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[Guert]

Zaphos makes some excellent points.  +10 Marketing skills 

[ஒழுக்கின்மை (Paul Eres)]

The point isn't whether or not it should be allowed (I think allowing it is fine), the point is that people are saying the game deserves it and that they agree with the decision without having played it. That makes little sense to me, you shouldn't judge a game as great before you play it, just like you shouldn't judge a game as bad until you play it.

[Ivan]

Congratulations to Erik and Blueberry Garden, that game really deserves it

How do you know? (I'm not asking to be a jerk, by the way--I genuinely want to know how you know it deserves to win, given that the game hasn't been released yet.)

I've played it at No More Sweden, and I have a beta build on my computer.

[ஒழுக்கின்மை (Paul Eres)]

What, must have missed that.

Anyway, for people who have played the game, what's it like? The trailer doesn't really explain the gameplay very well.

[Soulliard]

I'm watching the reward show now. Was anyone else bothered by the Pocketwatch guy constantly saying how indie and mainstream must unite?

I can't think of anything worse than indies being swallowed by the mainstream.

[ஒழுக்கின்மை (Paul Eres)]

I'm watching the reward show now. Was anyone else bothered by the Pocketwatch guy constantly saying how indie and mainstream must unite?

I can't think of anything worse than indies being swallowed by the mainstream.

Sure there is: indies being swallowed by the casual shareware industry.

[Hideous]

What, must have missed that.

Anyway, for people who have played the game, what's it like? The trailer doesn't really explain the gameplay very well.

I don't even know if I'm allowed to say anything. I can say that it requires a relatively good computer, in any case.

[moi]

rewarding unreleased games = the people doesn't care about this elitist autocongratulation mainstream-in-disguise show
"Indie" has become the most ridiculous term ever used in videogaming nowadays
This decade will be laughed at...

[Peevish]

"Indie" has become the most ridiculous term ever used in videogaming nowadays
This decade will be laughed at...

Don't be nonsensical. Maybe none of us are sure where "indie" stops being indie and becomes mainstream, but we are all positive that people coding games for no money in their bedrooms are independent developers. People need to look to the black and white on either end of the grey area.

[moi]

I didn't talk about "independant devellopers", but "indie" and all the decorum that goes on at these shows.

[PGGB]

I didn't talk about "independant devellopers", but "indie" and all the decorum that goes on at these shows.

Even looking now back at it I think that most of us would not have used that term but we are at a point now where you can't go back and choose another one. Well it's the same with Indie music.

[konjak]

I can't think of anything worse than indies being swallowed by the mainstream.

It's like the "mainstream" never did anything good around here. 

Do you really not want to see the uniquely independent games BECOME more mainstream (by the definition of the word, not implications of FPS games and Madden).

[Guert]

IGF helps, promotes and rewards those who dare develop game son their own, including all the risks that it includes. Financial, personal and "triceratop mutated in crocodile" related. If the IGF were to promote only game sthat are released, they would not help them much, only reward and promote a bit. I do think that anyone who participates in the main event should release a demo, simply to be respectful toward the players. But a good demo only. Not the full game or something. Just a little something to help all the players, whatever your interest in gaming is, get an idea of what your game is bringing to this world. My opinion.

Indie is a buzz word in the industry for the past 2 years. Get used to it. Whatever term that gets attention from the media will become a buzz word. That's how it goes. And perosnaly I don't mind if the indie and the mainstream get merged together.

A) it'll bring more people to gaming.

B) It'll be easier for indies to create game since they will be able to get more financial support, may it be angel money, rewards or just a loan from the bank.

C) Players will play more indie games since access to them will be easier  

D) A good game is a good game, call it indie, commercial or martian. What matters in the end is the game in itself. You guys know what it feels like to play a goddamn good game. Indie or commercial. It doens't taste the same at all. You'll still get that feel from both but there is a lot more chances that more players encourages the creators.

E) Can you imagine walking into a gamestop or whatever and, instead of going for the PS3 section, you go for the Action section? Or the Drama section? A place where you can get a boxed version of God of War 10 and Passage? That would be, in my opinion, awesome.

I feel like the industry in general has a lot to learn by starting to accept all types of developers. The industry is evolving, its time to go forward and adapt to our current and futur context. This ain't the 80's-90's anymore. Let's work together.

... I must say that I feel too that the word "indie" is tossed around alot lately. Which is bad since in most case, it doesn't mean anything.

My two cents.

[ஒழுக்கின்மை (Paul Eres)]

But Guert, remember that you do come from the mainstream industry, so you may have biases toward that. You seem to focus on all the positives of the two merging, while mentioning none of the possible negatives. What bad things do you think may happen if the two are merged? I can think of many, but I'm wondering if you have thought of any.

[deadeye]

Do you really not want to see the uniquely independent games BECOME more mainstream (by the definition of the word, not implications of FPS games and Madden).

It's the principal of the matter

The more people that like a thing, the less cool it is!  I wouldn't be caught dead liking something uncool, so please for the luvva god leave my indie alooone

[ஒழுக்கின்மை (Paul Eres)]

You guys know that nobody said they wanted indie games to stay obscure or become more obscure, that's kind of obvious.

[mirosurabu]

What does merging indie with mainstream actually mean? I'm confused.

[Adamski]

This thread is getting too deep for me 

[ஒழுக்கின்மை (Paul Eres)]

I didn't see the specific talk in question. But according to people who described it, Andy Schatz (of pocketwatch games, he made venture arctic etc.) was the speaker and he wanted indie games and the AAA games industry to unite. How specifically he wanted to do that, I don't know. But as Michael in the Tale of Tales blog said after seeing that presentation, it seems like the mainstream games industry have more to gain from that relationship than indie game developers do.

Guert mentioned the idea of mainstream games funding indie games, which is particularly troubling to me because with funding comes creative control. Nobody is going to give an indie a million dollars to make a game, no questions asked. They're going to want them to make the game in a specific way if they do that. Plus, if you create a game that's funded by someone else, they usually own the IP, not you. So I think the idea of the mainstream games industry funding and publishing and owning the rights to indie games is kind of an oxymoron: the reason they're called indie games is, in part, that they're not funded by the mainstream games industry. If you make games for a mainstream industry publisher, and they pay you to do it, and they have creative control over the game, and they own the IP, how would that make you different from a mainstream game development team? That'd be one way to merge them, although that's less a partnership and more a takeover.

As was mentioned in another thread, I don't think indie games are just like a kid brother to the mainstream games industry, it's a distinct industry, with its own business practices, culture, priorities, tastes, etc. -- merging the two makes about as much sense to me as merging webcomics and Marvel/DC.

[gunswordfist]

The list of winners was superb! I was glad to see Night Game, Zeno Clash and Cortex Command listed/win prizes.