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[JobLeonard]

We made an intro screen for Rezzed to give a small introduction to the game for the people playing it, we found it to be pretty effective for the people that actually read it.

I think it would have helped a lot if you had made the "control layout" paper the dominant visual element and the text more supportive

[io3 creations]

We made an intro screen for Rezzed to give a small introduction to the game for the people playing it, we found it to be pretty effective for the people that actually read it.

What aspect do you mean by "effective"?  The game controls or preventing frustration due to bugs? 

Perhaps for those that just look at the controls and skip the text, you could add "F12: bug report" to the "controls layout".  Another question about controls: since C and X are used, wouldn't it make more send if WASD was used instead of arrow keys (assuming it wasn't enabled)

Great image!

[and]

OOh, a new desktop for me!

[Juwdah]

I think it would have helped a lot if you had made the "control layout" paper the dominant visual element and the text more supportive

@JobLeonard:
Yeah, what we actually decided is to add a small UI notification at the top with "for controls press f10", that would open the control panel again when pressed.

This way people don't have to go back and forth to the intro of the game to see the controls again.

We made an intro screen for Rezzed to give a small introduction to the game for the people playing it, we found it to be pretty effective for the people that actually read it.

What aspect do you mean by "effective"?  The game controls or preventing frustration due to bugs? 

Perhaps for those that just look at the controls and skip the text, you could add "F12: bug report" to the "controls layout".  Another question about controls: since C and X are used, wouldn't it make more send if WASD was used instead of arrow keys (assuming it wasn't enabled)

@io3 Creations:
Effective meaning that the people that read it knew what to expect going in. We saw many just skipping it and then pondering on how to do some aspects of the game. (which in a way, helps us design UX though)

As well as knowing all the controls. A very interesting observation was that people left-clicked to select and after that left-clicked to do actions. Which was "odd" to us, but made sense afterwards. We think it was mainly the case due to the player only starting with one drifter and thinking it's a third-person game instead of a town-builder.

All in all, we got lots and lots of feedback from it.

WASD was enabled as well as arrow keys, one of the devs snuck it in RIGHT before Rezzed because everyone forgot about it.

[wazeau]

OOh, a new desktop for me!

Oh right, wallpapers!
I noticed there's a blue bar on top of the old image so I updated it, along with a 2560x1440 sized image!
Enjoy 

2560x1440 wallpaper
1920x1080 wallpaper

[and]

Thank you very much, I hadn't noticed that blue bar yet...

[io3 creations]

Effective meaning that the people that read it knew what to expect going in. We saw many just skipping it and then pondering on how to do some aspects of the game. (which in a way, helps us design UX though)

As well as knowing all the controls. A very interesting observation was that people left-clicked to select and after that left-clicked to do actions. Which was "odd" to us, but made sense afterwards. We think it was mainly the case due to the player only starting with one drifter and thinking it's a third-person game instead of a town-builder.

All in all, we got lots and lots of feedback from it.

I wonder, did you ask those who skipped the controls page if they expected controls to be shown step-by-step?
I kind of assumed that you did the single controls page for the event but would later have the "bite sized chunks" tutorial/help approach later on.  That might also resolve those UX issues but either way feedback is the best "reality check". 

WASD was enabled as well as arrow keys, one of the devs snuck it in RIGHT before Rezzed because everyone forgot about it.

FPS controls FTW!   ... and congrats to the dev! 



Oh, this might be a spoiler for others ...  but congrats on the live-action teaser! 




Ironically, in your game world, that would be kind of like Heaven! 

[Juwdah]

Effective meaning that the people that read it knew what to expect going in. We saw many just skipping it and then pondering on how to do some aspects of the game. (which in a way, helps us design UX though)

As well as knowing all the controls. A very interesting observation was that people left-clicked to select and after that left-clicked to do actions. Which was "odd" to us, but made sense afterwards. We think it was mainly the case due to the player only starting with one drifter and thinking it's a third-person game instead of a town-builder.

All in all, we got lots and lots of feedback from it.

