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Inanimate
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« Reply #60 on: October 04, 2009, 01:33:34 PM »

Wildwards, definitely.
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Alex May
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« Reply #61 on: October 04, 2009, 02:23:22 PM »

I want to shelter under a tree. That was one of my favourite things in S.T.A.L.K.E.R., hiding in a bus stop and waiting for the rain to pass. Brilliant. Very evocative screenshots too, I can just feel it. Great!
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DrDerekDoctors
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« Reply #62 on: October 05, 2009, 07:14:53 AM »

I love that you can see the canopy of the tree poking into the top of the view as you hide under it from the rain. Can you make the rain more blustry and windy at all and maybe shake the tree canopies in the process for storms? Smiley
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« Reply #63 on: October 05, 2009, 10:18:35 AM »

@Inanimate - vote registered Grin

@Alex - Bus stops and rain are a classic combo!

Did the rain have an effect in STALKER? I can't remember...

@DrDerek - Yeah definitely planning on doing that stuff, depending on how it works in practice. I think there'll be a variation of conditions so that sometimes it's blustery and sometimes calm. Windy conditions will of course make sheltering more challenging as the rain will blow in under the tree...

I need to define the survival mechanics properly too, since I'm not exactly sure where this part is headed.
« Last Edit: October 05, 2009, 10:53:47 AM by Ed » Logged

Xion
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« Reply #64 on: October 05, 2009, 10:33:48 AM »

I, too, vote Wildwards.
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Ed
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« Reply #65 on: October 05, 2009, 10:59:27 AM »

Thanks Smiley I should say it's not just between those two options, but Wildwards is starting to feel more like a real name....
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« Reply #66 on: October 05, 2009, 11:24:16 AM »

I think the survival mechanics should be pretty simple, because the player can only have so many elements in his mind or it will just get confusing. Maybe it would be a good idea to state a short list of things that can kill you, and then try to sort all the dangerous stuff into one of those categorys. Like:

Mechanical damage(of course)
Tempereature(Too cold and too hot will kill you)
Starvation(you must eat to survive)
Not being able to breath

Then you simplify things a bit, for example is drinking counted into the same thing as eating, and you don't really separate being set on fire from being overheated in a desert, both are temperature kills. Rain makes you cold, and in combination with other things that makes you cold it could be dangerous. When the "foodInStomach"-variable is low or when you are under water one of the four warning icons show up in the corner of the screen, so you know what you're dying from.
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Ed
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« Reply #67 on: October 05, 2009, 02:31:40 PM »

Yeah man, absolutely. Needs to be as simple as possible but still convey the feeling of how it might be in that situation. This would fit with the graphical direction too. I was thinking that rain would be a kind of modifier to the cold variable, but that does seem unnecessarily subtle.

I would like to keep drinking separate from eating. Eating/drinking seems like it would be most prone to "exploits", e.g. surviving just on water.

I'll make a chart of the variables and what affects them, and what happens when they're low...

Maybe it will be possible to hide some complexity by only showing problems when near to "bad" states, so if you're not in a difficult situation and act fairly sensibly (eat/drink/sleep/make a fire), most of this stuff doesn't show up.

Also it just occurred to me that maybe standing in the rain looking upward could count as (slowly) drinking. Might be pretty dramatic if you've been stuck without water for ages.  Smiley
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« Reply #68 on: October 05, 2009, 09:41:07 PM »

Yeah, that's what I thought about the warning icons. When something is bad they show up to tell you what's up.

Keeping drinking separate from eating is a good idea. Another interesting(not necessarily good) option to consider is having water and temeperature in the same meter. Hot places makes this meter go up, cold places and drinking makes it go down. If it's too high or too low it's lethal. Being in rain and drinking is the same thing, if you drink a lot when it's cold you will get even cooler. Problem is that you would never be thirsty in a cold places Wink
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Alex May
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« Reply #69 on: October 06, 2009, 02:18:41 AM »

Yeah man, absolutely. Needs to be as simple as possible but still convey the feeling of how it might be in that situation. This would fit with the graphical direction too. I was thinking that rain would be a kind of modifier to the cold variable, but that does seem unnecessarily subtle.

I would like to keep drinking separate from eating. Eating/drinking seems like it would be most prone to "exploits", e.g. surviving just on water.

Eating can provide water though, e.g. polar bears get most of their water from the food they eat.

