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Alec
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« on: August 18, 2007, 09:34:14 AM »

Would someone mind explaining why everyone loves BioShock so much?

I played the demo on 360 the other day. I played up to the point where it felt like another FPS where I was killing zombies in dark corridors.

The opening was very sweet visually, and I love the whole retro look.

But what is everyone so excited about in terms of gameplay?

I'm not trying to be a dick, I'm just honestly curious and I don't want to go sorting through sites like Digg to figure it out. (plus I figure you guys will have a better explanation anyways)
« Last Edit: August 18, 2007, 09:41:35 AM by Alec » Logged

DrDerekDoctors
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« Reply #1 on: August 18, 2007, 09:38:35 AM »

You = Dead Inside. Wink

I love it because it's basically gonna' be System Shock 2 only with much better combat (although gunplay in it still leaves a little to be desired and the constant eve-hypo injections grate a little). It's just a really solid combination of story-telling, atmosphere and emergent gameplay (although so far all the emergent possibilities seem to have been painfully underlined by Ken Levine).
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« Reply #2 on: August 18, 2007, 09:39:46 AM »

You = Dead Inside. Wink

Ah, see that doesn't help.

What are the emergent bits exactly?
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skaldicpoet9
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« Reply #3 on: August 18, 2007, 09:40:44 AM »

Would someone mind explaining why everyone loves BioShock so much?

I played the demo on 360 the other day. I played up to the point where it felt like another FPS where I was killing zombies in dark corridors.

The opening was very sweet visually, and I love the whole retro look.

But what is everyone so excited about in terms of gameplay?

I'm not trying to be a dick, I'm just honestly curious and I don't want to sorting through sites like Digg to figure it out. (plus I figure you guys will have a better explanation anyways)

I guess, at it's core it is another FPS...but the thing that is cool is the way the gameplay is set up....you can use the environment against your enemies...like hacking into computer terminals to alter the gun turret's AI to shoot at your enemies and using the enrage ability to turn your enemies against themselves. They also have some cool tricks like lighting oil slicks on fire to herd enemies....and electrifying water to fry them...you can also reprogram sentry robots to fight for you....

I don't know...it just seems that there is a lot more room for strategic innovations in the gameplay...rather then just running and gunning...
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DrDerekDoctors
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« Reply #4 on: August 18, 2007, 09:43:52 AM »

You = Dead Inside. Wink

Ah, see that doesn't help.

What are the emergent bits exactly?

What he said below me. Only it's above me now.
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« Reply #5 on: August 18, 2007, 09:48:13 AM »

Okay, sounds a bit Deus-Ex-y?

I did enjoy Deus Ex a lot, mostly because of the multiple paths you could take through the levels.
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« Reply #6 on: August 18, 2007, 09:50:14 AM »

Okay, sounds a bit Deus-Ex-y?

I did enjoy Deus Ex a lot, mostly because of the multiple paths you could take through the levels.

Yeah, I was actually going to say that it is very Deus-Exesque....but I think that is a good thing....there haven't been many shooters I liked (well 3D anyways) after playing Deus-Ex....it should be interesting to say the least...I see it as Deus-Ex squared lol...
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« Reply #7 on: August 18, 2007, 09:57:35 AM »

Its definitely a good thing I think.

Part of it is that I wish the levels were more nonlinear. (again, haven't played too far into the demo, so I could be completely wrong) Like I totally loved the environments, but I'd rather do something else in them than kill zombies.

I just find it discouraging that a lot of modern mainstream games have these wonderfully made, imaginative environments, but they're only there as a backdrop for killing the same kind of enemies. For my taste, I'd rather play a game set when that underwater city was still alive and well, and you could spend part of your time/exploring hanging out.

I probably just have weird tastes tho.

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« Reply #8 on: August 18, 2007, 10:04:51 AM »

Deus-Ex-y.... Sexy!
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« Reply #9 on: August 18, 2007, 10:05:21 AM »

Its definitely a good thing I think.

Part of it is that I wish the levels were more nonlinear. (again, haven't played too far into the demo, so I could be completely wrong) Like I totally loved the environments, but I'd rather do something else in them than kill zombies.

I just find it discouraging that a lot of modern mainstream games have these wonderfully made, imaginative environments, but they're only there as a backdrop for killing the same kind of enemies. For my taste, I'd rather play a game set when that underwater city was still alive and well, and you could spend part of your time/exploring hanging out.

I probably just have weird tastes tho.