I wonder, did you ask those who skipped the controls page if they expected controls to be shown step-by-step?
I kind of assumed that you did the single controls page for the event but would later have the "bite sized chunks" tutorial/help approach later on.  That might also resolve those UX issues but either way feedback is the best "reality check". 

I tried keeping my distance as much as possible, I wanted to see how much the players would try out things themselves as if they were playing it at their home. I feel it's a necessity when seeing people play it. I only came out of the shadows where I was lurking when they were truly stuck or had questions regardless.

Yeah eventually a tutorial will fix some stuff, even though I prefer a game to work without one.

WASD was enabled as well as arrow keys, one of the devs snuck it in RIGHT before Rezzed because everyone forgot about it.

FPS controls FTW!   ... and congrats to the dev! 



Oh, this might be a spoiler for others ...  but congrats on the live-action teaser! 




Ironically, in your game world, that would be kind of like Heaven! 

      THE PROMISED LAND 

Seriously though, that video rocks

[io3 creations]

I tried keeping my distance as much as possible, I wanted to see how much the players would try out things themselves as if they were playing it at their home. I feel it's a necessity when seeing people play it. I only came out of the shadows where I was lurking when they were truly stuck or had questions regardless.

Yeah eventually a tutorial will fix some stuff, even though I prefer a game to work without one.

That reminds me of reading about trying to implement a tutorial system that only tries to help with things that players can't figure out by themselves.  For example, as mentioned above, since WASD and nearby keys tend to be the decault for FPSers, if the player starts playing immediately using those key without having seen any control instuctions, then there is no need to show it.  Though, as you mentioned before when people did try to do something differently than what you expected, in those cases a little help could be especially useful either before or if the player doesn't figure it out for a while.

    THE PROMISED LAND 

Hmmm, not sure if it was mentioned but if the game has a story, will there be a similar "Promised Land" idea?  Or is creating one the player's ultimate goal? 

Seriously though, that video rocks

It sure does!

It was "extra funny" that I immediately thought of your game. :D   Kind of like seeing the Wobbledogs devlog and then seeing the "live action" version of the pug with the life jacket (middle of the post). https://forums.tigsource.com/index.php?topic=53994.msg1319364#msg1319364

[Juwdah]

I tried keeping my distance as much as possible, I wanted to see how much the players would try out things themselves as if they were playing it at their home. I feel it's a necessity when seeing people play it. I only came out of the shadows where I was lurking when they were truly stuck or had questions regardless.

Yeah eventually a tutorial will fix some stuff, even though I prefer a game to work without one.

That reminds me of reading about trying to implement a tutorial system that only tries to help with things that players can't figure out by themselves.  For example, as mentioned above, since WASD and nearby keys tend to be the decault for FPSers, if the player starts playing immediately using those key without having seen any control instuctions, then there is no need to show it.  Though, as you mentioned before when people did try to do something differently than what you expected, in those cases a little help could be especially useful either before or if the player doesn't figure it out for a while.

Yeah, I've seen an influx in recent games doing more and more handholding. It's a tricky balance to get right.
Actually with Rainworld's release right now it's a nice case study as to what people really want to have explained and what target audience you're aiming at as a developer. I personally applaud their approach but I can see it's faults.

    THE PROMISED LAND 

Hmmm, not sure if it was mentioned but if the game has a story, will there be a similar "Promised Land" idea?  Or is creating one the player's ultimate goal? 

We have discussed it, but merely want the story to be "occasionally mentioned" in items you find or Points of Interest you come across. We don't want it to be a goal for the player to work towards.

Seriously though, that video rocks

It sure does!

It was "extra funny" that I immediately thought of your game. :D   Kind of like seeing the Wobbledogs devlog and then seeing the "live action" version of the pug with the life jacket (middle of the post). https://forums.tigsource.com/index.php?topic=53994.msg1319364#msg1319364

I had not seen that devlog in quite some time, thanks for linking it!
And yeah, we actually tried some whale breaching animations this month, it's uncanny how close that video is to our theme :D

[Juwdah]

We have some friends with a 3D-printer, so obviously we had to test some Flotsam stuff with it.

