough decisions because you don't want to have a weak link in your team but pushing them back out into combat might be the only way to build up their confidence... Until their problems cause the death of someone else and then you have also sorts of emotional shit kicking off on the battle field.

[matwek]

Inspired by some of these posts and my OP I've decided to have a go at making a game based on some of these concepts.
http://forums.tigsource.com/index.php?topic=30235.0

Would be great if people wanted to check it out and let me know what they thought of the idea.

[gimymblert]

Not rpg but seems to deal with disabilities
http://kotaku.com/5966779/whatever-it-is-the-phantom-pain-looks-very-intense

[Chromanoid]

http://katawa-shoujo.com/ also deals with the topic...

[teoma]

I had the idea of an adventure game where the main character is in a wheelchair.  The game wouldn't be 'about' the disability per se, but would portray it realistically.  (i.e, you couldn't reach certain places, stairs pose a problem, ect)