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[ChevyRay]

Why must every other thread be an insipid navel-gazing examination of this community?

Yes.

Every other thread?  You exaggerate, I think: this is the only such one I can spot that's active at the moment.

It was hyperbole.

[Renton]

Both are great, but I think if we really are "The Independent Gaming Source", and our forums are "The Independent Gaming Discussion" then there should be more player-focused stuff here.

I like the balance of things as they are at the moment.

Awful idea. Why must every other thread be an insipid navel-gazing examination of this community?

Every other thread?  You exaggerate, I think: this is the only such one I can spot that's active at the moment.

I don't like this use of the term "idea people"; irony notwithstanding, it has rather elitist, condescending, and anti-intellectual airs.

I think this is something we need to overcome soon, because the sooner we can overcome this, the sooner indie gaming can get itself an intelligent and devoted audience, like independent film currently enjoys.

FWIW, I personally have no desire to 'overcome' this.  I like the blurred line.  I don't particularly like the audience/creator divide.

I think that's all of my two cents now.

Seconded. Everything is fine just the way it is.

[ChevyRay]

That's the attitude, Renton

[Movius]

I often wonder why a website about independent game development would need all this solidarity forever bullshit and rules about who can and can't play in the sandpit.

[deadeye]

Cause we're in-dee-pendent and we don't need nobody nohow

Nahw GIT a'fore'n you meet the bizness end ah ol' Double Barrel Bessie here, see

[ChevyRay]

I often wonder why a website about independent game development would need all this solidarity forever bullshit and rules about who can and can't play in the sandpit.

I don't

[TeeGee]

I don't see the problem. TIGSource is great for both game devs and people who are just generally interested in games.
I actually think I belong to the later group more than to the first one, even if I am a game developer and enjoy learning and getting feedback from here.

It's just nice to see what cool games are out there and what other similar-minded folks think about them. I enjoy the random fun too and sometimes I hardly even remember this is supposed to be a game development community and not a private forum for a bunch of friends interested in games.

[moi]

I think this is something we need to overcome soon, because the sooner we can overcome this, the sooner indie gaming can get itself an intelligent and devoted audience, like independent film currently enjoys.

FWIW, I personally have no desire to 'overcome' this.  I like the blurred line.  I don't particularly like the audience/creator divide.

I think that's all of my two cents now.

DUDE!
This is not my post, don't put words in my mouth okay

[increpare]

DUDE!
This is not my post, don't put words in my mouth okay

My bad.  I've fixed the attribution.

[neon]

Everything is fine just the way it is.

but really, i agree.  i wouldn't change a thing about tigsource now.. we have the perfect balance of talented programmers to talented artists to talented musicians to talented designers to talented werewolves, and i think we get along really well the way we are now.  we have intelligent discussions like this, we make awesome games, we collaborate, we TIGjam ...what's not to like? 

What's TIGS about?
TIGS is about being part of a community in which members collaborate with each other, fuck around, make games, receive criticism, make art, music, etc. and all the while are pushed towards a greater level of success.
Tigsource is a forum geared towards people who create.
tigsource will probably not be a good fit for someone who comes here expecting to find someone to make his brilliant idea for him; it'll be a great fit for someone who doesn't know how to make his brilliant idea so he asks how to do it himself.

tigsource is perfect right now.  i honest-to-blog mean it, too.

[Renton]

Everything is fine just the way it is.

I ached to write those in red, but I feared someone would start the Polybius train again and I'd be blamed.

[moi]

DUDE!
This is not my post, don't put words in my mouth okay

My bad.  I've fixed the attribution.

THANKS 

[moi]

Everything is fine just the way it is.

I ached to write those in red, but I feared someone would start the Polybius train again and I'd be blamed.

CHOO CHOOOO

[Movius]

I would throw in a video game reference here. But it might encourage gamers to think they belong on this site about games and we can't have that.

[Corpus]

I believe it would bring along too many gamers and "idea people".

This is not the first time I've heard this sentiment around here, and I'm all for it.  You know games are on their way to being treated as a valid art form when game creators only want to associate with other game creators.

Is this sarcasm?

I don't know if you've noticed, but TIGS is not a place where everyone strives to push games into the arena of the arts. Some people think they're art, and some people don't.

Just have fun. Have fun making games, have fun playing games and have fun talking to other people in the community. Post things that are interesting and that contribute to the forums.

Don't be elitist. Developers, talk to the players. Players, talk to the developers.  People that swing both ways.. you know what to do.

Stop whining. Go with the flow. It's all groovy, baby. Feel the nerd love.

[GregWS]

Stop whining. Go with the flow. It's all groovy, baby. Feel the nerd love.

Sounds good.  I guess I should apologize for starting this (whiny) thread.  I do like what we have going here at TIGS, and I can definitely say I'd never want any big changes; maybe just another layer of sub-forums to better organize the General and Indie Games sub-forums.  I think it would be great if there was a sub-forum for discussions about specific games, instead of these threads being peppered throughout the entirety of the Indie Games sub-forum.

All of this said, I do love TIGS and I think neon's comment helped me to realize what I think TIGS is about (and should be about) too:

Tigsource is a forum geared towards people who create.

[december]

Hey now!  I'm mainly a player of games, and I still feel welcome here.  Though I did start frotzing around in processing because of this place.  It's plenty welcoming for all types.  The only thing that might chase away the people who have an "awesome idea" for a game is seeing what all is involved and how most people here are already involved in their own projects.

[Seth]

I believe it would bring along too many gamers and "idea people".

This is not the first time I've heard this sentiment around here, and I'm all for it.  You know games are on their way to being treated as a valid art form when game creators only want to associate with other game creators.

Is this sarcasm?

Yeah, I'm being sarcastic.  I'm not saying we should push games toward the arts so much as I am saying it'd be sad if this was a place for people like snobby artists who only respect other artists.

[ஒழுக்கின்மை (Paul Eres)]

There are advantages to having a forum just for indie game developers, though. I don't think it's snobbish, or even that TIGSource should focus just on developers, but there's a lot to be said for being able to talk to others who have experience making games, as opposed to a thousand people who don't jumping in and offering their opinion too, which tends to clutter things up with a huge noise to signal ratio.

Which is why I like the Eo community, it's an invite-only community for the best Game Maker developers, and the discussion we have over there are extremely productive compared to the Game Maker Community, because of the higher level of experience and knowledge the people have there. It has nothing to do with elitism at all, it's just very useful to have a place where you can talk to experienced game developers.

[Corpus]

Ah, jolly good, Seth