Here's my (WIP) attempt at replicating a boat.

[io3 creations]

At first glance, I thought the boat was papercraft.

Originally, I was thinking along the lines of making sure that people don't quit or stop playing the game because they don't know how to do something essential.  Especially, in the context of (as mentioned above) not looking at basic controls page.

So, as you mentioned, Rain World is an interesting example.  I've looked some reviews and plenty of people complained about the karma system (e.g. getting stuck in a region) and that aspect was already and will be addressed in patches.  Also seen people mention the lack of tutorials (beyong basics) but it's hard to say whether that aspect was as much a a dealbreaker or not and how much it actually limited people in terms of gameplay ~ especially with the target audience in mind.  If there's a tutorial related update in future patches, then that'll give a clue.

[Juwdah]

At first glance, I thought the boat was papercraft.

Originally, I was thinking along the lines of making sure that people don't quit or stop playing the game because they don't know how to do something essential.  Especially, in the context of (as mentioned above) not looking at basic controls page.

So, as you mentioned, Rain World is an interesting example.  I've looked some reviews and plenty of people complained about the karma system (e.g. getting stuck in a region) and that aspect was already and will be addressed in patches.  Also seen people mention the lack of tutorials (beyong basics) but it's hard to say whether that aspect was as much a a dealbreaker or not and how much it actually limited people in terms of gameplay ~ especially with the target audience in mind.  If there's a tutorial related update in future patches, then that'll give a clue.

I wish I was that good at papercraft. (heck, I'd take the challenge if I knew anything about it)

And yeah, I think the key there was target audience, it's a factor to consider on how much handholding you should be doing. The balance is probably struck at the point where the game is explained "just enough" so that people (read: target audience) still discover most of it themselves.

Another example, vastly different though, is how Hearthstone writes it's rules on the cards. It's written down in the most basic manner. (e.g there are different cards taking over creatures but some of them grant "charge" without it being written on the card) This way the player either figures it out after seeing it happen once, or looking it up online. Which is weird when you compare it to older cardgames such as Mtg, where every detail is written on the card.

[io3 creations]

I wish I was that good at papercraft. (heck, I'd take the challenge if I knew anything about it)

I remember years ago 3ds max introducing a feature where it created one of those "cut out, fold and glue" type paper patterns from your 3d model.  Probably there are some constraints regarding what kind of models would work ... but that may be an option.

And yeah, I think the key there was target audience, it's a factor to consider on how much handholding you should be doing. The balance is probably struck at the point where the game is explained "just enough" so that people (read: target audience) still discover most of it themselves.

I just checked out Blender again.  Tried it a few years ago but didn't find it very intuitive.  Now it seemed better to use it with 3ds max like configuration and could figure out some things but it's nice to have tutorials off + online available.  Still, having to look up certain things is not an issue and in a way is expected.

The reviewer at Kotaku also mentioned that not being able to talk to others or look up info online before game release likely contributed to his frustration and that may not be an issue for those that played the games after release and found tips/tricks.  But I still wonder about some of the choices, e.g. (from the Rain World devlog):

Does anybody know how to just drop an item? I wanted to offer pearls to the scavengers but I ended up hitting them instead lol.

To which one of the devs replied:

You can press the pickup button while holding the *down* direction to put down an item without throwing it!

That would seem core mechanic to me.

Another example, vastly different though, is how Hearthstone writes it's rules on the cards. It's written down in the most basic manner. (e.g there are different cards taking over creatures but some of them grant "charge" without it being written on the card) This way the player either figures it out after seeing it happen once, or looking it up online. Which is weird when you compare it to older cardgames such as Mtg, where every detail is written on the card.

Maybe that charge was just a bug.    So, was the charge a consistent card feature or perhaps some cards got could "level up" after a while and that's why those could charge?  That might explain why it wasn't written on it.  But it might have been introduced as a "secret" or RNG feature to add some unpredictability and surprise to the game.

And yeah, we actually tried some whale breaching animations this month, it's uncanny how close that video is to our theme :D

Depending on your release schedule, you could post that video as an April Fool's joke. 