Nah, I too am about exploration in non-linear environments...unfortunately I haven't got the chance to play the demo yet...but I am hoping that the levels will be not be linear...as far as I have heard the "levels" (apparently the developers are more keen on using the term "thematic area") are designed so that you can freely move between one area and the next without being hemmed into following one set path....

I do like the term "thematic areas" though lol....it doesn't bring to mind a linear map...
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« Reply #10 on: August 18, 2007, 10:06:58 AM »

Sweet. It'd be an awesome game to be able to explore a bit in.
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« Reply #11 on: August 18, 2007, 10:11:13 AM »

Sweet. It'd be an awesome game to be able to explore a bit in.

Yeah the demo was probably linear feeling due to the fact that the other areas were off limits....but I don't know..I guess we'll have to wait and see.....

I am just hopeful that they will be able to take the same conventions that were used in Deus-Ex and modify them so as to allow much more room for improvisation within the  gameplay....one thing I can't stand about shooters is that after awhile it gets really old shooting and dodging (or carrying out mundane tasks like switching on terminals to open doors etc...) a lot of FPS games don't deviate too far from the old Doom mainstays....
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« Reply #12 on: August 18, 2007, 10:14:11 AM »

Bioshock is a shit game. And so was Deus Ex. Ex-tremely overrated.
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Alec
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« Reply #13 on: August 18, 2007, 10:18:17 AM »

Report to the manhugs thread, stat.
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« Reply #14 on: August 18, 2007, 10:23:05 AM »

I'm just disappointed because I thought the city was going to be underwater.

As in, REALLY underwater. None of this "Air" crap. You would be a scuba diver and you would shoot at sharks in apartment buildings.

THis is coming from someone who doesn't have the ability to play it at all, though. Tongue
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« Reply #15 on: August 18, 2007, 11:17:59 AM »

I can't wait. Combing through the dark wreckage of hubris, seeing snippets of people's lives, assembling their ultimate fates from the shrieking sounds left behind on their logs and getting better by becoming more inhuman.

It's a real successor to System Shock 2; all the rough edges are taken right off and replaced by immersion -- none of the old, hokey (but charming) "you're playing a computer game" trappings of the previous titles.

It's a shame that the demo doesn't show off the AI and nonlinear play; it makes the game come off as a boring shooter (albeit one with tons of atmosphere).
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« Reply #16 on: August 18, 2007, 12:04:28 PM »

It's a shame that the demo doesn't show off the AI and nonlinear play; it makes the game come off as a boring shooter (albeit one with tons of atmosphere).

Yuss. The atmosphere really comes across well in the demo. The environments are really amazing. Technology wise, its impressive, but also they picked a style that feels really fresh compared to most shooters.
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« Reply #17 on: August 18, 2007, 12:20:24 PM »

I don't have the ability to play it, but from what I've seen and read about the game, it doesn't seem like it'll have the same depth as Deus Ex, though it will have a lot to do. Then again, I'm not sure any first person game has had the depth of Deus Ex since its creation. Of course, I'm probably wrong.

In Deus Ex you had a lot of ways to beat a level. You could go through it not killing one enemy, using stealth, hacking abilities, greater agility, or just good old running guns'a'blazing, though it wasn't nearly as easy to do so as other FPS's. From what I got out of BioShock, it seems you have to kill everything on sight. You're just given more ways to do so.

Of course, I'm probably wrong.
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« Reply #18 on: August 18, 2007, 01:31:26 PM »

Well, there's still an astounding variety of ways to kill people; today I cracked a security camera and watched the camera call drones in on the splicers who rush me.

The thing with the tutorial level is that it's very linear; during the rest of the game you can travel to and from various hubs, similarly to System Shock 2.

Another thing is that Bioshock isn't Deus Ex; it's a System Shock game, and none of them were ever about finding peaceful solutions to problems. In general, Shock games are also devoid of non-radio contact with live human beings. Bioshock is the high-production-value extent of the Shock series. Sadly, there still isn't one for Deus Ex. Sad

They're about survival, while Deus Ex was more about puzzle solving (and in the case of Invisible War, being completely useless to everyone while the plot buffers you about, with none of your choices influencing anything). In Bioshock, there's only one real major choice to make (but unlike in Deus Ex, the choice is made during gameplay, not arbitrarily at the end).

I sure love the Deus Ex series (they're my favourite games) but the Shock games have so much more to do. They're very similar, but the philosophy is subtly different. I like them both!

What we certainly need less of is plot-less FPSes.
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« Reply #19 on: August 18, 2007, 01:38:57 PM »

Apparently the first area is very linear, the second is less-so and by the time you get to the third it becomes very non-linear. Basically very similar to System Shock 2's structure, really.
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