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[Alamantus]

I've been tossing around an idea for an idle game of sorts that involves resource management, recipe discovery, and item sales, but I wanted to add a mechanic to add risk for collecting more valuable resources.

Ok, so if you're still with me after that vague mess of a sentence, here's what the game would actually be: you're an alchemist and every day (real time) you can gather some random resources that grow in your area to create potions (everything from like speed potions to poisons to love potions) that you can either use or sell. Every week the demand for certain potions rise and fall, so you have to be strategic with when to sell your potions to get the best price.

My problem is that I don't know how to utilize the "using your potions" thing, and I don't know how to best go about increasing risk for going deeper into a resource-gathering place to get better ingredients. I'm thinking it should probably be a different gameplay style, but I don't know what exactly... Top-down Zelda-style dungeon crawling? Might be fun, but it wouldn't fit. I envision the whole game as a pretty casual experience, but I'd like resource gathering to optionally take more effort if the player wants to be more active and get better ingredients.

As I was writing this just now, I came up with an idea: you can send your avatar into the resource-gathering places with a limited amount of energy to collect stuff for you, but if you want, you can do timing-based button presses or something like that to get better resources and to use your energy more efficiently. That way you can take potions beforehand to temporarily bolster your excursions...

What do you think? (If you like this kind of game,) Would this be enough to hold your interest?

[starsrift]

What do you think? (If you like this kind of game,) Would this be enough to hold your interest?

Sounds like one of those facebook/mobile games that are designed to bleed money from users with IAPs. You're not gonna find a lot of love for that stuff around here.

[Alamantus]

Sounds like one of those facebook/mobile games that are designed to bleed money from users with IAPs. You're not gonna find a lot of love for that stuff around here.

Ok, this is what this post makes the conversation sound like to me:
Me: "I have this idea, what do you think? What would make it better/worth playing?"
You: "Don't try to steal our money! We don't take kindly to theft around these parts!"

I'm a hobbyist just trying to toss around ideas.

I'm trying to figure out if gameplay like what I described would be engaging enough to even bother making—would anyone feel inclined to play it. Or if not, what would make it more worth playing?

[Chris MacAdam]

Hey I think the game has potential to be cool. I like the idea about it being a game that takes place over time (maybe even when not playing).
For the dungeons maybe a simple RPG battle system could work - even auto battle if you want to keep it real casual.
You can 'explore' an area - Which would give you a random chance to fight an enemy, find ingredients, maybe some area events.
After each turn, you can choose to go back with your loot, or push further.
Maybe the good stuff is so many 'turns' into an area before you have a chance to start getting it.

I agree with the above comment though and please avoid IAPs for dumb stamina and things like that if you want to play for longer than 5 minutes. I don't see where you brought that up though.

[nikwin]

Why have the players utilize the potions at all? I was more interested in a game where I play an alchemist making potions for adventurers to use than a resource gathering mini-game.

[starsrift]

Sounds like one of those facebook/mobile games that are designed to bleed money from users with IAPs. You're not gonna find a lot of love for that stuff around here.

Ok, this is what this post makes the conversation sound like to me:
Me: "I have this idea, what do you think? What would make it better/worth playing?"
You: "Don't try to steal our money! We don't take kindly to theft around these parts!"

You got the reading of my post all wrong. Most TIGgers are almost violently against IAP/Zynga-style stuff, on ethical grounds. I'm not trying to start an argument or comment on the value of your idea - that's literally all that I wanted to convey.

[Alamantus]

Hey I think the game has potential to be cool. I like the idea about it being a game that takes place over time (maybe even when not playing).
For the dungeons maybe a simple RPG battle system could work - even auto battle if you want to keep it real casual.
You can 'explore' an area - Which would give you a random chance to fight an enemy, find ingredients, maybe some area events.
After each turn, you can choose to go back with your loot, or push further.
Maybe the good stuff is so many 'turns' into an area before you have a chance to start getting it.

I agree with the above comment though and please avoid IAPs for dumb stamina and things like that if you want to play for longer than 5 minutes. I don't see where you brought that up though.

Thanks! I thought so, too. My goal is to make a game that I can personally invest time into and feel like I'm getting something out of it. I like the idea of having "turns" where you do an action. A basic RPG battle system sounds like it might be a good idea, but that sounds like it would take a lot of extra monster art that I don't really want to sink into a project like this.  

