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[Damian]

Sorry for the bump, but I have a few questions before I go over overboard.
Firstly admiring This mateys concept art I decided to forward the development in that direction, and this morning I was feeling hopeful about the tail...that all changed and so I have this for my new line art.(third try, not finished):



Now as I don't read properly. I miss took Mr nightshades minimum size requirement as the actual total requirement. This explains the small size. So how much bigger must I make it, if at all. should I keep the feet shown in red, which I will explain in more detail in a  sec. And for the IDLE must I incorporate the rifle?, of which I already started blobbing out.

The feet: You see they aren't going to be seen totally and will if I or others do it right look like the end of the tail, but my goal is to recreat it giving it more freedom of movement.

Lastly, I like working on grey backing, I also haven't finished the line art, and is why it looks so...messed up. But this is due to me wanting more of the fans opinions of what should or shouldn't happen at this early stage.

Jim 

[Soulliard]

That size is okay. Liero is a little guy.

Liero doesn't have feet, so they should really be removed. Not all the characters in this game have to be humanoid.

I'd recommend the idle stance to incorporate the rifle. He uses it for virtually all his attacks, so there's no reason for him to put it away.

[Damian]

Thanks for info.
On note of the tail, I will change it, but it won't be to long like that originally posted in the concept. If others like the long tale they, can add it gladly.(I made this concious decisions based on opinion alone)

Rifle added. Asked, as I didn't know what the programmers would like to work with.

[Rostiger]

Jim - nice to see you starting to contribute! I also agree that the feet should probably be dropped completely and the tail could be a bit longer. The size is quite ok - I recommend that you take a bigger character and put them next to each other to get a better comparison of the character size. I think Liero could be about as large as quote - maybe 2px smaller - but should be quite skinny.

Also I agree with Xion that the worm is too 'banded'. If I got him right that means that each segment is too bouncy and should be smoothed out. I'll try to come up with a new concept art by tonight based on Oracle's original version.

Cheers! 

[Soulliard]

The more I think about it, the more I like that size. Indie Brawl doesn't have a lot of small characters planned, and Liero would certainly fit well in that category.

[Rostiger]

Late, but still, here's the promised concept sketch:



The second one is to show the shape of the back body (which is covered by shotty in the first one) - also it would maybe work for the portrait graphic.

[mokesmoe]

I know this is a bit off topic, but is there any way to play Liero on vista?
Even when I try the XP mode it says:

Code:

C:Windows\system32\cmd.exe
This system does not support fullscreen mode. Choose'close' to terminate the application

if I click ignore, it repeats a few times, than closes automaticly.
The level editor has the same result.
The normal mode just crashes.

[Soulliard]

Follow these directions.

[Damian]

Dammit, haven't done anything yet after my last post. Had things to do.. Well expect to see something by the end of the day.

[Soulliard]

So far, I've programmed five attacks: flamer, larpa, super shotgun, chiquita bomb and fan. Programming those last two took ages. 

The results are worth it, though. The chiquita bomb creates an impressive explosion, and the fan knocks back just about everything: projectiles, thrown items and other characters. It's very satisfying to send a spike seed flying right back into Naija's face.

I've also found a pretty cool combo. Throw the chiquita bomb on the ground, and before it explodes, shoot it with the fan into the enemy. If you time it perfectly, you can get a one-hit kill.

[Rostiger]

Yeah Liero's quite a bigshot! 
Would be great to have the first sprite ready though. The green pixel-ish box can be a little confusing during a match. 
Speaking of which, any thoughts on the new Liero concept art?

[JLJac]

I don't really agree on the design. I have always imagined the liero worm to look something like this:



Without segments and without any real head.

[Soulliard]

Kovski, your concept art looks pretty good.

I'm curious to hear your thoughts on Liero's balanced. You said in the Design Doc thread that he was on par with the other characters, which is, frankly, amazing. I'm sure some of his attacks are much better than others, though, so I'd like to hear which attacks you used most.

[Rostiger]

Ah thanks for the input - shouldn't be much of a problem to change him to the looks of that. I'll see if I can come up with a new concept art as sometime..

Concerning Liero's balance, he definitely is VERY strong. You will probably have to tune down the damage a little bit, since so many of his attacks have a high reach or cover a big area. However, Liero's movement incapability really makes up a lot for his firepower superiority.

Most used weapons were probably Super Shotgun, the Larpa and Chiquita Bombs (because of those awesome massive explosions!).

We played a couple of times with Liero, but out of three times he was beaten only about once. When playing with more than two people, Liero's balance issues will probably become more apparent.

[shig]

In a Final Destination style stage Liero's unbalancing should become a lot more apparent.

I'm not sure if he would be completely overpowered or weak, but I doubt he would be balanced in a flat stage.

[godsavant]

I don't really agree on the design. I have always imagined the liero worm to look something like this:



Without segments and without any real head.

Don't rock the boat. 

[Soulliard]

I'm considering these changes for Liero:
-Reduce Super Shotgun damage from 16 to 12.
-Reduce Larpa shrapnel damage from 4 to 3.
-Reduce Doomsday's shots to 4, for a reduction of damage from 18 to 12. The rate of fire would be the same, however.
-Reduce Chiquita banana's damage from 4 to 3.

[Damian]

I'm back...I had a problem with my pc(F$(%*ing Virus!) Well I now have all my things set up and running, and I'm ready to make this and also finish my avatar I was Busy with.

But before I spend time on this, I feel that personal fans to the game don't agree with the concept of the character, so I think this should be revised before I continue..

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I have way to much time on my hands XD

[Rostiger]

Hey Jim, good to see you back! Glad everything's back up and running - hope you got yourself a good anti virus software now, too!

So, here's the new concept art:



I hope everybody is satisfied now. 
I'd say kick out the first pixel version and do all further discussion on the sprite itself.
That way everybody can paint a pixel or two.

[godsavant]

I like Oravle's chunkier version better, but I'll wait till I see this in sprite form before I judge.