[Juwdah]

I wish I was that good at papercraft. (heck, I'd take the challenge if I knew anything about it)

I remember years ago 3ds max introducing a feature where it created one of those "cut out, fold and glue" type paper patterns from your 3d model.  Probably there are some constraints regarding what kind of models would work ... but that may be an option.

And yeah, I think the key there was target audience, it's a factor to consider on how much handholding you should be doing. The balance is probably struck at the point where the game is explained "just enough" so that people (read: target audience) still discover most of it themselves.

I just checked out Blender again.  Tried it a few years ago but didn't find it very intuitive.  Now it seemed better to use it with 3ds max like configuration and could figure out some things but it's nice to have tutorials off + online available.  Still, having to look up certain things is not an issue and in a way is expected.

The reviewer at Kotaku also mentioned that not being able to talk to others or look up info online before game release likely contributed to his frustration and that may not be an issue for those that played the games after release and found tips/tricks.  But I still wonder about some of the choices, e.g. (from the Rain World devlog):

Does anybody know how to just drop an item? I wanted to offer pearls to the scavengers but I ended up hitting them instead lol.

To which one of the devs replied:

You can press the pickup button while holding the *down* direction to put down an item without throwing it!

That would seem core mechanic to me.

Another example, vastly different though, is how Hearthstone writes it's rules on the cards. It's written down in the most basic manner. (e.g there are different cards taking over creatures but some of them grant "charge" without it being written on the card) This way the player either figures it out after seeing it happen once, or looking it up online. Which is weird when you compare it to older cardgames such as Mtg, where every detail is written on the card.

Maybe that charge was just a bug.    So, was the charge a consistent card feature or perhaps some cards got could "level up" after a while and that's why those could charge?  That might explain why it wasn't written on it.  But it might have been introduced as a "secret" or RNG feature to add some unpredictability and surprise to the game.

And yeah, we actually tried some whale breaching animations this month, it's uncanny how close that video is to our theme :D

Depending on your release schedule, you could post that video as an April Fool's joke. 

Blender is great man, I personally prefer the blender default configuration and shortcuts, and would advise using them due to tutorials always showing those hotkeys. But Wazeau uses the max config and has no problem so it's just a preference really.

About the Hearthstone thing, it's really a choice the developers made to make the card text cleaner and very easy to read fast and understand it. It's the boon of having the game online and not physical (like other card games) and have the computer follow the rules. It's a good decision that blizzard made, I was merely showing it as an example

Good call on the april fools joke, let's hope I remember it.. a year minus 16 days from now.

[io3 creations]

Blender is great man, I personally prefer the blender default configuration and shortcuts, and would advise using them due to tutorials always showing those hotkeys. But Wazeau uses the max config and has no problem so it's just a preference really.

I agree that configuration is mainly a matter of preference.  I checked out a few blender hotkey configuration related topics and saw that there were people who defended the Blender shortcut keys because it makes sense when you become familiar with more features.   Having looked at a number of tutorials, I might not even be using the full 3ds max configuration because most default Blender hotkeys seem to work.  The ones that are different are the W/E/R  to  move/rotate/scale.  Plus, had some "fun time" figuring out how to get the Lasso Select because the LMB/RMB functionality was changed.   But those are the same in Unity and I'm used to them so I'll stick with those for now.  I might change later, but we'll see.

About the Hearthstone thing, it's really a choice the developers made to make the card text cleaner and very easy to read fast and understand it. It's the boon of having the game online and not physical (like other card games) and have the computer follow the rules. It's a good decision that blizzard made, I was merely showing it as an example

Oh, I see.   That's why I prefer chess-like games where winning is a matter of strategy and not RNG or other luck based factors.  I prefer to keep the "exploration" to coming up with strategies to defeat enemies and solve puzzles and not figuring out how to actually play the game.  That may be useful for "less skilled" people to give them a chance at winning ... or for people who like random gameplay (e.g. rogue games) for variety.  The only game I like is Minesweeper, but even that one is more for "meditation/focus" than seeing if I can finish the game. 