And yeah, I never have any intention of making IAPs, especially for bs like stamina. I hate that, and in many cases that alone has made me stop playing games when they have it...

Why have the players utilize the potions at all? I was more interested in a game where I play an alchemist making potions for adventurers to use than a resource gathering mini-game.

I like the thought behind this, though! So you're saying just keep it simple, focus on just making the potions and selling them, that's it? I guess I just figured players would want to do more with their time, but maybe if I can figure out how to make making potions and selling them strategically that would be enough?

[Alamantus]

Sounds like one of those facebook/mobile games that are designed to bleed money from users with IAPs. You're not gonna find a lot of love for that stuff around here.

Ok, this is what this post makes the conversation sound like to me:
Me: "I have this idea, what do you think? What would make it better/worth playing?"
You: "Don't try to steal our money! We don't take kindly to theft around these parts!"

You got the reading of my post all wrong. Most TIGgers are almost violently against IAP/Zynga-style stuff, on ethical grounds. I'm not trying to start an argument or comment on the value of your idea - that's literally all that I wanted to convey.

Fair enough. I'm just as violently against Zynga-style stuff, and I'll never abuse anyone who wants to take time out of their day to play my game that way. The way your post was worded made it seem like you were accusing me of trying to make that kind of thing.

I guess I can see how the description could look like that, but I'm looking to make a game that I can play in my spare time that could remain fun and interesting, beyond just clicking things to collect resources. So no, I don't plan on asking for money from anyone, no worries.

[nikwin]

Yeah, I'm saying focus on the one thing. Make potion prices change every day (maybe with associated events as fictional justification) and make different potions use different combinations of the same basic ingredients, and I think you have an interesting potion selling game right there. Give it a little bit of iteration and I'm sure you can come up with something much better.

[Alamantus]

Yeah, I'm saying focus on the one thing. Make potion prices change every day (maybe with associated events as fictional justification) and make different potions use different combinations of the same basic ingredients, and I think you have an interesting potion selling game right there. Give it a little bit of iteration and I'm sure you can come up with something much better.

That's a good idea! Fictional events would make it pretty fun, too, I think. I could set up a supply-demand chain kind of thing, too, so you can't flood the market and keep getting high sale prices... That'd be fun!

What do you think about collecting resources, though? Do you think having a couple renewable/random resources to pick up daily is enough? Or should there be shops where you can spend your (in-game) coins to get more/better ingredients? Probably, because why else would you collect money?

[nikwin]

I'd try them both out and see how they feel. You don't need this to give players a reason to collect money, there are many other things I can see them wanting to spend on, like better alchemical tools for instance.

[valrus]

For the timed button presses, maybe:

• Resources are laid out in a grid-like resource field in meandering chains.  Some resources will have no neighbors of the same type, others will be laid out in a wavy line along with many of the same type.
• Your avatar mindlessly collects each resource and moves on to the one immediately above it.
• If you press a button, your avatar rapidly collects the current resource AND the subsequent resources of the same type in the same chain, moving in order to do so.  So this both collects a few of the same resource at once and moves you to a different place on the screen.  (So you might want to do it even with a so-so chain if it sets you up beneath a valuable resource that you'd otherwise miss.)
• There are limited charges of this ability that refill over time.  So you can do a few at once if you see a sweet path but you can't just spam it to collect things more quickly.
• There are occasionally dangerous things like jagger bushes, poison ivy, porcupines, whatever, in a chain that you would (if you were going slower) be able to avoid, or are in places (like diagonal paths) that you wouldn't go during slow movement, but that if you collect during a rapid dash will put you on your rump temporarily and halt progress.  (So another mechanical reason not to use the dash button mindlessly.)

So anyway, that mechanic has a few good properties, I think: it's optional to interact with the game but can be beneficial, it ties resource collection and movement together, and it's one-button but allows the player some strategic planning. 