I'll make a chart of the variables and what affects them, and what happens when they're low...

Maybe it will be possible to hide some complexity by only showing problems when near to "bad" states, so if you're not in a difficult situation and act fairly sensibly (eat/drink/sleep/make a fire), most of this stuff doesn't show up.
Fuzzy logic?
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Ed
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« Reply #70 on: October 06, 2009, 02:34:11 AM »

Quote
Eating can provide water though, e.g. polar bears get most of their water from the food they eat.
Sure, each item of food will provide X amount of "nourishment" and Y amount of water. Cucumber bush = useful Smiley

Quote
Fuzzy logic?
I was just going to make something up Grin
Something like each value goes between 0-100 and below 50 you get a warning, and below 25 there's a chance of something bad happening, like stumbling or passing out. I guess this is a limited kind of fuzzy logic (IIRC)

Did you have something in mind?
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elib
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« Reply #71 on: October 11, 2009, 05:55:47 AM »

This project looks amazing! Totally digging the "painter" style generation. One of those screenshots looking down onto the trees near the village and clearings is seriously beautiful and evocative. Excellent style.

And Miyazaki game mechanics?? It's like a dream.
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Ed
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« Reply #72 on: October 11, 2009, 01:47:08 PM »

Thanks, it's been almost literally giving me headaches this weekend.

I've been messing about putting a load more biomes in, which mostly just means more badly drawn flowers and wonky trees. The tree code needs some work to allow more variation of the shape of the canopy and of the size/height of the whole tree.

I've also been doing some work on the survival stuff. Now you can stand in the rain and get cold:

(The "HUD" is just debug, but those are my choice of core stats, working in the way described in the previous post. There may be other ones that play a temporary role.)

I did some setting up for the planned "non realistic" lighting system although mostly all it did was break stuff. Apart from anything else I might need to replace the terrain renderer as it doesn't seem to be possible to mess with the vertex colours in the way I'd like to. (This is because the vertex density is adaptive based on the contours of the terrain)

Toyed with the idea of placing biomes differently, i.e. not in the underlying region system but based on conditions at each tile. Decided this was a bit of a dangerous road to go down for now.

---

For anyone interested, a while back I posted a rough summary of the terrain generation method here
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LeFishy
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« Reply #73 on: October 11, 2009, 04:36:50 PM »

Oh wow I am totally going to try to use that terrain generation systemy type thing you described. That is super cool.

Please release something moving again soon. Watching the videos is just infinitely cool. I am a huge lover of procedurally generated stuff so this makes me so very happy... in the pants.
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Ed
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« Reply #74 on: October 12, 2009, 01:29:28 PM »

Good luck! OK, so now I have some motivation to finish implementing the system before you :D

I'll make another video when there is something nice to see... maybe day/night cycle or something? I'd make another public build, but I think instead I'll wait til I have something I need some first impressions of and then request guinea pigs. I think I read this in someone's development lecture once.

I can't release anything anyway right now as it's in a bit of mess... need to revert some failed experiments Smiley
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Ivan
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alright, let's see what we can see


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« Reply #75 on: February 10, 2010, 03:09:20 PM »

What happened to this?
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« Reply #76 on: February 10, 2010, 06:37:59 PM »

Really I loved the demo.
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Ed
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« Reply #77 on: February 11, 2010, 01:19:45 AM »

What happened to this?

Well.... The good news is that it's definitely not abandoned. I haven't run out of motivation or inspiration or any other of the ations... except maybe articulation.
The bad news is that I have a recurring wrist injury which means I've hardly got anything done in the past 6 months or so. Anyway hopefully it'll be fixed soon.

The general plan is to get it into the shape of a reasonably compelling exploration game and release that. I have a few ideas for iterations after that, for example being able to nurture the world in some way or having an infinite fixed-seed archipelago to explore. I'm being very strict in not letting it mushroom into some infinite-scope Elder Scrolls game or something like that.

Here's a little morsel: the current tasklist hanging on my wall. NB Not the tasklist for the first releasable version. Have fun trying to read my writing!

Thanks for asking Smiley
I might try and scrape together a new build or something else before too long
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« Reply #78 on: February 12, 2010, 03:28:39 PM »

I'm excited for this, too.  Grin
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« Reply #79 on: February 12, 2010, 07:51:05 PM »

The terrain reminds me of Daggerfall.
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