Good call on the april fools joke, let's hope I remember it.. a year minus 16 days from now.

Did you know there's a perfect app that just came out last week?  It's called a CALENDAR! 


Guess what!  Blender also has a Paper Model addon.  There are a few simpler shape videos, but this one is really good:



There's a thread on blenderartists.org by the add-on's creator (started in 2010) with some useful trouble shooting tips that issues that people encountered.  The .py link seems to be broken, but I found the script after a little search.  Actually, found two that were only different in a few lines but one of them couldn't be installed.  If interested, I can send you the working one.

Based on your model, I did a quick/simplified boat model test. 

There are a few things that are not "perfect" but for the most part it looks really good.  Textures can also be applied and in the demo video it seemed like that the unwrapping can also be adjusted (useful for tab placement).

If interested in a promotional tool, I could try to use the add-on to create a good looking paper model for one of your boats.  Though probably wouldn't be able to actually make the real paper version it for a while.  As you mentioned, I also prefer digital things due to having moved around.  Maybe if I settle down "soon" then I'll probably do more hands-on hobbies as well. So, you'd need to find another paper hobbyist for that.

[Petty_King]

Too beautiful. I can't wait til I can get my hands on this game.

[xfry]

This game looks awesome and i like a lot the idea to build a city over the sea. Awesome! And really great art.

[Juwdah]

@xfry and Petty_King: Thanks guys! We're doing the best we can .

-*Snip*-


Did you know there's a perfect app that just came out last week?  It's called a CALENDAR!  


Guess what!  Blender also has a Paper Model addon.  There are a few simpler shape videos, but this one is really good:



There's a thread on blenderartists.org by the add-on's creator (started in 2010) with some useful trouble shooting tips that issues that people encountered.  The .py link seems to be broken, but I found the script after a little search.  Actually, found two that were only different in a few lines but one of them couldn't be installed.  If interested, I can send you the working one.

Based on your model, I did a quick/simplified boat model test.  

There are a few things that are not "perfect" but for the most part it looks really good.  Textures can also be applied and in the demo video it seemed like that the unwrapping can also be adjusted (useful for tab placement).

If interested in a promotional tool, I could try to use the add-on to create a good looking paper model for one of your boats.  Though probably wouldn't be able to actually make the real paper version it for a while.  As you mentioned, I also prefer digital things due to having moved around.  Maybe if I settle down "soon" then I'll probably do more hands-on hobbies as well. So, you'd need to find another paper hobbyist for that.

Hey man that's awesome! Thanks for taking your time to conduct that little experiment
I'm definitely going to mess around with it a bit, I hope I can get a boat unwrap that's functional. If not I can try a character which seems easier to get an unwrap with because it's done with lots of different parts.

If I get something to work I'll definitely post the paper unwrap here so you can make it. Or the 3D model.



I've started experimenting with the underwater world today.  
It's going to change the visual feeling of the game a ton so it's going to take a while to get it right.

Here's a simple height mapped terrain (no material) under the water: (with some water shader changes and it's on basic settings atm to test with)



Going to make a better heightmap tomorrow and get some basic material on it.

[io3 creations]

Hey man that's awesome! Thanks for taking your time to conduct that little experiment

You're welcome.  I was also incorporating it into my tutorials for learning how to do a union, modify mesh verticies, etc  so it was two for the price of one!

The Paper Model add-on can export pdf and svg files so even if the unwrap has issues than those can be fixed later.  Currently, the most appearant issue is that tabs (especially on "curved" surfaces with narrow gaps) can overlap with the paper model.  One way might be to separate the mesh faces, but there's an export option to turn tabs off.  Then maybe one model without tabs and full texture and another with mainly the tabs could be exported.  Then in a photo editing software the tabs could be transfered over.  I used to build paper models and now have an even stronger feeling that I'll get back to them in some form so that's why I'm thinking of ways to get it to work.

Here's a simple height mapped terrain (no material) under the water: (with some water shader changes and it's on basic settings atm to test with)

That would actually look good as an icy environment for those that live around on of the poles or the environment is on it's way to become a Snowball Earth