[Alamantus]

For the timed button presses, maybe:

• Resources are laid out in a grid-like resource field in meandering chains.  Some resources will have no neighbors of the same type, others will be laid out in a wavy line along with many of the same type.
• Your avatar mindlessly collects each resource and moves on to the one immediately above it.
• If you press a button, your avatar rapidly collects the current resource AND the subsequent resources of the same type in the same chain, moving in order to do so.  So this both collects a few of the same resource at once and moves you to a different place on the screen.  (So you might want to do it even with a so-so chain if it sets you up beneath a valuable resource that you'd otherwise miss.)
• There are limited charges of this ability that refill over time.  So you can do a few at once if you see a sweet path but you can't just spam it to collect things more quickly.
• There are occasionally dangerous things like jagger bushes, poison ivy, porcupines, whatever, in a chain that you would (if you were going slower) be able to avoid, or are in places (like diagonal paths) that you wouldn't go during slow movement, but that if you collect during a rapid dash will put you on your rump temporarily and halt progress.  (So another mechanical reason not to use the dash button mindlessly.)

So anyway, that mechanic has a few good properties, I think: it's optional to interact with the game but can be beneficial, it ties resource collection and movement together, and it's one-button but allows the player some strategic planning. 

This sounds like and interesting idea. I'm having trouble imagining how the player moves across the grid. Does the avatar start at the bottom in the center and there are chains branching off from the center? Would the avatar turn at all?

I like the idea of riding along chains of resources, but I was also thinking of keeping the number of resources lower... This would be good for a different game, but it might be too much for the relaxed idea I have in my head.

[valrus]

Picture a tall thin grid of, say, five squares wide by many squares (perhaps infinitely many squares) high.  (Maybe you bend the track around  visually for variety's sake, but logically it's just a thin path.)

- - - - Y
- - - - -
- - - - O
- X - O -
X - O - -
- X - - -
- - X - -
- - p - -

Your avatar starts in the center and travels "north".  When it comes across a resource, it harvests it in maybe a second or so, then just keeps going north until it finds another resource.  If the player (p) doesn't touch anything, they get an X and an O here.

If they touch the screen while that X is being harvested, they zoom along the wiggly X path and collect four X's, and are now in the second column.  If they wait and touch while the O is being harvested, they zoom along the O path and collect all three O's and end up in the fifth column, and are in a position to collect that Y.  (And maybe that Y is rare and worth having.)

So nothing goes wrong if the player just leaves it idle, but if they interact with the screen there's a bonus: more resources faster, and some ability to affect the balance of resources you're taking in.  (Like in general I might leave it idle and therefore random, but when I'm low on O's and need a bunch for a project, I can pay some more attention and zoom-collect sequences of O's rather than leaving it random.)

[Alamantus]

Picture a tall thin grid of, say, five squares wide by many squares (perhaps infinitely many squares) high.  (Maybe you bend the track around  visually for variety's sake, but logically it's just a thin path.)

- - - - Y
- - - - -
- - - - O
- X - O -
X - O - -
- X - - -
- - X - -
- - p - -

Your avatar starts in the center and travels "north".  When it comes across a resource, it harvests it in maybe a second or so, then just keeps going north until it finds another resource.  If the player (p) doesn't touch anything, they get an X and an O here.

If they touch the screen while that X is being harvested, they zoom along the wiggly X path and collect four X's, and are now in the second column.  If they wait and touch while the O is being harvested, they zoom along the O path and collect all three O's and end up in the fifth column, and are in a position to collect that Y.  (And maybe that Y is rare and worth having.)

So nothing goes wrong if the player just leaves it idle, but if they interact with the screen there's a bonus: more resources faster, and some ability to affect the balance of resources you're taking in.  (Like in general I might leave it idle and therefore random, but when I'm low on O's and need a bunch for a project, I can pay some more attention and zoom-collect sequences of O's rather than leaving it random.)

Ahh, okay, I get it now. Thanks for explaining! Now that I understand it, that does sound like a good way to handle the resource gathering! Very cool! Have you seen this used before in (an)other game(s), or did you just think of this? If it's used somewhere else, I'd like to research it a bit.

[valrus]

Nope, I think it's novel.  (The only game I was thinking about was SameGame, like how you can both speed up gathering stuff and make it a little more strategic by automatically gathering adjacent identical items.)

[Alamantus]

Nope, I think it's novel.  (The only game I was thinking about was SameGame, like how you can both speed up gathering stuff and make it a little more strategic by automatically gathering adjacent identical items.)

That's awesome! Well thanks for sharing it! I like the idea a lot!